Bear KH cracked limb tip: Please advise??

[greenbear]

Hey 'gang

I have 197X Bear Kodiak Hunter that has a small crack (cotton ball gets stuck) in the lower limb tip.  It looks like it runs down the grain on the wood lam from the right notch (in pics) down to the green glass.  It like to fix it to make it safe and usable, as I'm not a big wall hanger kind of guy.  

I read that CA could work to fill in cracks, but don't know if that is only useful on the limbs, where the forces are spread over a much larger area.  I also read that I could drill a hole to keep it from running farther, but don' know if this would apply since it looks (to me) that the wood limb tip is independent of the green glass? If glue alone is not recommended, could I sand off the wood area (looks like it follows a grain line) and replace with a phenolic block?  If I do, should this be done to both sides?  

I posted pics below, but it's hard to see the crack-- as stated above, it runs from the right notch and follows the grain line to the green glass.  Thanks for any advice and suggestions you can lend.

 

 

[Trux Turning]

From the picture it looks like it is just in the tip overlay- wick some thin superglue into the crack and you should be good to go- lots of folks recommend loctite 420 as a good glue

[macbow]

Totally agree with Trux. May take a couple of applications to get it filled in then some sanding with real light sand paper.

[PrimitiveSniper66]

sand it off put a new tip on , get a new bow string, make sure it's b50 or b55 , the only way you can use fast flight on that bow is if the loops are padded out . A guy brought me 2 bows to fix that look like yours but cracked down both sides from fast flight strings, yours is a easy fix, make sure you have the right string. Curt

[LittleBen]

x2 what Curt said. Looks just like vintage bow after I put on a flemish twist 8125string.

You could probably get away with putting some superglue in there. I'd do several applications as mentioned until it's totally filled, then sand lightly to smooth.

On my bow where I had this problem (it was a similar but more severe crack) I sanded off the tip overlays down to glass (or as close as you can get comfortably) make sure you don't cut into the glass, and it you leave a bit of the old overlay, just make sure you ahve a flat gluing surface.

Then glue on phenolic 1/8" thick or so, 2 layers if you need/want and shape them up with a sander/file/your teeth/whatever you like. Phenolic is so much harder than maple or actionwood it's ridiculous, and it doesn't tend to split along the grain which is most important.

I did this on two vintage York recurves of hunting weight, and they are both now shooting happily with FF strings (one with a very skinny cheese wire size string) without any signs of problems.

[greenbear]

Awesome- Thanks everyone.  

I did just look at it again, and it looks like the overlay only- the green glass underneath looks okay.  The crack is along a grain line on the overlay. I'll give the CA a go first (have the first application curing now) and order up some phenolic from the web.  If the CA doesn't do the trick- I'll have the layers to mess around with in the future.  

A follow-up question for the CA: Do you let each layer fully cure (24h) or dry just enough to add the next layer?

Thanks for the advice.  It's not my primary bow, but I'd like to be able to use it now and again as it was my dad's bow.  

Best-

[LittleBen]

I don't think it matters with CA glue as long as you let it fully cure after the final application.

CA crosslinks into long polymer chains in the presence of water and weak bases, I think if you add liquid CA to a piece of cured CA, it will still crosslink into essentially one piece. Shouldn;t matter at all.

I'd just keep squirting it in there as soon as the previous application is thickening up, so that you don't have to spend to much time staring at it ... then just give it 24hrs to cure.

[greenbear]

Thanks, again.  I have a few runs of CA along the crack-coerced it in there with a matchbook flap and am now letting it dry for the recommended 24 hours.  

I previously had B50 strings made up for it (have a backup too), so should be good to go.  I have 600 grit paper I'll get the extra off with tomorrow and give it a try.  I'll listen for cracks and pops and if so, I'll sand to the glass and get the phenolic to glue over top.

I do appreciate the advice.  It's something I put off for a good two years and the unstrung bow has been sitting on the rack.  I have some time this and next week and thought I should at least try to take care of it.  I have been looking at purchasing a TD recurve, and figured why not take care of the gear I have...

Happy New Year everyone.  I'll post an update on how it works out- figure someone down the line may find the information useful.

[greenbear]

Hi everyone.  I again seek your advice regarding this post.  The superglue seemed to hold for a little while, but finally gave way today.  I took it outside and noticed that it sounded "twangier".  Sure enough, the crack was deeper and it looked like the outer third of the tip started to be coming off the glass entirely.

I immediately stopped shooting and brought it inside to take the (B50) string off the bow.  I started to pick at the piece with my thumbnail and it came right off.  It appears to be a clean shear off of the glass, with only a bit of wood pulp and adhesive remaining.  

Good news is that I ordered two "units" phenolic and the recommended glue from 3RA back in December when I originally sought your advice, and it now looks like I will have to put it in service.  It is the black and red squares and the "blue glue".

I'm hoping you can once again help me get Dad's bow back to form.  Here goes: What is the "best" way to remove the remainder of the limb tip?  I'm sure that sandpaper is the safest, but also have a stanley surform, some chisels and files, and of course, a Dremel and DeWalt power sander.  I figure I should stay away from the plug-in tools and go slow....  

When I finish removing the wood tip to the glass, I intend to wipe down with alcohol and let evaporate.  Then I glue the phenolic to the limb (easy does it, or goop away?), then when dry begin to shape?  Once it is shaped, do I put a coating of "something" over top?  While I am at this, should I do the top tip as well, or leave it be until it shows signs of fatigue?

Thanks for reading and perhaps lending your advice.  I'm all for diving in, but always like to know how deep the bottom is before I jump  

Best

[kennym]

I've removed some phenolic tips with power tools at first and finished with a coarse file(not rasp)

Then sand with coarse sandpaper, after putting a couple layers of masking tape on the limb below where the tip goes. Make sure the glass and phenolic pieces are roughed up to bond , I use 40 - 60 grit paper. Fit the phenolic to the limb(if needed, 1/16 thick will probably conform)) , glue and clamp for a generous time.

Then shape, sand smooth , and spray with exterior poly or spar urethane.  Pull tape and shoot...

Be sure to fine sand the nock grooves before finish so it doesn't wear the string prematurely.

You might do one end at a time so you can look at the original if you need to, but I would just go on and do both.

Pics are good as you go!!    :D