Selfbow Accuracy

[Matt Fowler]

Thinking about getting started on my 2nd selfbow. I got impatient with the 1st one and it came in way light, about 33#. It also developed a set in one limb. The tillering and profile leave a lot to be desired if ya know what I mean    Anyhow, I want to be able to hunt with the next one. How perfect does the tillering need to be? Does it affect accuracy? What other factors can affect accuracy? My 1st bow seems to shoot fine, it just looks bad and is light. Thanks in advance.

[George Tsoukalas]

Tillering is what bow making is all about but it is more than the visual tiller you get with your eyes.
My first hunter was no great shakes LOL.
It gets better.
It is about how the bow feels in your hand as your draw.
This is a hard question to answer in a post on the internet.
There are lots of books to consult... Paul Comstock's the Bent Stick ... the Bowyer's Bibles.
Also, check my site.
 http://georgeandjoni.home.comcast.net/~georgeandjoni/index.html

Jawge

[Pat B]

In the case of selfbows, looks don't necessarily matter. I've seen some pretty poorly tillered selfbows that have killed deer.
 You have time to make a hunt worthy selfbow between now and hunting season. It might be your next bow or the one after that but if you truly want to build and hunt with a selfbow next year you can and will.
  The accuracy of a selfbows is primarily in the shooter. Make arrows that are properly spined for the bow and practice, practice, practice!

[Black Mockingbird]

Yes I agree with pat.....BUT there is design considerations and such that will aid and help ease the learning curve,and lessen the inconsistent human error element in being able to shoot a self bow well...might take a small book to explain it all tho...but in short make a bow as long as possible for its draw length and its intended uses...a longer bow will help promote greater accuracy.<----- and that last sentence is a BIG period.....others include smoothness of draw and ease of holding at full draw...string angle can also slightly affect accuracy...draw weight,and keep it mid forties if wanting to hunt with it...a mid forties bow that's designed and tillered well will kill no problems...cut in a shelf to create a more close to center shot bow...keep the string tracking perfect down center thru out the while bow...keep the outer thirds of your limbs as narrow as the design and wood allows....cast,a bow with above average cast will be flatter shooting and allow better accuracy,and that's attained by design and tiller..which is the two most important facets of bowmaking that go hand in hand with each in correlation.....and I can go on n on etc etc....lots to learn in making and shooting great bows    it takes time and dedication to get there...

[Pat B]

Arrows properly spined for the bow and the shooter will be more important in the accuracy of your bow than the bow.

[4est trekker]

X10 for what Pat said!

[Black Mockingbird]

I'm feeling spicy today pat... lol          

So let's test that theory out to the extreme...let's take two bows with the same draw weight and draw length,and both maintain a straight side profile,and both have properly sound arrows to match...let's make the first bow 44" long,2" wide at the handle and the width runs parallel full width to the tips,jack up the tiller with a subtle hinge or two,and one that has one limb way stiffer than the other causing an unbalance when drawn....now let's make the second bow a perfectly masterly crafted 76" longbow with a center cut shelf    ...now let's take the 44" bow and practice practice practice...now either your gonna lose your teeth either to the hand shock,or from old age cus it took ya 50+ years to master shooting it...lol...now let's test the two together at twenty plus yard shots with minimal practice with the 76" bow....which bow are you gonna prefer to shoot and why,and which is gonna be a better shooting bow?

I went thru a short bow phase and learned n spent lots of time becoming a decent enough shot with them,but even after all that and a well made bow I can still shoot a longer bow better,and even if were only shooting them ten yards away...to me and imho there is enough of a difference in shooting accuracy due to design and tiller alone,and it can affect it enough to the point to give it serious consideration when making bows..and especially when hitting the mark is the whole point when shooting any type archery...so why not do all you can to help your self and give your self the best case scenario to make the shot...

My example is a lopsided extreme example,but I have seen folks make bows close to that,and its just to clearly show there is enough of a difference to give design and tiller consideration when making and shooting a bow IMHO....  

[Pat B]

Are you taking into consideration the arrow being spined for the extra wide handle? If so it should shoot fine. Once you learn the trajectory of your arrow flight you should be able to shoot it well enough to hunt with.  I've shot over built bows with wide tips that had very little hand shock. The Eastern Woodland style bows the Cherokee shot were 1 1/4" wide with a slight taper to 3/4" tips. They bent through the handle, all of which should make for a shocky bow but that is not necessarily true if the bow is well built.  
  It took me a long time to be able to shoot the shorter recurves I have built. They are less stable in the hand than longer bows and less forgiving. I shoot them pretty well now after a few years but I can go pick up one of my longer bows and out shoot myself with the shorter one. Longer bows are just more stable and more forgiving. You don't see a sniper using a short, light weight rifle. They like them longer and heavier.
 So, getting back to Matt's original question...I think the shooter and a properly spined arrows are more important than the bow.

[LittleBen]

I tend to agree with the arrow spine and technique mattering the most. I'm not ging to say the bow doesn;t matter ... it does, but arrow spine is absolutely critical as is release.

[RAU]

I think archer and arrow are most important but You need to design and build for durability.I've made some hideous self bows that if they held together long enough to find arrows that match and practice I know would have blown thru a deer at short hunting ranges.  My 1st self bow is a perfect example. I made it from birch cause it was straight and handy I hogged it out with knife and sure form plane and sorta tillerd it and put short string on it. . I was chomping at the bit to shoot this thing! I went out back with the nearest arrow I could find which was a cedar arrow with dull broadhead.  I yelled to the wife to come out back and watch this. She did. I then proceeded the fire that sucker right over the target and into plywood shed. The broadhead almost blew thru! I was in awe! I needed vice grips and a pry bar to get that broadhead out! Wife wasn't that impressed.  What I'm saying is that  bow was the most poorly tillered, primitive, ugly, trash wood bow possibly ever made that developed the worst belly compression failure you ever saw after just a few dozen shots but I know that if it held up long enough to practice with it and find arrows for it would have put an arrow right thru a deer at normal traditional archery ranges.

[Sockrsblur]

Never having made a bow yet I love reading here. That was an awesome question and great answers    

[Roy from Pa]

Agree with the arrows but also agree with Blackbird that a longer bow is easy shooting and more accurate.

[Pat B]

Does archery refer to the shape of the braced bow or the trajectory of the arrow? A little food for thought.

[Brock]

I think it is the arc of the arrow in flight.....  

[KenH]

I don't believe tillering, per se, has anything to do with accuracy.  Lots of people over the ages have killed lots of game with a trimmed, de-barked, tapered stick and a bit of "string"

Tillering does have to do with the bow's efficiency to transfer energy from the bow to the string to the arrow.

[fujimo]

yes, efficiency and longevity.
if your bow is bad- its the same kinda bad for every shot- not much is changing. the variance comes in the construction of the arrows.
i spend a lot of time matching my arrows!!.

my problems are a consistent draw and release- i think most of us are more or less in the same boat- otherwise we would be able to put every arrow thru the same hole!!

i do believe some bows make it easier to draw smoothly and also help with a better release.

so nowadays i am getting into focusing on my limb timing, as i like to shoot bend thru the handle bows- and as it is they have the potential to be a little 'shockey'.

just what i think- but a whole bunch more experience on this site than i could ever learn in 10 lifetimes.

[GentlemanArcher]

I'll jump in...(my take only, mileage may vary) If the shooter does everything exactly the same and the arrows are all exactly the same, the group of arrows will land home in a small group.  Once you have a consistent grouping, adjusting your aiming point will let you be accurate.

I would think a bow design that helps make it easy for the shooter to be repeatable would be more important than the tiller of the bow.  I would go with a locator style grip (or even high wrist. And a bow design that allows for a high brace height to be a little more forgiving of errors during the release.

GA

[Matt Fowler]

Thanks for the replies. This has been a confidence booster.

[KellyG]

The best answer I can give is my first bow I made killed the deer in my avatar. It was not perfect by no means. But at 20yrds I could hit in a paper plate and ensured My shots were under that. Heck missed 2 other deer with it that day.

If you think I had a perfect tiller think agian. It did pull 45-50#. Good luck hand have fun.