Miller Sage/Schultz Natural ??????

[longrifle]

I would like to build a american longbow like one of these two styles using only Bamboo as a backing no glass, any help on slat thickness would help from those who have gone before me. Looking to end up at 66" long and 55 lbs@ 27".
Thanks

[LittleBen]

Are you planning on all bamboo? As in bamboo for the core and belly too?

In order to determine the limb thickness, you'll need to know the limb width, and to make a good choice on limb width, you'll need some idea of what the belly wood is.

Bamboo backing should be made fairly thin, 1/8" or so, many people also taper it towards the tips, so maybe 1/16" at the tips. I don't think the precise thickness is critical.

For the core and belly laminations, something like Ipe can be made very narrow and suprisingly thin. Hard to say exactly, maybe 1" wide and 1/2" thick.
Something like Osage can also be pretty narrow, but will need to be thicker to hit the same weight.
Yew could also be pretty narrow, but would also need to be hacker again than Osage.

If you're going bamboo throughout, probably wanna go a tad wider than that, and I'd venture to guess its gonna need to be at least half an inch thick plus 1/8" backing, so 5/8" total.

You can always scrape the belly down if you need to. Easier to scrape the belly than add a lamination later.

I think there's also quite a bit of reflex glued into those.

Lastly I will say I shot one of the Miller longbows, it was all bamboo, and the performance was nothing to write home about. I mean it was nice, but not entirely my. Cup of tea.

[longrifle]

Ben I have some Osage and Ipe as well. I want the bow to be 1 to 1 1/8" wide and 1/2 to 3/8" at the tips. I have made several glass Hill style bows befor and was wondering if I used the same overall stack thickness would I be OK. Also do people put other woods in the core as well, then the thicker belly core??

[LittleBen]

If you use the stack thickness from a glass hill, it will end up a fraction of the draw weight of the glass bow. The miller I shot looked like if it was glass it'd have to be 150# .... It was a thick stack.

You can use whatever you like (generally) in the core. My opinion lighter is better. The classics, maple walnut bamboo are probably all great choices. So you could do a core of one of those, then an ipe belly or Osage belly. That would definitely work. Sometimes it's nice to use the same wood for the core and belly, just so it looks like it was one piece. But any of those approaches should work.

[longrifle]

Ben, would I just have the slat of Ipe  1/2" thick and tiller it like a selfbow or should I have the Ipe in lamination form and cut through the lams as I tiller. Or does it not matter?

[longrifle]

Anyone else want to chime in???

[LittleBen]

I think it doesn't matter. If you're going to glue in reflex it's easier wih multiple lams than one thick slat.

[longrifle]

OK thanks Ben.

[kennym]

If I remember right(disclaimer), I think a fellow told me he got this out of the Bowyers Bible set...

If you use a boo back, a .180 x .002 taper, and a .200 parallel , both in osage you will have around 45# @28"

Put the parallel on belly and .002 in middle so you can work the parallel to tiller and not get into the glue joint.

If you glue in reflex ,that should add a few # but I have no idea how much?

Hope this helps you a bit, but remember I'm a glass guy so far! (2nd disclaimer)  :D

[LittleBen]

I think Kenny is right on there. That sounds pretty reasonable. Only thing I'd change is i would also use a 002 taper for the belly lam. You're gonna end up scraping the wood off eventually anyway, it's easier to do it with a band saw than a pocket knife.

Only one way to really find out is to build one since riser length, limb length, width and stack will all affect the draw weight. Just try one out and see.

[longrifle]

Thanks guys , every little bit of info helps

[Coach]

I get an Ipe slat and divide it in fourths from the middle on each side.  Set my jointer for 1/32 and take four swipes off  each side to get the taper.  Each swipe starts from the tip.  Then I put my bamboo back on.  Put an inch or an inch of backset in on the glue up and it will come out straight or maybe have a little backset.  If you want some backset for sure, put 2 !/2" of reflex in it.  If you want some string follow glue it up straight.  You can make this work with a 1 1/8  inch ipe slat.  Can start with a 1/2 " slat or 5/8" slat depending on how much weight you want.

[Coach]

When tapering with the jointer I start on the first mark inside the tip.  Not at the tip it self.  Work from each mark to the tip.  Wanted to clarify.  Believe Dean Torges did this on his instructional film.

[AkDan]

Tracy did what you're wanting to do longrifle, he did a build along on here of it in a few different post.  Look up K.S.Trapper if you already haven't found it.

Here's one...there's another on the powwow a few years back.

 http://tradgang.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=125;t=006659;p=7

Its on my hitlist to build as well.   A long time ago a fella mentioned to me to use a template that is just a straight 1 1/2" I believe from tip to tip.  If you look at Johns bows (or Tracy's, Daves Nates etc, you'll see what they're doing between the fades at the riser).  I'm, thankful to own two of Johns bows.

[longrifle]

Thanks Coach and Dan