White Oak Acorn Question

[Etter]

Please don’t just speculate about this if you dont know the answer. Ive been glassing summer trees for years and have a degree in wildlife and forestry so youd think I would know but I dont. Here goes:

In all four mountain counties I hunt in NE GA, the white oak acorns are very small still. The cap is a pretty normal size but the acorn has not even begun to extend out of it.  The acorn is flat essentially. Im wondering if anybody has seen this before and what to expect. Will they abort?  Stay small but arrive on time?  Drop early?  Drop late? 


We had a very typical spring this year but last fall was an unreal drought. Both species of reds and the chestnut oaks are on track with nornal sized acorns. Thanks for any insight.

[Pat B]

I can't remember if it is the red oaks or white oaks but I believe it take 2 years for the acorn to develop, flowers set one year, acorns develop the next.
With the drought last year the acorns may have been stunted or else the trees were adversely affected so acorn production has been affected.

[Etter]

White oaks develop in one season. That’s not the issue Im seeing here.

[Bowguy67]

I actually scout by watching potential future food sources. Acorns being one and obviously the preferred ones. I’ve just last week noticed white oak acorns really really small. In fact I called friends worried about it. 
The growth or lack of had me very concerned. It’s only been a week or so and they’ve grown substantially. I’m not out in your area but perhaps as here you’re only behind some.

[Etter]

I would hope so but I sent an email to my old dendrology professor and he seemed pretty confident that they will not make it. It’s just amazing how widespread this is.

[Pat B]

If that's the case, Etter, the few trees that might produce viable acorns will certainly be honey holes. Keep looking!   

[Huntschool]

Just wondering .....  Do those trees have Oak Wilt ?

[Etter]

They look completely healthy to me. Keep in mind this is spanning four counties and close to 1000 feet of elevation differences.

[olddogrib]

On a related note, the 17 year cicadas were out in force in the NC Blue ridge back in June. I'd never noticed before, but they have a noticeable preference for white oaks to lay their eggs, as the dead hanging branch tips will attest.  Forest service says it generally does no dmage, but looks worse than crap.

[Etter]

That’s weird. We didnt see any real numbers of them and I can spit to the NC border.

[George Vernon]

Sean,
I have no formal training in forestry.  Years of observation tell me white oaks have two weather enemies.  In the Spring it's a late frost and the white oak blooms are very susceptible to freezing.  I live in southern Ohio and I'd say more than 50% of the time there are no/few white oak acorns due to our history of killing frosts the third week of April when the oaks are blooming.

In the Fall it's drought.  When the leaves come off is when the roots are supposed to be growing and gathering nutrients for the next growing season.  A bad drought in the Fall is rare, and can stunt things the next Spring like acorn growth.

Red oaks take two years to make a nut and seem to handle some of the weather issues a bit better, but the deer don't like them nearly as much.

[Dave Lay]

I did some scouting yesterday and found similar to what you were saying, out of a couple miles of walking and glassing trees. As usual what WO acorns I could see were high in trees and more prevelant on the higher ridges, but I found one tree that was just dumping acorns. I was told a stressed tree will do this to help it get through. But that’s just a buddy’s thoughts
    We normally dont see acorns drop until late Sept or so. But cutting a acorn open showed its not fully developed.

[GCook]

We had a boom crop of white and live oak acorns last year.  Our white oak trees and our oak scrub brush were loaded with large acorns so clustered you would think grape clusters.
This year the crop is small and so far small looking acorns as you described.

[Etter]

Dave, those are northern red oaks. I usually see them start to drop green ones good by mid august. Ive found them to be very heavy at all but the highest elevations this year. Its fine. Bears love them after the whites and before if there arent enough whites to go around. Seeing a decent number of chestnut oaks too.

[Etter]

Thanks George. Yeah, the drought is what I suspect is doing this. Our acorns obviously didnt get frost because the blooms made it through. We did have a TON of spring rain and I know thatll screw up pollination pretty good.

I did 8 miles today and saw much of the same but I did spot the difference in the trees with whites that I think will make it (but probably be a bit small) versus the ones that will obviously abort. Either way, we can walk til we find the few goid whites or hunt reds. Honestly, I think the few good whites are gonna be climbed and eaten before our opener next month anyway.

[Huntschool]

Just to firm up what I said earlier about "Oak Wilt" it only has a drastic effect on Reds.  It will kill em once infected. Whites seem to be more tolerant or less affected by this disease.  I have one funky looking red but I don't think its wilt.

Just to be clear.  I looked at several different whites today and they are a bit behind here in Southernmost Illinois but I think they will make.  I am 2.5 hours drive North West of Nashville, TN so what I am seeing is above your zone in general but perhaps not that much when you figure in elevation.

Just some info....

[Etter]

Thanks! 

We have had an incredible summer for soft mast here. Probably the most blackberries Ive ever seen and a great crop of blue and huckleberries too. Plus a lot of the valley farmers planted corn this year. Our bears are gonna be fat if I can find em.

[Dave Lay]

Oops , I think your right Etter, good info man, thanks

[T Sunstone]

I've notice that the white and red oaks have very small or hardly any acorns this year in southern Maryland.

[STICKBENDER98]

Have you seen any infestation of Gypsy Moths? We've had a resurgence of them here in my area of west central Michigan, there are still oaks that are just starting to sprout leaves.  I've been checking the white and red oaks in and around my yard but haven't seen many acorns on them.


Jason