Time for a rant

[buckeyebowhunter]

Had a conversation with a gentleman I work with recently. He said he'd thought about getting his boy into hunting. I said that's great man where you guys gonna hunt, his reply was oh probably just dump some corn out back so he can shoot something. He was appalled when I shook my head in disapproval. My reply was don't do your son an injustice. Take him into the woods and show him how to hunt. There's absolutely nothing illegal or really wrong with what he had planned to do. But it truly saddens me that this is what hunting is now. Whether the boy is successful at harvesting an animal or not I feel it is a total disservice to both him and the animal.

I got into hunting because I loved being in the woods and I love traditional bows because they make you find ways you get close to animals "naturally". I just can't do the corn pile stuff. It seems to have become the predominant way to hunt around here and i just can't buy into it just seems unnatural. Not trying to turn this into a baiting vs. Not baiting feud (I've already read that thread). But just giving my opinion on the disservice were doing to young people wanting to hunt. 

[FITTER]

Yeah I think your right..... he is missing the whole point.

[BAK]

I've hunted all my life.  I had always hoped to teach my grand-kids all about that.  My daughter made fun of me killing Bambi whenever she could, then when my grandson was about 12 they took him to a "friends" acreage, put him in a blind, and had him shoot a deer with a .243 over a corn pile.  Wanted him to know what "hunting" was like.   

[Steelhead]

I think a some hunters and just people in general are just different.Many are born that way.Kinda naturally inclined to love nature,explore nature.Seeking more knowledge about the natural world around them.They want to know more about the habits of the animals and how they relate to the envirements they live in and how how those envirements effect them.They read books and magazines about it.They dream about it.Thier inherantly draw to the natural world.They want to become part of it and do.

You can lead a horse to water.But cant make it drink.

I used to sneak off the playground  with my buddy at a strict grade school at high risk to my hide.I would go to the fields nearby or the creek and explore nature and catch things.No stopping me.I was just born to be close to it and emerse myself in it.Me and that friend eventually both became traditional bowhunters and hunted many other things with guns and are avid fisherman as well.Naturals like most here I believe.I was not taught that kinda passion.My dad did not hunt or fish.

Hunting the hard way with a traditional bow and other handicaps is gonna teach a boy,girl,woman or man alot about Nature and bring them closer to it.Some just are not cut out for it or or not inspired by it.Too bad!!!

Some do evolve to appreciate it when introduced to it.Many do not.So it does not hurt to try and inspire some folks to the magic of it.You can try to teach,advise a bit and inspire.A few will catch on.

Count yourself lucky that you are who you are and blessed for it and keep the rants coming LOL.

[bucknut]

Sadly, That is what the world is coming to. I hate it but The Outhouse channel generation seems to think that's the only way you can be successful. The instant gratification generation.  One guy I know of put out 7 tons of corn in one year!!! Just to kill a deer.  I'm lucky to have grown up in the heart of national forest and learned the hard way and way am better for it. I have 80 acres of my own and many properties I can hunt and still hunt about 90% of the time on forest land. Take them out in the big woods and see how they do. LOL.

[katman]

If he gets his boy "into hunting" and has success with a harvest just maybe a flame is lit and then he can teach woodsmanship. Just another way to think about it.

[bowmaster12]

Maybe this guy at work doesn't know any other way to hunt?  You could offer to take him and his son out to show them there is another way of doing things and there can be more to it than just the kill.  Take this opportunity to light the flame of passion in the kids primal soul instead of snuffing it out.

[Petrichor]

My first few hunts were a deer over a corn pile with a 30.06. I also never went hunting as a kid and a guy from church took me as a young adult. Now I tradbow hunt only havent killed a deer in 8 years and totally immerse myself in nature every chance I get. I get that it is sad, but it is a start and maybe like myself thr spark will turn into a blaze.

[Bowguy67]

Just because something is legal doesn’t make it sporting and It’s def doing a disservice to our youth. We need to teach. Show them the pride in learning and succeeding the right way. I have lots more to say on it but am biting my fingers so to speak. Offer help

[Bowguy67]

My first few hunts were a deer over a corn pile with a 30.06. I also never went hunting as a kid and a guy from church took me as a young adult. Now I tradbow hunt only havent killed a deer in 8 years and totally immerse myself in nature every chance I get. I get that it is sad, but it is a start and maybe like myself thr spark will turn into a blaze.

8 years? Do you get out a lot? If so tell us some about your area and how you hunt so we can help you

[Bowguy67]

If he gets his boy "into hunting" and has success with a harvest just maybe a flame is lit and then he can teach woodsmanship. Just another way to think about it.

Katman what “woodsmanship” could the man possibly teach?

[Bowwild]

I have been on baited bear hunts and two guided (not baited of course) turkey hunts far from home. I enjoyed these hunts very much. However, I already had many years of hunting under my belt and degrees in both Forestry and Wildlife Science. My woodsmanship was already well developed.  To be frank, I did not consider myself the hunter in any of these hunts, I was simply the shooter.  Sure, I had to be quiet, make shoot/don't shoot decisions, and of course be accurate with my gear. But, let's face it, the hard work was done by the guides.

I have never baited for deer. My grown son and I have discussed this a lot. His best friend hunts only over bait and sees deer (lots) every time he goes out. He can see his baited blind from his house. This friend is a wonderful fellow and what he does is legal and good for him.  However, my son and I came to an understanding long ago, that we would not hunt deer over bait. That doing so is not hunting the way I learned and the way I've taught him. We don't dog or put down those who do, these are personal decisions.

Having written all that, I didn't engage my son in scouting, stand placement, and other key elements of the hunt for 3-4 years after he started hunting. I was simply his guide.  We started that in his late teens.  I always worried whether or not I taught him enough to be confident and have fun without me in the picture.  These parents who start their kids over bait can do some teaching too. They can teach tree species, other natural food sources, deer and other wildlife sign, and put their bait sites and blinds in locations that would have deer coming by even without the bait. Dad could teach the youngster why the spot is attractive to deer, even without the bait (edge cover, near bedding areas, funnels, topography, to and from natural food, how food choices change through the season, etc.). So, as long as dear old Dad teaches the youngster that baiting requires stealth, marksmanship, and patience, but there are many other parts of the hunt and becoming a hunter that must be mastered.

This past fall (two months ago) my grown son bow-killed 3 turkeys, 2 does, and a 13-point buck.  I had nothing to do with his scouting and blind placement and I was not present while he hunted.  He's even starting to give me advice. I listen closely, am grateful, and marvel.

[buckeyebowhunter]

I've offered. I'm sure it's a case of him not knowing what to teach I don't believe the man is much of a hunter. And while I do call him a friend I believe it's just another case of instant gratification or bust. I am no angel, I've hunted over corn in my younger years but I have decided this is not for me as I grow older.
I don't believe that hunting this way is going to ignite much of a flame to be honest. Hell I "hunted" with dad without even carrying a weapon for several years when I was very little and was hooked and could not wait until I was allowed to get a bow and go on my own. I don't see this with kids much these days, and I work at a school so I know what kids are into and it's very rarely hunting or learning to hunt.

[buckeyebowhunter]

I guess maybe I'm just afraid that this is how it is now and I honestly don't see it changing unless the baiting is outlawed. A lot of people even friends of mine don't understand why I spend so much time in the woods year round, hunt public land,  use trad bows, sharpen my own heads and so on. They just can't fathom the amount of work that goes into it but I love every second of it.

[jsweka]

It may not be much of a way to hunt, it might not jive with your standards, but what is the alternative?  Just let the kid sit home in front of a screen and a video game?  Shooting a deer with a rifle over a pile of corn is still better than the most likely alternative for kids these days.  Even my kid - if we aren’t hunting he is likely on, or wanting to be on some stupid video game. As was said earlier, maybe that baited deer hunt will lead to something better.

[Sam McMichael]

I also do not think baiting is the way to go. True, it is legal in many areas, but it is not hunting. This is just my opinion, so I am not interested in hearing from those who want to correct my errant reasoning. I have no real concern with what others do as long as it does not violate the hunting laws. Hogs, because of their destructive nature, may be an exception. Ambush them and take them out to control their numbers, but as prolific as they are, I'm not sure their population will not actually be curtailed significantly. I share the rant.

[Bowguy67]

It may not be much of a way to hunt, it might not jive with your standards, but what is the alternative?  Just let the kid sit home in front of a screen and a video game?  Shooting a deer with a rifle over a pile of corn is still better than the most likely alternative for kids these days.  Even my kid - if we aren’t hunting he is likely on, or wanting to be on some stupid video game. As was said earlier, maybe that baited deer hunt will lead to something better.

The alternative is obvious show him how to actually hunt. Boys it ain’t that hard.

[bowkill146]

So I definitely don't agree with hunting deer over bait and I never have done it and God willing never will, but the only good thing I will say about that scenario is that the child will have an opportunity.  Now I don't know the situation at all, if there are hay fields or corn fields that they would have the ability to hunt over that would still pretty much guarantee an opportunity then absolutely that would be a better way to go.  But if the alternative for the first hunting year is to go into the "big woods" and probably not even see anything, then I would say that the odds are probably not in favor of that child being interested in doing it again.  Now the exception to that is if whoever it is that takes him out is willing to take the time and effort and make the rest of nature fun and not just focus on harvesting an animal, then with the right child it will probably stick. 
All this being said, I definitely wouldn't let him hunt over bait for more than the first year or he's going to get bored with it in a hurry.  I also would want the "mentor" to make sure and emphasize that they are doing this method of hunting to give him an opportunity to have success and see if it's something that they are even interested in.

[David Phillips]

There’s an entire population of “hunters” that don’t know any difference and don’t care to know anything but corn piles and game cameras. I know a guy that hunts his deer lease only been hunting it for 15 years same box stand same feeders same thing every year. He kills a buck usually every year and a doe or two. His hunting skill level is about a 1 on a scale from 1-10. He’s always asking why I spend so much time an energy to hunt public land, he just cannot understand. This guy is retired and can hunt anywhere he wants anytime but he’s stuck on those 3 box stands starring at the same corn pile lol. He had a scare couple years back the timber company he leases from almost sold the land from under him. I asked him what he do, he said if he couldn’t hunt there he’s have to quit. He would be absolutely lost as a blind goose on public land.

But he’s not bumbling around the woods like a lot of the YouTube wannabes. Same skill level just watched one too many YouTube videos and then try to mimic their hero without any hunting abilities. Being a consistent successful bowhunter takes time and there is a learning curve that can’t be fast tracked watching videos or with a bag of corn. To many people want the picture for Instagram but don’t want to put in the effort. I prefer the box stand deer lease type. 

[John Cholin]

In my opinion there is a profound difference between hunting and killing.  While a kill is a part of the hunt, it is only a part, and often one of the smaller parts.  I prefer to hunt.  This fall I was on a great buck, but after 3 weeks of chase it ended up I was the one who made all the mistakes and I think he is still out there.  But I had a great time because I was in the hunt.  I'll be back next year.

It is said in one of the Wensel/Mitten CDs something to the effect that our sense of accomplishment is directly proportional to the effort expended. 

To my way of thinking shooting a deer over bait is not hunting;  it is killing.  Killing doesn't make you a hunter, it merely makes you a killer.

JMC