Something finally learned about Tillering...

[Roy from Pa]

You are correct on adding a nock under the arrow, especially for 3 under shooting, I neglected to mention that.

A self bow has to be shot the way it is tillered for, either split or 3 under, shooting it any other way will change the tiller for the worse and no way you should string walk with a self bow. A glass bow you can't hurt the tiller by changing from split to 3 under or string walking.

[Shredd]

Granted that you could correct things with nock point positioning and an elevated rest, but I have found with my R/D bow which I believe is tillered correctly for 3 under, that I can get that nock very low, to about an 1/8" above 90*...  When I switched the limbs (top for bottom) on my 3 pc. recurve, I get better arrow flight but I found that I have to have the nock a little bit higher and it is more sensitive to release and bow hand pressure than the R/D bow...  A bad release and /or a little low hand pressure and the arrow starts bouncing off the shelf...  Not so with my R/D bow...  I just have a piece of tape for a nocking point for now...  I will have to tie on two nocking points to see if that may solve the problem...  By switching the top for the bottom, even though it somewhat corrected the problem I believe It is now tillered a hair too much the other way...
   So in the grand outlook of things I think it is better to have the bow tillered correctly and shoot as true as possible than to correct it with nock placement and such...  I believe those things should be used for fine tuning and not as an overall correction...

   I learned A lot from this thread and am very grateful...  Like I said this was the last piece of the puzzle for me...  I feel so relieved...  This tiller thing weighed on me and has bothered me for a long time...  But I knew the answer would one day come knocking on my door...   

   Some things just take time...

[Roy from Pa]

Shredd
Trad Bowhunter
**

Join Date: Sep 2016

Only took ya 4.5 years. LOL

[Shredd]

   Yep...  How bout that....  Still lots I don't know...      

[BigJim]

That's a novel Idea shredd, but it only works if you are building bows for yourself or the customer can come to the shop and have it built.. and then never changes their style.
Having a low nock point is not all that.. and unless you are shooting 1/4" arrows, it only being an 1/8" high tells me that the arrow is really pointing up.
No matter what you do while building a bow, you can't ensure exact hand placement.. I crowd the shelf when I grip, but I watch many shoot that don't, even with the same bow.
If the limb tips come back to zero balanced, that is the goal. After all, we are talking about fine adjustments to the bow in comparison to the crude machine operating it.

BigJim

[Shredd]

True True...   Thanks for sharing your thoughts...

 I guess I will have to find a happy medium for split and three under...

[willi]

.........and it is more sensitive to release and bow hand pressure than the R/D bow...  A bad release and /or a little low hand pressure and the arrow starts bouncing off the shelf...  Not so with my R/D bow...

Is this the same recurve with the exceptional speed and high early draw weight?

[Shredd]

  The last one I built...  The target bow with the over-size riser...

[willi]

  The last one I built...  The target bow with the over-size riser...

A quite fast recurve, none the less.   Can you score more consistently with the R/D?

[Shredd]

  No... I make better groups with the recurve...  The mass weight plus the added weight spread out on a longer riser helps to stabilize the bow plus the window is past center which helps to get my aiming point closer to the target...   I can still make good and tight groups with the R/D but it seems that I have to try and concentrate a lot harder, where the recurve seems like it shoots it's self...

   Just a note on past center window...   I had a problem with my arrows inconsistently going left and right...   I took a piece of paper towel and folded it up into a little square and taped on my strike plate area to build it out a little and being that it was a little cushy worked a little as a plunger...  Now my arrows fly consistent horizontally...  I think if I stick a piece of velcro there, that should do the job...

[willi]

A bad release and /or a little low hand pressure and the arrow starts bouncing off the shelf...  Not so with my R/D bow...

this observation concerning the R/D being more forgiving makes me wonder if having a softer shooting limb on your longer heavier riser would let you score higher

[Shredd]

  That's a possibilty and something that I thought of doing...  But the issue you just quoted me on has to do more with tillering than over all limb characteristics...

[willi]

  That's a possibilty and something that I thought of doing...  But the issue you just quoted me on has to do more with tillering than over all limb characteristics...

Tillering or tuning? 
with olympic bows,  having an adjustable limb mount now means one can tune instead of tiller.....

I have also noticed the olympic bow limbs are not as aggressive as possible in spite of the "need" for speed when shooting at the longer yardages.

[Roy from Pa]

Tillering or tuning?
with olympic bows,  having an adjustable limb mount now means one can tune instead of tiller.....

That's how my ILF is, you can adjust the limb bolts to tune.