Bow bolt takedown weight

[Bbulkley18]

Hey everybody, newish member here. I have been trying out a couple bows to find out what fits me. Looking to eventually order a custom when I get it figured out. I have been leaning towards a bow bolt takedown system, but I’m not sure what kind of weight difference that would make in the riser/bow. Was curious if any of you have had a model of bow both in one piece and takedown, and had a weight difference? I’m mostly looking at Toelke and Javaman bows right now. Have had a Pika and now have a Whistler. Looking to maybe try an Elkheart some day. Thanks!

[Steelhead]

It might add a little weight.I think its neglible since its taking up space that would be replaced with mycarta,phenolic or G-10 material  if it was a 1 piece..Those materials are pretty dense.Thats where the mass weight will come from mostly in the riser if your looking for a heavier and also stiffer riser.

I would not have a bow bolt bow personally installed without the main part of the riser where the bow bolt is installed made with anything other than the 3 materials mentioned above.Unless their is something similar I am not aware of that has the integrity needed for the Bow bolt for security and longevity.

In my personell experience and others their has been some failures with less strong riser materials like wood with a bowbolt.When they 1st came out.   

[PrimitivePete]

I have a Robertson Primal Styk longbow with a bow bolt and I don't perceive the bow has a heavy hand held weight. At least not heavy enough to notice. I will also add from the bows I have owned that had a bow bolt, none of them had the fit that my Robertson has, many had gaps that I didn't like at all.

[Bbulkley18]

That is good info, thank you both. One thing I found interesting on the two Toelkes I have/had - the Pika, 56” was a one piece all wood bow (can’t remember the exact riser wood at the moment), and the Whistler, 58” is a one piece with linen micarta riser. I weighted both with strings on and it was only a .1 pound difference. I expected more weight from the micarta. Both great bows though that’s for sure.

[Maclean]

I have a 54" Pika with bow bolt takedown, and a one piece 56" Elkheart with a walnut dymalux riser. The Pika weighs 23.28 oz. (1.45 lb.) The Elkheart weighs 21.78 oz. (1.36 lb.) That's a 1.5 oz. difference.  I know it's not apples to apples because of the extra length of the Elkheart, but that's pretty darn close, and probably unnoticeable to most archers.

[Michael Guran]

I have a takedown Whip with the bolt system.  I agree with what the others said—it’s a slightly heavier than a one piece, but the Micarta is probably most of it.  It’s a rock solid system and I would not hesitate to buy another one from Toelke.

[MnFn]

I have had a hinge type, a sleeve, and a bow bolt. The hinge type and the bow bolt were both from Liberty, and I much preferred the bow bolt(with a micarta riser).
 The sleeve type was a Black Widow PLX- I really liked that also.

More to your question, I have had a couple one of piece Liberty’s. I didn’t see any significant weight difference between the takedowns and the one piece. My favorite long bow is the Liberty English - a 68” with the bow bolt and it has a long micarta riser. I see the slight additional weight as a benefit.

In terms of weight, it was a non-issue for me.

[Burnsie]

I have a bow bolt Tolke -Whip.
Love the bow and the take-down option is great when I pack into Elk country. Most other times it is always put together.
Mine is rock solid (Dan does a nice job).  I don't know of any bowyers now days that use the bow bolt system without using phenolic or G10 in conjunction with it.  Many guys tried using the bow bolt in various natural wood risers back in the day - some worked out OK, but there were enough failures that I think most bowyers have decided to not risk it.
I see St. Patrick Lakes longbows offers a G10 two piece bow bolt as well.

[Bbulkley18]

I have a 54" Pika with bow bolt takedown, and a one piece 56" Elkheart with a walnut dymalux riser. The Pika weighs 23.28 oz. (1.45 lb.) The Elkheart weighs 21.78 oz. (1.36 lb.) That's a 1.5 oz. difference.  I know it's not apples to apples because of the extra length of the Elkheart, but that's pretty darn close, and probably unnoticeable to most archers.

That is really great info, thank you! You’ve got an excellent collection going, and pretty much the same taste as me. I can’t wait to try out a Javaman bow one of these days. I really like those numbers on the 54” Pika, that takedown system must help quite a bit with stability having that mass in the riser. Quite a bit heavier than my 56” Pika was.

[Bbulkley18]

I have a takedown Whip with the bolt system.  I agree with what the others said—it’s a slightly heavier than a one piece, but the Micarta is probably most of it.  It’s a rock solid system and I would not hesitate to buy another one from Toelke.

Thank you! It’s hard to beat a Toelke. Their bow bolt connections always look clean as well.

[Bbulkley18]

I have had a hinge type, a sleeve, and a bow bolt. The hinge type and the bow bolt were both from Liberty, and I much preferred the bow bolt(with a micarta riser).
 The sleeve type was a Black Widow PLX- I really liked that also.

More to your question, I have had a couple one of piece Liberty’s. I didn’t see any significant weight difference between the takedowns and the one piece. My favorite long bow is the Liberty English - a 68” with the bow bolt and it has a long micarta riser. I see the slight additional weight as a benefit.

In terms of weight, it was a non-issue for me.

Thank you! I guess one thing I am thinking as well, is if you look at it from a percentage perspective rather than pounds/ounces perspective, the difference in a little 54” or 56” bow is probably more significant, albeit still not a huge difference. For example the difference between the Pika I had and my Whistler, still basically 10% which is notable. Appreciate the info!

[Bbulkley18]

I have a bow bolt Tolke -Whip.
Love the bow and the take-down option is great when I pack into Elk country. Most other times it is always put together.
Mine is rock solid (Dan does a nice job).  I don't know of any bowyers now days that use the bow bolt system without using phenolic or G10 in conjunction with it.  Many guys tried using the bow bolt in various natural wood risers back in the day - some worked out OK, but there were enough failures that I think most bowyers have decided to not risk it.
I see St. Patrick Lakes longbows offers a G10 two piece bow bolt as well.

Thank you! Definitely one of the reasons I’m so drawn to the takedowns, I have some backpack public land hunts planned and it would make life a whole lot easier. All the bowyers I’m looking at the do the bolt have either an I-beam or full micarta riser so I’m not worried about reliability. Maybe it’s just me, but I feel like the bolt will shine in these scenarios where the bow stays put together most of the time. Just seems like less maintenance than a sleeve. I could be wrong though.

[Bbulkley18]

I probably should have also mentioned that I am actually wanting a little extra mass in the riser, as an added benefit to having a takedown. I’ve only been at this a couple years, so my form still has some room for improvement. I think maybe extra riser mass, especially with short, light weight bows will help my consistency and effective range. Obviously these bows don’t shoot quite like a 66” setup.

[Maclean]

I have a 54" Pika with bow bolt takedown, and a one piece 56" Elkheart with a walnut dymalux riser. The Pika weighs 23.28 oz. (1.45 lb.) The Elkheart weighs 21.78 oz. (1.36 lb.) That's a 1.5 oz. difference.  I know it's not apples to apples because of the extra length of the Elkheart, but that's pretty darn close, and probably unnoticeable to most archers.

That is really great info, thank you! You’ve got an excellent collection going, and pretty much the same taste as me. I can’t wait to try out a Javaman bow one of these days. I really like those numbers on the 54” Pika, that takedown system must help quite a bit with stability having that mass in the riser. Quite a bit heavier than my 56” Pika was.

Yeah, the extra weight from the micarta riser and bow bolt seem to be exactly what the Pika needs. Just enough to give it some stability. It's an amazing little bow at 54". I like it so much that I ordered a 58" takedown Chinook with a few more pounds of draw weight. I too am a public land backpack hunter, and a takedown is worth it's weight in gold. Not to mention traveling by car or backcountry plane to other destinations.
If you haven't shot an Elkheart, you owe yourself that pleasure. If I were to buy another, it would certainly be a bow bolt takedown.

[Steelhead]

I see you may want more mass weight.

I think in the Elkheart Magnum,the Elkheart and Falcon.The Falcon has the longest largest riser.Shortest is 58 inches in the Falcon.So it should have more mass weight.Followed by the Elkheart and then the smallest riser on the magnum Elkheart.Something to consider.The Elkheart gets alot of love.dont hear as much about the Falcon.But I assume its similar in limb design with a longer riser.It should be heavier.

I thought the Whistler riser was longer than the Pika?I could be wrong.I was surprisedd the pika with your wood riser was close to the same mass weight as your phenolic riser.I had the 60 inch phenolic bowbolt risered Whistler.That was a sweet shooter for me.I like that bow.

[Bbulkley18]

Maclean:
Yeah, the extra weight from the micarta riser and bow bolt seem to be exactly what the Pika needs. Just enough to give it some stability. It's an amazing little bow at 54". I like it so much that I ordered a 58" takedown Chinook with a few more pounds of draw weight. I too am a public land backpack hunter, and a takedown is worth it's weight in gold. Not to mention traveling by car or backcountry plane to other destinations.
If you haven't shot an Elkheart, you owe yourself that pleasure. If I were to buy another, it would certainly be a bow bolt takedown.
[/quote]
I agree. I actually shot the 56 Pika better than any of my other bows so far. Haven’t had much time with the Whistler yet though. I’m really tempted to try a 54” bow (I’m 28 1/2” draw), with bow bolt and maybe mid 40’s draw weight for a whitetail bow. I think if I didn’t have finger pinch that could be the perfect setup for me. It’s a gamble though since I know how the 56 was, and haven’t shot a 54.
For the backpack hunts or western hunts though, I think a 58” takedown would be great. Could probably go longer though for that purpose.

[Bbulkley18]

I see you may want more mass weight.

I think in the Elkheart Magnum,the Elkheart and Falcon.The Falcon has the longest largest riser.Shortest is 58 inches in the Falcon.So it should have more mass weight.Followed by the Elkheart and then the smallest riser on the magnum Elkheart.Something to consider.The Elkheart gets alot of love.dont hear as much about the Falcon.But I assume its similar in limb design with a longer riser.It should be heavier.

I thought the Whistler riser was longer than the Pika?I could be wrong.I was surprisedd the pika with your wood riser was close to the same mass weight as your phenolic riser.I had the 60 inch phenolic bowbolt risered Whistler.That was a sweet shooter for me.I like that bow.

I know lots of folks have had good things to say about the Elkheart Magnum, but I’m nervous enough about going to a 54” bow at my draw let along 52 or 50 inch.
If I go that route, I’ll probably just see what Gregg has to say. It would be hard to stray from the regular Elkheart though, it’s hard to find anything but positive reviews on it. Maybe at ETAR I’ll be able to handle one.
I’m not sure on the riser lengths between the Pika and Whistler, there could be a variance but if there is, it’s not much. I was very surprised on the weights as well, I put them both on the scale multiple times as I figured there would be a fairly significant difference.

[Maclean]

 Bbulkley - I  also have a 28.5" DL, and I don't get any finger pinch at my anchor with the 54" Pika.

[Bbulkley18]

Maclean - thank you! Got a lot of great info from you that I was looking for. Greatly appreciated. Now, which grip do you like better??? Haha

[Maclean]

You are most welcome. I've only shot the standard locator grip, so I'm not much help there. But I love it. Of all the different grips of all the different bows I've shot, it's my favorite.  The Chinook will have the same grip.