First post need help

[Rileykinsel]

Hello! I finally created an account on here after snooping and reading posts for almost a decade. I started shooting at 15 and am now 27 years old. I’ve shot exclusively trad bows and selfbows since first getting into archery. I’ve shot different ways over the years with varying degrees of success. I took a several year long break from archery due to moving to and living in Las Vegas with few opportunities to shoot. I’ve been back home in Michigan for about two years now and lately I’ve been really getting obsessed again. I’m really trying to take it serious and iron out my form and shooting style. Here’s my problem: I gravitate towards a split finger and instinctive/split vision shooting style. Shooting like this, on most day, I feel very confident with my hunting abilities. I can hit the kill zone from 10-25 yards pretty consistently. I regularly taken squirrels and rabbits shooting this way. Recently Ive been playing with 3 under and gap shooting and I just cannot make it work. I’ve played with so many anchors and form cues that I’m going crazy. My biggest issue is not consistent groups but accuracy. When I settle into a good anchor and shot sequence I can keep my arrows touching out to 20 yards but every single shot is high and left (I’m left handed). I have pretty obsessive tendencies and spent one week shooting so many arrows that I shot the neck off of my 3d target from consistently drilling the upper left of the vitals. As a result of trying to fix this I’ve pretty much lost any consistency in my shot due to trying everything under the sun to get this problem sorted. I’ve tried moving my anchor, canting my bows various ways, shooting with one and both eyes open, focusing on proper back tension and release with no plucking and good follow through, playing with different grips on my bow hand etc. every change I make takes some getting used to but once I settle into the new position and get my groups good again that high left creeps right back in  I also make sure to go back to my split finger instinctive style because it’s the only way I’m consistently accurate and hunting is my main goal so I want to make sure I don’t loose that. But as far as trying to learn how to shoot 3 under and gap I’m at my wits end and the dozens or hundreds of forums I’ve read or vidoes I’ve watched do not seem to help. Hence the reason I’ve finally decided to make an account and reach out for direct help. I did a session with a coach recently who gave me some good form cues and thats always welcome but it does not seem to have fixed my main issue. Has anyone else experienced this problem or is their anyone who can help me fix this issue and regain my sanity. I also do not believe it’s an arrow tuning issue as my arrows are not really hitting nock left or right, rather it’s the arrow itself. I also notice this problem most with my 58 inch thunderstick mag 50# at 28. My draw falls somewhere between 27 and 28 with good form. With a few of my other bows the problem is still there but not as severe and I assume that’s just because it’s a faster bow so the discrepancy is more severe. I’m going to hunt this year with my split finger style but I would really like to learn to shoot both ways as I know all the highest level barebow guys shoot 3 under and gap. Hunting accuracy is my bare minimum but I’d like to get as accurate as possible also and gap 3 under seems be the way statistically

[McDave]

Hi Riley, welcome to TradGang!

You are able to describe your problem very articulately.  Did you describe it this way to your coach?  What did he say?

They say a photo is worth a thousand words, so a video must be worth 10,000.  Could you make a video of you shooting and post it on here?

The reason I say these things is that you seem very meticulous in your search for a solution, so I would imagine you have tried most of the things we would suggest based on what you have written.  So to avoid wasting your time, maybe we would see something from a video that you missed, because it is a natural human tendency to do a poor job of self analysis.

The first thing some people are going to say is that you are doing a good job with split finger and instinctive/split vision (whatever that means), so why change anything?  However, I respect your desire to learn new things, so I would encourage you to continue along that path as long as it is interesting to you, and we will try to help you get there.

[Rileykinsel]

I can definitely upload some pictures or videos. I did have a mini breakthrough today though. I was watching a random video on the instinctive addiction YouTube page while working in my garage and he brought something up I wasnt actively looking for but was what I think I needed. He mentioned how a tight anchor really hugging the face can produce a strong side shot and a soft or more floating anchor can produce a weak side shot. I grabbed my bow and went out to shoot a few arrows with this in mind. I have been anchoring deep into my jaw with the crook of my thumb and forefinger. I really liked this for repeatability and comfortability. Even added an inch to my draw. But I moved it out on my face a bit more. Essentially putting the nail bed of my thumb directly on the angle of my jawbone. It’s a bit less accessible as the skin on my jaw can move but if I tuck it in just the right spot and use the middle finger to the corner of my mouth as a secondary it’s pretty repeatable and at least for now really cleared up the left and right. It did increase my gap a bit but still not as big as my split. Still work to do but it’s progress…. Probably won’t be shooting 3 under at turkeys tomorrow though haha.

[Rileykinsel]

First decent group with 3 under in a long time

[Rileykinsel]

And to answer the first half of your question. The coach was very knowledgeable but I don’t think his style of archery is what I’m looking for. Instead of directly addressing the high left or having me shoot groups to see what’s going on, He had me completely changing my form and draw sequence to match up with a more target archery style. Very horizontal bow posture which is really hard since I shoot off the shelf. Very much against anything split finger and didn’t even want to see me shoot split lol. Big advocate of string walking which I’m not really interested in at least for now being that I’m mainly in it to hunt and like to shoot selfbows which probably can’t handle that kind of abuse on the limbs. He was a cool guy and knew his stuff but I’m not really trying to get into shooting with rests and stabilizers etc. or shooting in a very restrictive manor that target archers do. Learning how to gap for 3d shoots and messing around with the occasional field shooting is about as far as I want to take things.

[McDave]

Good job working with your anchor.  In my first introductory archery class, I emphasize only two things: the magic T and anchor.  Moving the anchor 1/8” on your face will make a 6” difference in POI at 20 yards. You want your anchor to be tight enough on your face to be repeatable, but not so tight that it is difficult to get a consistent release.

I shoot 3 under, and my anchor is my index finger under my cheekbone.  It's a two step process: first I put my index finger under my cheekbone, and next I press up slightly with my index finger against the bottom of my cheekbone.  I like it because it is quick and easily repeatable.  I'm not suggesting that you adopt my anchor, but find some anchor that isn't going to move on you.

A good check on your form in general is whether your string hand recoils straight back after the shot and your fingers end up touching your neck or shoulder.  A slight recoil of only an inch or so is okay too, where your fingers stay on your face, as long as there is some recoil backwards, and your hand doesn't move sideways, or worst of all forward, when you release the shot.  If your hand ends up in the air to the side of your face after you shoot, this indicates a form problem that you need to fix before you move on to anything else.  Could be a lot of things, but likely candidates include overuse of the biceps, failure to maintain back tension through followthrough, or failure to complete the draw so the string elbow is all the way behind the arrow.

All of these things apply to any style of archery that exists under our western tradition of shooting.