What would you have done?

[Curtiss Cardinal]

I don't think you should feel guilty. I have seen deer survive with legs torn off after being stuck in a fence or hit by a car. And I mean survive for years. Nature is cruel and beneficent at the same time. If the deer dies as a result of its injuring it will never go to waste. It will be a blessing to coyotes, bobcats, racoons, crows, jays, vultures and rodents of all kinds and make their Winter pass more easily for it perhaps. I know you felt bad because you wanted to ease some suffering, however that you didn't is not something to feel guilty about. It is the speciality of four legged predators to cull the weak, sick and injured in any herd. If your area has none then the resp[onsibilty falls upon you. If it does have bobcats, bears, coyotes or any other four legged predators you can leave injured deer to them and let them do the job The Creator made them for. If you feel it is your place as a two legged predator to be a culling agent then you should never seek out a peak of maturity buck or doe for any reason because that would be removing the wrong animals from the herd and be counterproductive to your place as a predator. We human beings hunt for other reasons, some base and carnal(reasons of instinct and flesh) to be sure but mostly for spiritual recreation(classic meaning) and personal challenge.

[upatree]

Originally posted by pcappy08:
Since work was slow today I was able to sneak out today for the majority of the day and figured i would try and take a doe....where i hunt there is a 3pt on a side quality deer management rule in effect by fish game and wildlife


found some great sign around 3pm and at 430 had 8 does assorted ages and a 3pt yearling come in to feed....perfect does at 20yds a slam dunk...well here is the twist....when the does were coming in i noticed the little buck was really laboring badly so i let the does cross past my position to get a better look at him and sure enough his right rear leg was broken badly        ....well over the next 30mins and drawing and letting down several times while arguing with myself nightfall finally made my decision for me...i let him walk ...i still feel guilty for it knowing that winter or the coyotes will get him when i had the ability to prevent his suffering but the fear of the fine from a game warden or losing my hunting privileges kept me from doing what i felt to be the ethically right thing....normally i would never take a young buck like that but it really gets to me when i see a deer suffering...  so i ask in that position what would you do?

The game and fish made your decision for you with the antler rule.  It's a tough decision but you have to follow the rules if you want to continue to play the game.

[smokin joe]

I think you did the right thing. There is a natural order out there and weak and injured deer provide food for other animals that have to eat. We are part of nature, it's true, but the management laws are there for good reason. And, we are in no position to make exceptions or excuses. Nature is cruel and unforgiving, and animals do eat each other. in my opinion you made the choice you needed to make given the facts of the situation.

[Curveman]

Well, I truly agree that everyone can't just follow their own rules but we are in a gray area on this one and I for one, am uncomfortable with absolutes in murky areas. Granted they may serve to absolve us we think, but God might look on it differently, no? Look at history. There have been laws on the books that have clearly been in violation of what is decent. People broke the law then and we call them heroes now. Those who would say that I'd be doing it only for me have not studied the world's great religions and philosophers. Jesus broke the law for example. Anyone care here to say he shouldn't have? It is something I will continue to think about though because I do understand the viewpoints here and I know to leave an abandoned offspring etc. Very good topic in my opinion!

[Sam McMichael]

As a probation officer, I know that in some locations, a citation may cost you your hunting privileges, as well as your money, for taking an "illegal" animal.  That possibility needs to be a consideration in situations like this. Sometimes, doing the right thing carries considerable risk.

[Bonebuster]

I have seen, and even taken a deer with an injured/missing front leg. Never a rear leg.

The law IS the law, but right is right.

[Deadbolt]

Originally posted by Clay Hayes:
 I wouldn’t hold it against a hunter for going either way.  I think I would have shot the deer then contacted the local warden.  If he’s got a conscience, he should understand.  He probably wouldn’t let you keep the buck though.

You have never lived in NJ i suspect LOL!!  they would have came crashing down on him with the book.

Me personally being i butcher my own animals I would have shot it and taken him down and butched that night.  

If you needed to chweck it in simply do it under another zone...I hate to see an animal suffer.

All that being said as long as this deer is not going to make it...if he has a shot then its your call.  I dont agree with alot of the rules of my state but I abide by them unless it comes down to an injured animal.

[JEFF B]

you made the right choice  

[Billy]

I have looked pcappy in the eye, talked with him and believe him to be an honest, honorable hunter.
Pete, you KNOW that in NJ; had you been caught you would have been 'tried and convicted' on the spot!! You also know that all the arguments -for and against- are born of personal experience.
You now have something to go to the CO with and ask for a 'ruling'. I think you'll find you did the right and legal thing.
I for one, stand with the view, that we put too much "humanity" into an animal's thoughts and emotions.
I won't willingly let an animal suffer. I won't ascribe my feelings to their species; nor will I break the law to be humane.
The laws may be wrong but; either we abide by them,
or they will be used against us and our fellow hunters/trappers.
Sleep well Pete, you did the "more right" thing in your case.

[Killdeer]

Right on, Billy.

pcappy08, it was a difficult choice, and I applaud your compassion. I recently made a hard choice in the woods, and these questions occurred to me as I was making the decision:

What would have happened if I had not been here? Is he any worse off for my having been here?

The law is blind to the pain that you witnessed. The law could be modified through channels, but then the next slippery slope would be to determine exactly how bad off or with what injuries would it be legal to execute a "mercy killing." Otherwise, every big buck in a "does only unit" with a scrape on his hide, or a limp from a stone bruise would find himself a candidate for our warm, fuzzy, compassionate weapons.

Nature is blind to the pain you witnessed. It has no compassion for the individual critter (or us) and that is a hard thing for a human heart to swallow. But that is how it was before we ever set foot on the planet, and will be after we are gone. We ARE made different than the critters, we are saddled with conscience, the basis of knowing right from wrong, good from evil. That conscience causes much consternation and pain, but it has its rewards. It also separates us from our source, the natural world, and the organic basis of our existence. I find myself reconnected to that Source through my experiences in the wild, especially through the gift of an animal given me for succor. That is why I hunt, and why I go and seek the beauty, and sometimes the pain, that is found every time we walk the hunting path.

You saw the pain, and were saddened by it. You are a balanced human with good conscience. You obeyed the law, which means that you can go out hunting again. Walk in Beauty, and gather the Light.

Killdeer  

[swampjoe]

"Nature is blind to the pain you witnessed."  "Walk in Beauty, and gather the Light."

So beautifully written Killdeer, as always.  

pcappy, your personal ethics are not up for discussion, even here among your friends.  This choice was personal and there is no right or wrong answer.  The law abiding aspect is a difficult point.  Of course the correct way to view it is that the law is the law.  I wonder - here in Canada, we have to register our long guns - if you don't, you are a criminal.  Think about that and it's various implications for a moment.  I have.  Turns out I consort with a lot of criminals - criminals who were fine upstanding community men the day before the legislation came into effect.  In my opinion, they still are.

To answer your question what would I have done?  I'd have taken him.  In a blink.  With a game warden beside me, pad in hand.  But if I hadn't I'd put it behind me and move on. Forget about it and get back out there pcappy....we need more hunters like you in the bush.

[TRAP]

Deer are pretty tough and this one may survive the ordeal.  If not, the protein, he produced will not be wasted.  

No right or wrong decision here, It will turn out good either way.  Either for the deer or for the coyotes.

Trap

[Jeff Roberts]

Tough choice for sure but more than likely he will survive. There is no excuse for intentionally breaking a law. I would have let him pass for that reason and I also believe he will survive. If he doesn't then that is the way nature works and nature lets nothing go to waste. Here in the south with the brown its down mentality, we see and harvest deer every year that are disfigured to some degree so they are tough and do survive most of the times.

[jrchambers]

i belive what ever choice you make in that situation is the right one, but i also belive that if the animal is wounded naturaly, not by humans that it would not be wrong to  let nature run its course, now if you saw it was shot or hit by a vehicle, it would be no question to shoot,

[longbow59]

If it were me I would have shot the deer. The reason I would have killed the deer because to me that was the right thing to do. I don't care what the law says, you can't have a law to cover every situation. And I could live with what ever the conquences of my decsion were. There are situations that transend the laws of man. I would have slept good that night knowing what I did. This is my opinion I am not being judgemental, but the fact you wrote this post tells me you wish you were back in the tree?

[Little Tree]

I agree with longbow59. Well put. I do however care what the law says, but in some cases law doesn't cover every situation in nature, sometimes natural law trumps societal law.

[John Nail]

True story:
Some years ago, a young man hit a deer right at dusk in front of my house. He knocked on the door, called his dad to report the NEW car he had wrecked, and called the game warden. At that time, we had one who was trying to make a name for himself(he certainly did). We waited about 45 min. The kid knocked again, and said the deer was crying and suffering terribly. I went to look, and sure enough, there was blood coming out of it's mouth, labored breathing, and it couldn't get up. At least one broken leg. I went for the "house pistol" and shot it. I told the kid to tell the warden what we did, and to NOT waste the meat. In due time- about an hour- the warden knocked on my door. He shined his light in my eyes as if I was a criminal and threatened to arrest me for shooting the deer. He said only HE could decide if the deer should be put down, to which I added that he should have come sooner then. He paced back and forth obviously angry at me, until I asked him what he was so "on" about. He said, "I'm trying to decide wheather to arrest you or not!" I said "Well, I'll help you" and shut and locked my door. Turned off the porch light, and went to bed--after calling my friend and neighbor, the county sheriff, who came over and straightened  the mess out. Point is: I WAS TRYING TO DO THE RIGHT THING. That didn't matter one bit to that particular woods cop. I'm sure an older head would have considered it.

[Steve B.]

Obedience to conscience comes first, always.

[bowless]

You did the right thing.  It was never really your decision.  I wouldn't be surprised at all if the deer grows to be a great buck.

[nutmeg]

It's a tough call I guess but, I would have let him walk given all of the facts you stated. (nut)