Help requested setting up my new longbow

[jhg]

Hello
I am just starting to shoot my 7 Lakes longbow which I like a lot. Its 62#. My draw is just about 30". FF string. Off the shelf. Knock about 3/8ths above. I am closing in on the sweet brace height...

 I am a new archer and am shooting instinctive.

BUT-

All the arrow tuning info has me reeling.

This summer I am going to ruin some arrows so what would the recommendation be to:
1) find what works either carbon or aluminum for my bow.

2) how to do that without buying several sets of arrows that I won't be able to use.

3) a not too expensive shaft I can practice with all summer and still use to hunt with if I want (elk).

4) I have read a lot about weight experimentation to get things dialed in and don't really know what to have on hand. What do I need as a tip, knock, insert etc "Kit" so I won't go nuts not having  what I need or having a bunch of stuff I can't use?

Thanks in advance.

Joshua

[Jeff Strubberg]

You going to need a fair amount of spine for that setup.  If you want to go carbon, try a CX350 with a 150 grain or 175 grain point.

Congrats on the 7 lakes.  I really enjoy mine.

[30coupe]

Beman ICS Bowhunter shafts are inexpensive and work great. They don't cost any more than aluminum and seem to tune very well.

I think someone here could help you get close but we would need to know the draw weight you are pulling at your draw length and what point weight you are using. You could also download the Dynamic Spine Calculator in the thread near the top of the PowWow. I have used it and found it will get you REAL close.

Bisch

[Rob DiStefano]

if yer bow is cut to centershot, or fairly close, shaft spine will be far less of issue - perhaps no issue at all.

i mostly shoot those cheap beman ics bowhunter shafts.  i have one shaft size, the 500, and my resulting 29" arrow works well out of all my longbows, from 43# to 55#.  i pull the full length of the shaft and my woodsman heads touch the front edge of the riser as a sorta 'draw check'.

i tailor the arrow's weight by varying the front end weight.  arrows range from 430 to 590 grains.  they all fly just great - FOR ME.  and therein lies the crux of the matter - all talk about what will or won't work for each of us, Particularly With Carbons, is just a starting point and each of us needs to put in the testing.  your form plays a critical role in arrow flight, as well.
 
in your case, i'd probably wanna go with an ics bowhunter in 400 spine.

[jhg]

# is 62 at my draw. The bow is not centershot.

I will try the Bemans. Do I need to get a variety of different weighted field tips, or is weight added/subtracted using another method?

Thanks for the help so far.

Joshua

[Rob DiStefano]

take one full length beman shaft and epoxy in the insert.  the nock is already installed.  buy or borrow different screw-in field points, from 125gr to 200-250gr.  

shoot the one bare shaft at 5-10 yards.  see how it flys and lands in the target.  carefully note the performance.  modify the shaft shorter.

to modify the shaft, cut off at the nock end in 1/2" increments, down to the length you think you'll need for hunting.  

whatever bare shaft length appears to work the best - not necessarily the most perfectly - fletch up that shaft and shoot.  if all is well, there's yer arrow, go make up the rest and .... practice!   :D

[jhg]

I'm on it!  I'll report back in a week or so and let you know how it went.

Joshua, psyched!

[jhg]

Rob-
Okay, now I 've been shopping should I get the 300 spine or the 400 spine Beman ics BowH? There is just  enough info out there to suggest 300...

My computor won't run the dynamic calculator.

Joshua, making it harder than it has to be ... but thanks.

[Rob DiStefano]

unlike with alums, it's a crap shoot of sorts with carbons.  that's just the way it is.

i'm shootin 29.25" beman ics 500's (35-55#) out of a 55# holding weight longbow, with 350 grains up front, for a total all up arrow weight of 590 grains.  by all the charts i should be using at least 400's.  

i find carbons to be far stiffer than any of the brand charts suggest.  and all the spine calculators and theories are interesting at best, to me.  it took me a lotta time and money to realize they're all broad brush strokes - again, for me.  

so, sorry - i can't honestly suggest what carbon type and spine will work best for you.  if yer bow is at centershot, or very close, their probably won't be much difference 'tween either the 340 or 400 ics spine.

[aYak]

300 might be too stiff, any other opinions out there?  You can purchase 'test' packages from 3-Rivers.  Can you go 340 instead of 300?

[Mo. Huntin]

I can go to a bow shop around here and just by a couple arrows of what I think may work, I hope that is an option for you.  Then order the field point test kit from 3 rivers and it should be their in no time.  Test away good luck.  I don't shoot as much poundage as you so I will not make any suggestions on an arrow because I don't know for sure. I would just use the factory inserts unless you want a lot of weight on the front end of your arrow.  Some do some don't.  I don't want to start a war but some would say you may want a decent amount of weight on the front for elk.  Some will say you don't need it.  I never shot one so I don't know.

[30coupe]

I'll second what Rob said about carbons. They are stiff little buggers for me too. I also shoot 500s in my bows ranging from 46-55#. To get 400s to shoot, I had to leave them full length and weight the front...a lot! I ended up with arrows over 600 grains. I wanted to stay in the 9-10 grains per pound of draw weight range, with high or extremely high FOC. I get that with the ICS 500s cut to 29.5 to 29.75 (still experimenting a little there). With a 145 grain FP, I'm at 505 grains total (9.71 gpp from my 52# Kanati) and 20.59% FOC. Life is good.

Also, as Rob said, your mileage may vary.

[jhg]

Thanks for the big picture. i feel pretty good now about ordering some 400's. I shot the bow tonight at the local range and tried an uncut  Gold Tip Traditional 5575 with a brass insert in front of a 125grn tip.
I had an Easton 2216 Gamegetter given to me that flies better, but it is cut to 31" (a little short) Point being at least I can tell when an arrow flies better than another and thats a good thing for us new archers with the dew still on our ears experience wise...

Did I mention I really like my Seven Lakes bow? A lot faster than a 55# Bighorn recurve I shot last week.  I should mention though the Bighorn Custom put an arrow in the spot I aimed it almost every time and I am very new to instinctive. Impressively easy bow to shoot.

Joshua

[jhg]

Update.

I have the Beman 400 ICS bowhunter shafts w/ 4 inch left helical fletching. Right now my best arrow flight using field pts is brass insert behind a 250 grn tip.  I also went ahead and put on a 1/2 inch long 2117 footing on the tip for a total arrow weight of 640grns.

Right now I get a slight knock right on almost all (99%) of my shots at 10-20yds.

Questions:
1. going to a broadhead will it be alright to add a bit more to the tip? Its cheap to get a couple different weight adaptors (Aboyer) behind the broadhead.


2.In your opinion what would be a good FOC for this arrow considering the above? Or am I there already and should add weight to the knock end instead?

Thanks

Joshua

[short slugger]

jhg, I shoot a 62# Elburg longbow { I have 4 of them} and I have 2 Bighorn recurves. These are in varied weights of poundage of 55-62#.  I shoot 2020 alum. with all of them, just vary the length of shaft and broadhead weight from 125-150 grains. I paper tune each until a bullet hole is produced. One arrow shaft for 6 bows adjusted to each. 2020 are strong and heavy giving finished grains weights of 620-685. Flies true. My son just went to carbons, wanting to try something different. Carbons work good for him, Good luck.

[Rob DiStefano]

imo, there's no such thing as too much foc. sounds like all ya need to do is add some sharp broadheads and just go hunting (fall's coming soon enuf!).  enjoy.