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Author Topic: Wolf or Coyote  (Read 1638 times)

Offline Recurve50 LBS

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Wolf or Coyote
« on: September 10, 2009, 11:55:00 PM »
I got a phone call from my cousin who lives in Movtville Ct. Both he and his wife took 3 pictures of an animal they think may be a wolf. My cousin estimated the animal weighed 100 pounds.And that it was with several others that looked the same.

They e mailed me 3 pictures.When I enlarged them on the computer the pictures were a bit blurry but to me the animal in question looked like a big coyote.

I have seen a coyote on his property several years ago. I have also seen them and killed one here in NJ. But the one I killed on the ground with my bow at 10 yards didn't weigh near 100 pounds.

So has anyone in New England know of wolfs in that area? If it is a coyote what are the game laws regarding shooting them? They do have a small dog that they do put out on a line in the back yard and they are out in the yard very often.To say the leaste they are pretty concerned and are looking for some sound advice.

Thank you
Larry W.

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1966 42#@28" Bear Grizley

Offline doeboy

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Re: Wolf or Coyote
« Reply #1 on: September 11, 2009, 07:28:00 AM »
Recurve50 LBS,

I hunted in the Cooperstown, New York area for years and one of the local trappers got a coyote that was 90 pounds! I saw it on the scale with my own eyes or would not have believed it.

We had seen it live when we were spotting deer (private land) and we thought it was a lost black lab(it was black!)

I dont think its the norm, but they do trap them in the 60-70 pound range often.Post a pic so we can get some guys from the west to comment.

Good Luck

Offline LongStick64

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Re: Wolf or Coyote
« Reply #2 on: September 11, 2009, 07:42:00 AM »
I often see large 'yotes downstate. Almost all have been in the 70lb range, look like a large German Shepard. Deer herd in Westchester is booming so food is plentiful.
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Offline mrpenguin

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Re: Wolf or Coyote
« Reply #3 on: September 11, 2009, 07:49:00 AM »
I live in CT and yes... there are definitely wolves in the state.  They came in the NW corner and have moved their way down and east, just like the moose and bear have.  Though not highly populous in CT, they are here.  Montville is on the eastern side of the state, but has the right habitat for wolves.  In all honesty, without seeing the photo, it is difficult to say whether the dog they saw is a wolf.  It is possible at that size... that said we have BIG coyotes in this state and they are reproducing at rate that DEP allows round the year hunting of coyotes (except a few weeks during opening season for guns).  

Can you post pics?
God Bless,
Erik
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Offline buckeye_hunter

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Re: Wolf or Coyote
« Reply #4 on: September 11, 2009, 08:06:00 AM »
According to a wildlife biologist I spoke with a few yeears back, all coyote's in the Eastern US are not pure coyote, they are crossed with the red wolf. Accordingly, our coyotes are much larger than what is seen out west. I shot at one last deer season here in Ohio that went about 50-60lbs. Good size canine.

-Charlie

Offline Jeremy

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Re: Wolf or Coyote
« Reply #5 on: September 11, 2009, 08:13:00 AM »
There are some BIG coyotes in the state, but one of the high up state biologists tells me there haven't been any credible wolf sightings.  Mountain lion yes (sightings backed up by tracks).  Populations are on the move though...
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Offline pcappy08

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Re: Wolf or Coyote
« Reply #6 on: September 11, 2009, 08:15:00 AM »
Recurve50LBS,
Cant say for sure but it would not surprise me in the least for it to be a wolf.  They can travel great distances without ever being noticed.  I remember a few years ago hearing of a pair that went from the northern midwest and ended up being caught down in Mississippi.  Also people look at me like i am nuts when i tell them but i am positive i saw a wolf while hunting in jersey a few years ago.
He stood as tall as a full grown doe, and had to be 125lbs+ also had the shorter rounder ears and snout unlike a coyote.  
Either way my advice would be to keep the on the leash close and dont leave it out at night
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Offline Michael Arnette

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Re: Wolf or Coyote
« Reply #7 on: September 11, 2009, 10:39:00 AM »
You can't trust state biologists, I have talked to several in past years and none would admit that mountain lions were present in the eastern part of Oklahoma in any numbers. Then a couple of years ago they came out and made a statement: POOOF-there was a stable population in every county. I don't know about the wolf sighting but I do know that wolfs don't look like coyotes. So I would have to look at a picture. Here in Oklahoma coyotes are very small but the eastern subspecies that is present in new jersey gets much bigger.

Offline Recurve50 LBS

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Re: Wolf or Coyote
« Reply #8 on: September 11, 2009, 10:56:00 AM »
Thanks for the input folks. Since I am computer stupid I can't post pictures here, but if you pm me with your e mail address I can forward the pictures to you.
Larry W.

Member TANJ

NRA Life Member

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62" 45#@28" Turkey Creek Longbow
1966 42#@28" Bear Grizley

Offline artifaker1

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Re: Wolf or Coyote
« Reply #9 on: September 11, 2009, 12:10:00 PM »
It sounds like you guys have some coydogs up there. Coydogs are a big problem (coyotes crossed with dogs). Coyotes never bred with wolfs before, but they definitely do breed with dogs.
A big coyote will go for 30lbs. Dig out some of your old Fur Fish and Game Mags, they talked about that a lot in that mag.
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Offline straitera

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Re: Wolf or Coyote
« Reply #10 on: September 11, 2009, 12:53:00 PM »
Could be crossed w/dog. If proportionately wiley, they'll make short work of your pet on the leash. Coyotes are primarily pack animals and have no trouble with larger kills. At 100# they'll not have to work hard. We have no coyotes near that size in Texas.
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Offline wtpops

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Re: Wolf or Coyote
« Reply #11 on: September 11, 2009, 01:02:00 PM »
Can you post the pics. Ive seen some big yotes here in California. 100# is big but with a winter coat a yote can look very heavy.

Coydogs, thats interesting, never thought of that.
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Offline Drew

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Re: Wolf or Coyote
« Reply #12 on: September 11, 2009, 01:09:00 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by artifaker1:
 Coyotes never bred with wolfs before, but they definitely do breed with dogs.
A big coyote will go for 30lbs.
The first statement is false and DNA research in Canada is proving that, the eastern (nortern) US "coyotes" are not the same coyotes as the western states. The skull needs to be measured and the DNA checked to clarify. Canada is getting set to release some information once the DNA testing is done to show what the Eastern/Northern area has is a wolf subspecies, dubbed the "the small eastern wolf". Mostly coyote markings but small to medium wolf genetics.

Coyotes are the MOST over estimated animal on the earth in my opinion, most claim 50lbs until they hit the scales and show 30-40. Big eastern coyotes can push 40-60lbs, one "coyote" caught in canada weighed in at 75lbs and was proven to be of wolf origin, the DNA test is forecoming.

Coydogs are common, but nature tends to be harsh on that sub species, as the 50/50 females come into heat late summer/early fall so the pups are born in the winter, also the M/F pair will not bond if the male is a dog so the female is left alone to try and raise the pups during the harshest time of the year. So coydogs do happen often but nature weeds them out over time. Sub females will help with the feeding but survival rates are low.

Years of trapping and calling, and research have help me sort of alot of stuff...but there's no clear answer. It will be interesting in the upcoming years to see what DNA test prove and how states manage the coyotes especially is a sub species includes the word "wolf" but the marking show coyote.

So you might have seen a new species or you might have seen a plain jane big eastern coyote. The western ones look like pups compared to ours.

Here's a few pics.

75# "coyote" caught in canada the measurements say "wolf" and I'm sure the DNA will say the same, with coyote markings.
 

notice the difference in head size and shape when it's next to a "big" north/east coyote.
 
Just a Coyote Soul out wandering...

Offline Chris Wilson

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Re: Wolf or Coyote
« Reply #13 on: September 11, 2009, 04:44:00 PM »
Drew...That big boy's definately not pure coyote.  cool picture.
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Offline joevan125

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Re: Wolf or Coyote
« Reply #14 on: September 11, 2009, 05:04:00 PM »
WOW
Joe Van Kilpatrick

Offline hickstick

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Re: Wolf or Coyote
« Reply #15 on: September 11, 2009, 05:31:00 PM »
and A gray wolf was shot and DNA verified along the Mass-CT border last year.   a farmer had been loosing sheep over a period, and ended up shooting the culprit in the act.

   News story of the event  

   USA today story  

so in all actuality it could be a wolf.
Diagonally parked in a parallel universe.

Offline Lone archer

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Re: Wolf or Coyote
« Reply #16 on: September 11, 2009, 05:46:00 PM »
I live on the boarder of NY and CT and have killed only one 55# coyote the others were 45/50. I was on stand deer hunting and watched 7-8 coyotes comb a section of woods in a line and regroup before going into my neighbors backyard at 5 in the afternoon.

On Easter Sunday a few years back I videoed my lab (95#)playing with a coyote in the backyard. He would chase her out of the yard (eletric fence) then she would chase him back in. When I finally called him in the house the coyote came back in the yard and sat there waiting for him to come out for a good 15 minutes.

Offline sweeney3

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Re: Wolf or Coyote
« Reply #17 on: September 11, 2009, 06:24:00 PM »
THAT is a monster coyote, if it is a coyote.  

We get coydogs (coyote/domestic dog) around here.  If the cross happens to be with a good sized dog such as a German Shepard or something, you can get a pretty big coyote with pretty interesting features.
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Offline Mo. Huntin

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Re: Wolf or Coyote
« Reply #18 on: September 11, 2009, 06:57:00 PM »
This has turned in to a very interesting thread.

Offline Bonebuster

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Re: Wolf or Coyote
« Reply #19 on: September 11, 2009, 08:59:00 PM »
Drew, that is an AWESOME photo.

Coyote eyes, stuck in the skull of what is OBVIOUSLY of wolf descent.

A fifty pound coyote is HUGE. Although rare they do occur, with even larger ones, and with more frequency.

Personally, I believe the wily coyote is changing
or "evolving" before our very eyes. Wolf blood, or domestic dog, causing the size increase, doesn`t really matter. They are larger, smarter, and more able to adapt than ever before.

I`ve been calling in and shooting coyotes during our nightime hunting season with great success for the past fifteen years. The average weight has increased dramatically, especially in the past five years. The gaunt, shy, small boned,  mouse eaters of decades past are all but gone. There`s a new kid in town.

Cool thread.

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