Tapered arrows? I'm just full of questions today

[JBiorn]

I keep seeing parallel shafts, tapered shafts, and BARREL tapered shafts! What in the world am I missing?

 Could someone please explain to me the difference?

 Jeff

[macbow]

Parrell= same diameter whole length
barrell = tapered on both ends
Tapered = usually tapered on the nock end. Like from 11/32 down to 5/16 lets you use a 5/16 nock and have better clearence from the bow and less finger pinch on the nock between fingers.

My opinion is that I like the 5/16 nock part other wise if spined correctly I don't see much difference in shooting.
Ron

[JBiorn]

Thanks Mac----your a good man. A Gentleman and a Scholar.

 Jeff

[the Ferret]

From draft 1 of my new Chapter for TBB4 on arrows: (y'all get a sneak peak)    


Although all natural arrow shafting such as cane/bamboo/reeds and shoots are full length tapered, called bob-tailed, being naturally larger at one end and tapering straight their full length to the other end, once split timber shafting became available, it allowed for other types of shafting to be made. Parallel shafting is where there is no tapering at all to the shaft with all sides running parallel to each other the full length of the shaft. Breasted tapered shafts have the last seven to ten inches reduced in diameter improving flight characterisitics and fletching wear without reducing spine. Barrel tapered shafting is where the shafting is thickest in the center then tapers down on both ends. Sometimes used for flight arrows to lighten the arrow without reducing spine. Of course bob-tailed or tapered arrow shafting  where the arrow is thickest at one end and follows a straight taper for the entire length of the shaft, just like a natural cane/bamboo/reed or shoot shaft, can be made from split timber shafting as well.  Tapered shafting improves both flight characteristics and reduces weight and spine as compared to a parallel shaft.

[JBiorn]

So, for hunting arrows I should be using parallel shafts, right?

 Jeff

[the Ferret]

LOL well I use tapered arrows (or bob-tailed arrows)  and breasted arrows because I shoot non centershot longbows and selfbows and the tapered arrows clear the riser better and provide more fletch clearance, but if you shoot a centershot or near centershot riser on a recurve or hybrid traditional bow you could certainly shoot parallel shafts. The majority of traditional archers do.

[StanM]

I use a modified barrel tapered shaft for hunting and shooting.  Once I find an arrow that works well, I don't like to change from target arrows to hunting arrows.  I taper the point end of my arrows just a bit.  I do this to insure that the shaft is just smaller in diameter than the ferrule of the broadhead.  I taper the nock end to 5/16th of an inch over the last 10" of the shaft.

Stan

[aromakr]

Mickey:
I think you need to do some more research, your discription of Breasted tapered is not correct!!!
Bob

[**DONOTDELETE**]

So is it not a good idea to use parrallel shafts on a bow thats not centershot?

[the Ferret]

Bob just googled it and this is what I found. You have a source that disputes?

  http://members.aol.com/tradbowmd/archdict.htm  

Bow'n Dictionary of
Traditional Archery Terms

breasted arrow / An arrow where the last 7-10 inches of the nocked end (the breast) is tapered (e.g., from 23/64 to 5/16) to improve flight characteristics and feather wear. Especially helpful for longbows (which are not center shot).

breast / The area of the shaft forward of the fletching and about six to nine inches from the nock.

[JBiorn]

WOW!! So, who wants to build me some breasted arrows?

[the Ferret]

On an interesting side note according to mythology the Amazons were a race of women who removed one breast to make for more clearance when shooting their bows. An arrow tapered in the last 10" would also have this same effect at full draw. Coincidence? LOL

[JBiorn]

hehe...

[aromakr]

Mickey:
You need to read "Target Archery" By Dr. Robert Elmer,1946. A breasted taper is similar to a barreled shaft, the difference being the parallel (or fat)section of the arrow is moved towards the nock end. In other words you have a shorter taper on the nock end than you do on the point end. Lengths of those tapers can vary quite a lot. I have arrows in my collection where the nock end taper is only 4-5 inches to as much as 8-9". The "Breast" is so named because thats the portion of the arrow that rests against the strike plate, when the arrow is nocked and before the string is drawn.
Bob

[the Ferret]

I read Target Archery by Elmer years ago, but I have trouble retaining lots of technical info, which Target Archery contains. I have the same problem with Hardy's Longbow Book.

So you're saying instead of the 7-10" that I stated (and which was listed in the terms dictionary)that Elmer says it's what?  5-9"? Seems there is variation and room for interpretation there no matter whose figures I use.

If the breast truly sits against the strike plate then for most bows the fat portion of the "breast" would have to be from approx 6 1/2 -9"  as listed n the definition of "breast" above wouldn't it? (assuming a brace height of from 5 3/4" for a longbow to 7 3/4" for a recurve plus X" for a portion of the width of the riser )

I have read nowhere that a breasted arrow is tapered towards the tip as well as the nock (which I would consider a version of barrel tapering), but in the interest of fact I will keep researching and will amend my writings if I find evidence of such.

Thanks for the homework Bob    

[Van/TX]

Good stuff as far as history goes.  The cheapest grade Easton aluminum shaft made 45 or 50 years ago will shoot rings around any wood arrow that was ever built or can be built today.  With the quality of wood today I just don't see how much you can gain with other than parallel unless you are a World Class competitive shooter and looking for the lightest shaft for the spine you require.  I like tapered and barrelled though cause they look cool        ...Van

[the Ferret]

Van on a glass bow cut to within 1/8" of center or less I would agree with you that no one would be much able to notice. However on a non center shot bow it doesn't take that much to notice the difference. Those who have tried river cane shafts (which are full length tapered by their very nature) have, to a man, noticed how the shafts will fly cleaner from a variety of weight bows, the reason being they recover quicker from paradox and have more shaft clearance than a parallel tapered shaft.

Aluminum tubing was another invention, like fiberglass, that caused a giant leap forward in archery here in the states due to the increased accuracy made available by centershot bows and straight arrows of like spine and weight. The next giant leap forward IMO was the Berger button designed by Vic Berger which reduced and counteracted somewhat the paradox.

[Van/TX]

Ferret, I must say that I've never shot a river cane shaft, tapered or non-tapered.  And probably won't ever do so      So I must take your word for it.  :D   I think we were talking about current wood shafting that most folks would be shooting these days if not shooting aluminum or carbon    ...Van

[aromakr]

Mickey:
First I think we have to realize that modern archery is hundreds of years old, and many of the terms we used were coined hundreds of years ago. In fact the word breasted (or chested) was first written in Toxophilus in 1545 by Roger Ascham, a bow in that time would have a brace heigth (fistmele) of about 6" and the recurve was not even a part of the scene. Elmer describes breasted as the thickest (part of the shaft) at the breast and tapers both ways. Barrelled being thickest in the middle differing from the breasted type in having the swelling farther forward. Page 280 paragraph 4. In paragraph 3 he states. "One might suppoose that the narural form of a Stele (shaft) would be cylindrical throughout, but I cannot recall having ever seen an arrow of this type made by what might be called archer races of men. In fact, I think they are almost uniquely a product of modern american manufacture."
Several people on this and other sites have stated they see no difference in performance of tapered and parallel shafts. Elmer goes on to state. "Breasted arrows are very similar to barrelled. They may not be quite as stiff in the longer foreshaft but the difference is negligible. Their advantagous features is that they apparently fly with a lower trajectory than either barrelled or parallel arrows of the same weight. In some recent test at 100 yards Bill Jackson found that breasted arrows consistently grouped a half a target higher than barrelled or paralled ones, when he had used every effort to make them otherwise alike" Remember Elmer is talking target archery, which means the American or York round using 48" mats, half a target is  then 24". This tells me the arrow is overcoming paradox faster creating less drag on the arrow, thus printing higher on the target.
I can hear the cries now, But I don't shoot at animals at 100 yards, no either do I but the arrow spinning on its axis at impact equates to deeper penetration.
Hope this helps, didn't mean to get on the soap box, but I want to make sure when people write articles and books they get the facts correct. There is an old saying that is so true. "When you tell an un-truth enough it eventually becomes fact"
Bob

[the Ferret]

I understand Bob, but as Van suggested we have totally hijacked this thread with this discussion.

I can promise you I'll do my best to make my chapter as truthful as I can, using lots of research methods and texts in the process. If I can find other research that backs up what Mr Ashram says great, and I'll keep digging, but so far the only other research that I have located that describes breasted arrows states it somewhat differently.

Thanks for bringing it to my attention.