what gives us hunters a bad name?

[SteveB]

Take up target archery if you don`t eat what you kill.  

Never saw this in the rules. Did not know I have to eat the woodchucks, coyotes, etc I kill every year. Deer are very overpopulated every year where I hunt - as in years past, I will kill far more then I can eat personally. Those I don't use will be given to any of a number of people I know will utilize them - seldom preselected. I will continue to do so legally and refuse to be judged by anyone - anti or elitist.

[NorthernCaliforniaHunter]

I think that's generally the theme here, Steve. I too kill coyotes and other critters I won't eat. My conscience is clear.

What's being debated here, as I understand it, is perception. Had this man simply asked if anyone wanted any venison and been on his way I don't think we'd of heard about it. My personal position is that we will do the sport and ourselves a great service to speak with reverent and respectful words with regards to what we kill and why we kill it. Most people are rational and given enough reason will see the logic in things like predator depredation.

My $.02 is up.

[BobW]

Lets not fight amongst ourselves on this one.  Doing that, and "they" have won.  There shouldn't be a person on this forum that objects to the benefical use of an animal harvested, be it the one who harvested it, or made sure one in need was supplied.

It is all in how we present ourselves in the actions we either elect to take, or must (interesting post on an "Aussie" brother who had to do the unpleasant thing to put suffering critters down with an act of archery - see "Dry Fire Help" thread -  I can only imagine what his non-hunting accomplices thought, though I am sure it was done in a "tasteful/respectful" manner).

Even the limiting of nuissance animals should be heralded as "done right" as such controls help rebalance the tilt in the natural process we have caused in out growth.  But never at the disrespect of the animal.  
That makes us look poor.

We have a mighty responsibility....

[Gordon martiniuk]

Whats the problem sounds like you want to put your morality in front of his he is going to give it away not wast it I think you should give your head a shake its not you that should decide what he does with his deer if he wants to hunt and take game it's his business not yours!      

[Bonebuster]

I don`t eat coyotes I kill either. I do eat woodchucks. (fantastic eating) I do not eat ground squirrels that tear into the garden. Or skunks...possums...ect.

I DO think that when someone kills an animal such as a DEER, without ever having any intention of eating it, that it DOES give hunters a bad name. Donating the meat is a very good thing. BUT... Some people are always going to equate killing something you don`t eat, or EVER intend to eat, as killing for the joy of it. Regardless of what happens to the meat.

This thread is about what gives hunters a bad name. I believe this is one of them.

I did not intend to try to force my morals on anyone. I am not an anti, or any type of elitist.    

 I wish I could take more deer than I could eat. Since having kids, it has never happened.  

[Gray Buffalo]

When in the woods I conduct my self to my standards which I like to think are higher then most. I won’t shoot at an animal unless I have a 90% chance of making a clean kill. I won’t shoot if the animal is over 20 yards. I won’t shoot a moving animal. These are my rules for my self and I do not impose my rules on anyone else. You can discuss this until hell freezes over and still not please everyone.

[Mo. Huntin]

Dang guys I was going to let this die but its back up so.  I don't think the problem is with him killing something he won't eat it is that he did not have a plan ahead of time.  How hard is it to ask a couple people ahead of time?  You would not go into the mountains and kill a giant elk and then think hmmm How am I going to get this thing out of here? I don' understand why anyone would disagree with that.  I don't know why it keeps going back to just killing something you are not going to eat.  I saw an idiot at the local Sonic walking up to car after car and asking if they wanted a deer that was dead in the back of his truck, tell me how that is going to look to someone who does not hunt.

[jhg]

... we will do the sport and ourselves a great service to speak with reverent and respectful words with regards to what we kill and why we kill it. ... [/QB]

That is worth repeating.

I know it rankles some to have to moderate their language in any way regarding a sport they feel strongly is their given right to participate in, but when we speak about hunting and only describe it in terms of our first "kill" and our bow has "drawn blood" or has been "bloodied" it does not forward our message in regards to those who might be on the fence in forming opinions about whether or not to become anti.

Its not that hard to be thoughtful when choosing how we express ourselves about hunting, a first successful hunt or a new bow that was used toward that end. And it is not an inroad on our autonomy or our independence by doing so.

I'm impressed with trad bowhunters  though. A more conscientious group I think would be hard to find anywhere.

Joshua

[Steve H.]

So only the killer of game should be able to eat it?  

"Sorry, honey but I killed it so you don't get any!  I know you cooked it but you now the rules....none for you either little Billy!"

Sounds kinda retarded doesn't it?!

Who cares who eats it just so somebody does!  

I need to become a known shipper on an air cargo carrier between billy shipp and myself!

[Ybuck]

For myself, part of the hunt is eating the kill.

[misfire]

I believe just the fact that we hunt gives us a bad name in some circles. I have met some very narrow minded people that when they find out I hunt the first thing outta their mouth is "OMG you kill Bambi"! My response to that is "No, I do not kill Bambi because Bambi is a fictional cartoon character". When I try to talk with them about hunting they want nothing to do with it. People like this will always consider us "bad" and no amount of discussion will change their minds. The problem is that they are raising their children to think like them.

***Soapbox***
We need to stick together as hunters, supporting each others right to hunt no matter what method is chosen as long as those methods are legal. We need to educate our children in ethical hunting ways. If they choose to be hunters then that is wonderful. If they do not at least they will be non-hunters who understand what real hunting is.
***done***

[freefeet]

Originally posted by misfire:
We need to stick together as hunters, supporting each others right to hunt no matter what method is chosen as long as those methods are legal.

I would disagree with this statement.

Until recently it was legal in the UK to get a pack of 50 dogs that were selectively bred to not be fast enough to catch the fox or deer they were chasing thus making the fox or deer run terrified for several hours until it was totally exhausted at which time said pack of dogs would then catch up to it and tear it to pieces and the goons on horses that chased after the dogs would cover each other in the blood of the torn apart carcass of the quarry claiming it was a tradition.

This kind of legal hunting turned the majority of the UK population against hunting - all kinds of hunting were tarred with the same brush of the cruelty perceived by the general public when they saw the pictures and videos of dog pack hunting.  I am proud to say that i personally protested against this barbaric cruelty and am totally glad that it is now illegal.  If again it is legalised i will again become an anti against it.

Sticking together with all hunters regardless of whatever attitude and methods they use whether legal or not is to my mind just going to tar the ethical hunters with the same brush as the sickos who have no regard or respect whatsoever for the animals they hunt.

You are extremely lucky in the USA to have the opportunities to bow hunt the beautiful places that i see in the photos that people post on this forum.  But you live in a democracy and it's all too easy to set people onto the anti's side if they perceive pointless cruelty or senseless killing.  The more you send to the anti's side, the more chance you will end up with more and more controls and limitations on what you can hunt, how you can hunt and where you can hunt, until you end up like the UK where it's basically impossible to hunt without break some law unless you have a lot of land or a lot of money.

[Buckeye Trad Hunter]

I agree freefeet, just because they're a hunter doesn't make them an advocate for the sport.  Someone who aimlessly kills an animal with no prior plan of usage and openly says "if no one takes it it's gonna feed the coyotes" may as well be an anti because they are only giving fuel to the fire.

[Traxx]

Good points Freefeet.Nothing like a perspective from those who have had their hunting rights taken away.there is one thing i have not heard mentioned or brought up in this thread.Refridgeration and freezers were invented long ago.why cant someone who may not be inclined to eat what they kill,freeze the meat untill a worthy recipient is found?Its not like we hafta eat it before it goes bad anymore.

[Dave Bulla]

Okay... I read the whole thing and here's my take on it.

I do NOT have any problem with someone killing a bunch of deer and giving them away.  I think hunters for the hungry and food pantry donations are a great boon to the overall reputation of hunters in general and I wish I was in a position to donate a couple deer per year myself.  I have in the past accepted deer from friends who had shot them and didn't want them.

However... What I do have a problem with is going out and killing a deer with no intentions of using it in any way regardless of whether you find someone who wants it or not.  If you go back and read again, it started out that this guy came into a shop and asked if anyone wanted a deer he'd shot.  So far so good but what if nobody wants it?  He said that it'd be "coyote food".  Why?  Because he was being lazy.  Had a sob story that he had to go to work or something like that.  Again, PROBLEM.  

What I'm getting at is basic responsibility.

If you kill a deer and don't want to eat it then you have a responsibility to see that it does not go to waste.  As someone else said above, it's the law in most states.

Steve H., You asked : "So only the killer of game should be able to eat it?"

"Sorry, honey but I killed it so you don't get any! I know you cooked it but you now the rules....none for you either little Billy!"

I think maybe you're making a joke?  Of course animal meat is not limited to consumption only by those who kill it.  I don't think that was the point most people were trying to make.  The idea is just that it doesn't go to waste.

Like you said:  "Who cares who eats it just so somebody does!"  But coyotes don't count in my book.

I don't think most people have any problem whatsoever with people giving away meat.  It's when a guy is trying to unload a dead carcass so that HE doesn't have to do the work or spend the money to process it himself.  That's all this one was about.  The guy shot a deer, didn't want it.  Tries to give it away either because he doesn't like the meat or doesn't want to do the work involved.  Now, if he was persistent about finding someone to take it "as is" I'm still okay with it if he's successful but it dang sure can make a bad impression to have a guy standing in a store, bar or where ever trying to "get rid of" a deer just so he can go try to kill another one tomorrow morning.  If the guy can't find somebody on short notice to take it he'd better call off from work and take care of it himself or get it into a cooler so he can do it later.  Didn't sound like that was in the plan for this guy.

How about if you're on a hunt for some sort of big critter like elk or moose in a remote drop camp somewhere and you kill a big old moose about 4 miles from camp in the bottom of a draw?  Don't you have the responsibility to pack the meat out?  You can't find some other hunters camp and ask them "Hey, any of you guys want a moose?  There's one upriver a ways you can have.  I want to go shoot another one tomorrow if I can."  

You shoot it, you track it.  You find it, you pack it out.  Give it away when you get home if you want but have some freezer space handy to use until you find a home for it.

[Dave Bulla]

Oh yea, and the times where I had friends give me a deer they didn't want... If I'd said no, they WOULD have either cut it up or had it processed rather than let it go to waste.  The only reason they didn't was because they knew I preferred to cut up my own meat and were trying to get it to me ASAP.

[Killdeer]

Right on, Dave. Many times I have not gone on a day hunt for deer just because I had to work the next day. I could not hunt all day, shoot one in the afternoon or early evening, and have it in the coolerator in time to get any sleep before sorting and carrying my route.

It boils down to personal responsibility, which I feel the hunter in the story was sweeping under the rug in order to boost his "manly" image. All fun and no work, this idiot is just a jerk. This is kinda like the father to 20 bastards who never parented a one.

Killdeer

[Paul WA]

Where I live if a guy walks into a bar and asks if anyone wants a fresh kill just about everyone would say yes. Many times while working as a bartender I would get a call about the location of a road kill and it would be gone real quick...PR

[Paul WA]

Oh Ya BTW, I dont think this gives us a bad name compared to those that dont practice before taking a bow into the woods or all the trespassing and littering ...PR

[olddogrib]

Dave, Kathyrn
Thanks for pointing out the obvious here and saving me (and the Gang from) a lengthy sermon!  Hunting is a privilege, not a right!  We can start by acting like we deserve it!  If you don't know that you or others will use the animal, don't shoot it!  If you don't have time to take care of the  meat, you didn't have time to go hunting!  Get over the notion that you are some benevolent provider to the grateful, protein-deprived masses!  Anybody that takes your deer "as is" is doing you the favor by bailing your lazy ass out of your responsibilities as an ethical hunter.  At least have the decency to properly process the meat or pay to have it done.  Deliver it ready-to-use with profuse thanks and appreciation, for the recipient is doing far more to protect your hunting privileges than you are!
Amen