foc vs weight ?

[kirkwhitehead]

We all know the value of arrow weight ( I like 12-14gr per lb of bow) but....

my 3555 gold tips are lighter ( 9.8 gr/# of bow) with 18% foc.

I just got some griz stik woodies, my arrow weight went up ( 12 gr/# bow) but my foc went to 14.5%.

I might could cut the woodies another .5" but would that half inch get the shaft that much stiffer that I could increase point weight more?

I don't think so.

Both set ups fly good. Of course the woodies hit like a tank and are super quiet, the gold tips fly great but don't hit as hard. Again we ALL know a heavier arrow is best, but.....

More arrow weight or more FOC?

Why not both! Shoot tapered shafts!!! (read with sarcastic tone). Soon I will but right now this is what I got.

kirk

[James Wrenn]

Well hitting hard is not needed for humting.We use broadheads so they slip right in without transfering much energy to the animal like if shooting blunts.I would use the arrow you can hit the smallest point most often with.That one always trumps the other things like weight and foc.jmo

[Richie Nell]

"I would use the arrow you can hit the smallest point most often with.That one always trumps the other things like weight and foc.jmo"

Kirk..
The implication here is that a heavy arrow with high FOC can not be shot accurately and hit the smallest point most often.

That is 100% hogwash.  Unlike what many think, a heavy arrow with high FOC can be shot with the same or more accuracy as an other arrow.  

Oh yea... and it also can have an as sharp or sharper broadhead screwed to the front...just like any other arrow.

It really doesn't take much to slice through the soft tissue of a deer's body and guts.  But if
you choose to use an arrow that is heavy with high FOC then you will be better prepared for the "not so perfect" shot that IS going to happen.

[kirkwhitehead]

I shoot just as well with each arrow. I am just not sure if the FOC is worth more or is the overall weight worth more.

Kirk

[Dr. Ed Ashby]

Kirk,

A penetration increase from FOC first shows up at 19%. Below that amount the degree of FOC has demonstrated no significant influence on penetration. Go with the arrow weight.

Ed
TGMM Family of the Bow

[kirkwhitehead]

Thanks Ed.

I plan on getting into some sitkas before long but so far I like these grizzly stik woodies.

The 3 darts on Alaska bowhunting supply website really got me thinking and makes sense. If y'all have not seen it ,please go read it.

Kirk

[Ragnarok Forge]

As mentioned above weight trumps FOC until you crack the 19 to 20% FOC range. I have my arrows at 10.5 grains per lb of draw weight and 22% foc.  The arrows ended up a bit lighter than I wanted but with the high FOC I picked up the penetration on that end instead of in the weight category.

[James Wrenn]

I would use the arrow you can hit the smallest point most often with.That one always trumps the other things like weight and foc.jmo"

Kirk..
The implication here is that a heavy arrow with high FOC can not be shot accurately and hit the smallest point most often.

That is 100% hogwash. Unlike what many think, a heavy arrow with high FOC can be shot with the same or more accuracy as an other arrow.

Oh yea... and it also can have an as sharp or sharper broadhead screwed to the front...just like any other arrow.

It really doesn't take much to slice through the soft tissue of a deer's body and guts. But if
you choose to use an arrow that is heavy with high FOC then you will be better prepared for the "not so perfect" shot that IS going to happen.

 

Not sure where you got all that from my post.Both arrows he was asking about are heavy arrows siutable for deer.All I said if one shot better than the other it will be better than switching for weight or foc to one that does not fly as well.I never suggested a heavy arrow could not fly well or say you could not use a sharp broadhead on either.  :confused:

[Charlie Lamb]

James... I'm sure Richie meant well, he just seems to lack comprehension at times or is just pot stirring.

I'm never sure which.  

[freefeet]

Originally posted by kirkwhitehead:
I shoot just as well with each arrow. I am just not sure if the FOC is worth more or is the overall weight worth more.

Kirk

Why not have both?  You can use EFOC to up your overall weight really high.  Best of both worlds.     :D  

I'm shooting CX 6075's with 100gr inserts and 200gr tips giving 23.7 FOC.  They weigh 630gr overall and that comes out at 13.7gpp.

They fly really well and hit really hard.

[Richie Nell]

Yes Charlie I do try to mean well and comprehend even better but not much better.
It seems the answer to every arrow question with anything to do with weight.. is ACCURACY.  "Got to be accurate" "Hit em where it counts" "The key is shot placement" "Hit em in the boiler room".  As well as "scary sharp broadhead".

You think there is anyone that does not practice to shoot as accurate as possible or hunt with a dull broadhead.  
What I have noticed is those answers are usually from those who shoot light bow/arrow setups and ignore and disregard the shots that we all take that do not hit "the spot".  Instead they hit a large bone and the animal is rarely recovered if ever.
James may not have implied what I thought he did.. but it sounds oh so similiar to other posts from guys as they ignore addressing and preparing for bad shot placement.
On another note...You never see the posts educating others about what happens to the bad big bone shot when using the light weight setup.

That is an explantation of why I wrote the above post and a little extra for bonus comprehesion.

[James Wrenn]

No problem Richie.We don't all have to agree with the same things.I consider both of the arrows he was asking about as heavy arrows for deer.

As far as heavy bones and such I have never seen any in my way covering a deers chest.I have shot them for many years with bows ranging from over 100s to under 40.Used arrows from 350gns to almost 700.Never seen the time I would have through arrow weight would have made a difference.Never seen a time I wished the bow was heavier.I have made some shots that I sure wished I could take back.Never one where the outcome would have been different with a different setup however.It allways comes back to taking the right shots and being able to put the arrow in the right place no matter what you are useing.Nothing changes ever changes that.Shoot what you can hit the smallest spot most often with,pick shots to take atvantage of that ability and everything else will take care of itself.  

[George D. Stout]

As long as we don't cross that infamous line of diminishing returns, it really doesn't matter if you shoot Richie's arrows or my granddaughter's arrows.  Both are very efficient and work for the intended purpose.  

I've made a few bad shots over five decades Richie.  Most bad shots could only be better with a 30:06....they are bad shots.  That said, I once shot through (that's through) both hips..bones and all..of a 170 pound whitetail.
The bow was 55 pounds the arrow about 480 grains.
The deer died.  Lucky for sure no matter what weight.