Hill and Low Stretch String

[Rick Wiltshire]

I know that Craig does not recommend it - but any of you shoot a Hill, without tip overlays, with a low stretch string?  If so what are your thoughts?

[Dick in Seattle]

Yep... goes with the spoiler I welded to the back of my classic MG.


Seriously, why are you shooting a Hill if you're struggling to keep up with modern developments?   I went through something similar and even tried a carbon lammed Hill, but it just didn't feel right.  It's contrary to the nature of the beast.   I decided the idea isn't to see what a Hill or American Flatbow can be made to be today, but to see what it was like to shoot one as Howard et al shot them back in the day.

That said, these bows, especially those that don't have the inserts or overlays (and Howard was adamantly against both) shouldn't be used with skinny strings.   Aside from the issue of lack of stretch, i.e. shock, these bows have very narrow tips and the skinny, abrasive strings will eat into them fairly quickly.  You can pad the loops, but that's a pain.   Of course, you do gain about 6 fps, but the bow gets noisier.   You can quiet it with silencers, but they cost you about 6 fps.

Okay, I guess I'm done... still haven't had my morning coffee so I'm feeling kind of ornery.   Sorry 'bout that....  8^)

[SpankyNeal]

My Tembo does not have overlays and I asked Craig point blank about it. He said it would not be a problem. I use a padded loop D97 and have a couple thousand shots through it along with two broken nock dry fires - not so much as a stress crack in the finish! Other bowyers of Hill style bows, like Steve Turay and Nate Steen provide FF strings with their bows without overlays so obviously have no worries about it either. I'm a firm believer in modern strings on these bows, and not for the speed gain, but for the decrease in shock and vibration. Howards linen strings actually had less stretch than FF. Some folks prefer the B50 and that's just fine as we're all different, but I see no advantage to it in the shooting i've done with a lot of different Hill style bows. I've also found that mine are actually quieter with the D97 than dacron!

Ken  

[Bjorn]

I use skinny D97 with padded loops on my self bows with or without overlays-LB and RC-no problems.
Not making recommendations-do your own research.  

[Jason Jelinek]

I only use FF on bows with tip overlays that have rounded string grooves.  I don't like shooting any type of string on a bow that doesn't have rounded string grooves.

Honestly Dick, FF behaves more like linen than B50.  I don't shoot a Hill to shoot just like Howard did back in the day.  It shooot Hill bows because they are quiet, simple to use and don't take up much space!  That does not mean I won't push the edge of design within the constraints of a straight limb bow.

I'm even planning on building a Hill style bow with ACS limbs.  If carbon was a little cheaper I'd build one with it.

[straitera]

Just got a heavy Hill w/D-97 string. It worries me much; but, I can't miss with it. Any padding how to's you'd recommend? Or, do I just wrap the loop with leather?

[Greg Skinner]

I have a Tembo blank (57#@27) that I finished, including adding tip overlays.  I have used an 8 strand DF97 string (padded to 16 strands) for almost a year and shot hundreds of arrows through it without the least problem. I like the quietness, softness and lack of shock using this setup and see absolutely no reason to change anything.  When I got my first blank back in 2002 I asked Craig then about the use of low-stretch string and he said the wedge in the tips would allow use of those strings even without tip overlays.  I added tip overlays to that bow, anyway, and shot it for a couple of years with DF97 until it got burned in a house fire.  Never had any problems with it either. I also have a St. Charles yew TD (staight limb HH style) that was built without tip overlays back in 1991.  I asked Jay about using DF97 on it and he said it was OK. So I've been shooting it for over a year as well - no problem. I always pad the loops with DF97 to 16 strand thickness. No creep, good speed, quiet, durable - what's not to like?

[JRY309]

All of my Hill's have tip overlays and I shoot a padded loop D97 on all of them.I feel longbows with a deep core are not as easliy damaged by low stretch strings.Older thin limbed recurves are more easliy damaged by low stretch strings.

[Ben Maher]

i've tried many types of string on my Hills and Hill stylebows . to get them quiet like dacron i have to add string silencers , so i just stick with dacron . and most importantly its cheaper !!!
ben

[tippit]

I use 450+ on all my longbows from selfbows to to Hybrids.  I pad my loops and usually use an 8 strand sting.  As to more expensive than B50, I tend to switch strings to similar length bows and haven't worn out a 450+ string yet over years...Doc

[frank bullitt]

Like Doc says, 450+! I have a a couple buddies in Idaho, I make strings for and they are Hill shooters, most of the bows are over 85lbs.

A longbow of the Hill or American style, has a deep, narrow core, limb. Also a straigth or set-back is not under the shooting stress, as say a highly reflexed limb.

If it's an older bow, check that there are no cracks or fractures in the tips. Just like splitting wood, if there is a wedge of force, it will open it up. Oh, and shoot heavy, as in arrow weight!

 

[Ric O'Shay]

I just received a new carbon backed Wesley Special from Craig. I had him put water buff tips overlays on along with the carbon. I love the way it feels and shoots. This 55# bow is faster and quieter than my 58# Wesley Special that does not have carbon. That said, I have tried FF+ and B-50 on all of my Hills. The dacron is a little quieter, but other than that, there's not fifteen cents worth of difference in the two string types...IMHO.  

[Rick Wiltshire]

Thanks to all who have shared their experiences.  Looks like guys shoot whatever they want for whatever reason they want.  Sounds like independent, traditional archery at its core.

[NomadArcher]

I have a 6 strand 450 plus string on my Cheetah, it is silent too. My string only weighs 60 gr. with silencers and a tied on nocking point.

The B50 string was 90-100 gr. heavier and had a lot of string vibration/noise and some hand shock too.

The modern material really makes a better shooting experience in my opinion.

[Mudd]

I have a question. Thanks in advance for whatever information I gain.
 If I wanted to try some of the new string material but didn't want to invest in making my own, is it possible to buy a string for my Big 5 that would come with padded loops? Serving strings ranks right up there with making arrows to me.. Yuck!
Thanks again!
God bless,Mudd

[WESTBROOK]

Mine dont have overlays, but has tip wedges, I use skinny S4 with padded loops.

Shot a Hill with Dacron once, never again, FF makes it a new bow for the better.

Eric

[SpankyNeal]

Mudd, every string maker I know will padd the loops for you if you request it. Getting ready to try an 8 strand from SBD here real soon as i've heard nothing but good things about his taper padded loop strings. They're a sponsor here as well.

Ken

[far rider]

Ok, I'm still in a learning curve with my Hills. So if I do have tip overlays, and have not modified my string nocks (ie rounded them), I can shoot something like D-97 on it IF I have the loops padded? Or am I missing the mark?