The trend of lighter and lighter ....

[Mr.Magoo]

Well, I'm glad we have it all figured out now.

Now we can decide why 2 blades are better than 3 and why longbows are better than recurves ... or is it why recurves are better than longbows?

[Ray Johnson]

There seems to be an opinion among some that just because a person may ask "how light can I go to kill deer?" or "is 40# and 400gr adequate for hunting?",that the person is just trying to get by without the work needed to shoot a heavier bow or that the person is lazy,etc...I can't speak for all people in the "light camp" but I believe that most of them are not just trying to get by with as little as possible,or that they don't want to practice,or are lazy,etc...They shoot what is the most accurate.I also believe that some shooting styles lend themselves to heavier bows.Like Aaron said,he has a controlled snapshot that is accurate with his 60#-65# bows.I believe there are alot of people just like Aaron.They snapshoot,and are therefore able to shoot heavier bows.I'm not saying they're necessarily not accurate but they are physically able to shoot the heavy weights with their shooting style.Look at Rod Jenkins' form on Masters of the Barebow.He's shooting 41#.Try shooting like him with 60# for an hour or so.I couldn't do it.Some could,maybe,but not me.I dropped to 40# for the benefits of increased accuracy.It worked.I wouldn't want to shoot more weight with my shooting style.Sure,I think there is a limit to how light of an arrow and how low in draw weight is effective for hunting.What is it?I don't know.Everyone has to decide that for himself.My 40# Black Widow recurve is probably more efficient than a 40# selfbow and a 40# Adcock ACS would be more efficient than my 40# BW.Maybe minimum Kinetic Energy values may be useful as a guide to penetration but that wouldn't necessarily be the best way as some may say that momentum values are more effective.I personally place alot of value on personal experience and testimony from those who share their experience with their equipment.If a certain setup has worked in the past to kill game then it goes to reason that it will work from now on.

[GroundHunter]

I think it depends on what you practice with - so you can hit the spot - as shot placement is #1.

Then it depends on what you will hunt, as light tackel may not be enough for some game.

That said, I practice with 600gr+ arrows and a 70# bow. Shot a juvenile bunny at 20 yards with my 73# HH black bear (dead center shot) using a 750 gr laminated birch arrow with a seel blunt. penetration was excessive - drilled a hole in the South Texas hardpan.

This tackel provides excellent penetration on most game.

Now, I mostly hunt Texas whitetails, and I have taken them nicely with a 50# recurve and 2016 aluminum arrows weighing in at under 500 gr. - still probably 9 gr per #.

Texas whitetails are not heavy game. I don't think our wild hogs are either.

Never hunted any BIG game. If I were after, or likely to encounter, a bear, or moose or elk, I'ld be more comfortable with my 70# and 700 Gr arrow combination.

But, you guys kill 'em like you want.

[ChuckC]

I completely disagree.  There is not always ONE best way.  There are way too many things that change.  When everything, every time remains static and unchanging, that's  when you can determine the "best".  This is what evolution is all about....making changes, sometimes subtle, sometimes great, in order to meet the challenge at hand.

If you want BEST then get a big bore rifle.  Anything less than that is negotiable.
ChuckC

[StanM]

I haven't waded through every post in this thread, but I've looked at most, so forgive me if this is redundant.

I don't think much of these types of discussions should revolve around bow weight to begin with.  I've yet to see a bow kill an animal.  I've seen a lot of arrows kill animals, but not bows.

To that end, I believe the discussion should center around what arrow weight driving what broadhead, needs to be thrown at what speed, and at what distances the arrow stays at or above that speed.

Working backward from there, a person can determine what bow will do the job adequately for them by testing it.

Because a bow is not a bow is not a bow, a person would have to determine if their bow will get the job done or not.  It could be that one man's X pound bow, drawn to 29 inches shoots a ??? grain arrow as fast or faster than another persons X + 10 pound selfbow drawn to 27 inches.

As far as what arrow/speed combination is effective I would suggest looking at what CONSISTENTLY gets the job done for the animal you are hunting.  For me consistently factors in what happens IF...fill in the blank (I dead center a rib on impact, I hit a shoulder blade, I gut shoot the animal, the animal drops and I hit the spine, etc.)

After you get that worked out and are confident in your setup, GO HUNT!  If something doesn't work out for you, re-evaluate and fix what ails you.

Stan

[Str8Arrow]

Originally posted by GEREP:

I can't tell you how many times I have been accused of being a "big tenter."  I have been berated, cussed at and called every name in the book simply becuase I think its a good idea that all bowhunters should try to stick together.  "Traditional bowhunters are individuals" they say.  "Don't try to box me in with everyone else..."  Now, many people choose to hunt with what some people consider to be light weight bows and now we all have to have the same goals?  My goal is to be the best hunter and shooter that I can possibly be.  I practice dilligently and I have determined that for me, accuracy is best with bows between 45 and 50 lbs.  For you, that might be totally different.  The difference in my opinion between me and you is that I have no goals for you.

Don't get me wrong. I don't believe that a person should be prevented from hunting unless they can pull 50 lbs or anything like that. I also don't advise you pull a pound more than what works best for you.

I do however remain convinced that some things work better than others. I'm really not overly concerned with draw weight, but I don't like people thinking that just because 35 lbs has been shown to work, that's it's ideal if you're capable of accurately shooting more.  

I also believe that proportionately heavy arrows work better under more circumstances, and I don't mind saying so. However, don't take that to mean that I have any goals for you - I don't.

[Tree man]

Originally posted by Orion:
You realize folks, we're on an intellectual cul de sac here.

Yep. And we're pulling a triple. Backing out is gonna be tough.