Feet Per Second. Big deal or no big deal???

[vermonster13]

200 FPS @ 500 grains = 44lbs KE

195 FPS @ 500 grains = 42lbs KE

SO you gain approximately 5% in performance. Would you turn down a 5% pay raise without having to do anything extra to get it?

[wv lungbuster]

Any gain in fps or quietness is a plus.

[Buckeye Trad Hunter]

The reality is that as long as your bow has enough energy to make clean kills then speed is secondary to having a quiet bow.  It's going to be this way until a bow shoots faster than the speed of sound.  Whether your bow shoots 170 feet per second or 350 feet per second, it's all for nothing if it's as loud as a train wreck.

[KentuckyTJ]

Thanks Johathon, Mike and David that's what I was looking for.

[Orion]

OK, here's the math. 20 yards equals 60 feet.  An arrow traveling 200 feet per second (much faster than most traditional bows,by the way) will reach the target in exactly .3 seconds (60 divided by 200).  If, on the other hand, the arrow is traveling a whopping 205 fps, the arrow will reach the target in .2926 seconds (60 divided by 205).  That's a whopping difference of .0074 seconds.  That's 74 one thousands of a second.  If the deer jumps the string, you gain maybe one hair's thickness on the deer with the 5fps faster arrow.  In short, it makes no noticeable difference. If deer can get out of the way of a wheelie shot arrow coming at them at 350fps or more, they're sure going to duck an arrow at 205 fps .Better to have a quiet bow, shoot at an unalarmed deer, etc.        

[LBR]

Would you turn down a 5% pay raise without having to do anything extra to get it?
 

Not an accurate comparison.  As I've said before, quoting my favorite bowyer, "everything is a trade-off".  The question is, is the trade-off worth it to you?  For some it is, for some it isn't.  You can pick up a lot more by learning to use proper back tension which extends your draw length, shoot a couple more lbs of draw weight, and/or just shoot a faster bow.  In the quest for optimum speed/performance, these will add up a whole lot quicker than a tiny string and trimming silencers a few grains.  'Course these have trade-offs too.

IMO, if you are using a weapon so marginal that 5-10 fps is the difference between a clean kill and a wound or miss, you might consider a different weapon.  Fred Bear killed a bull elephant with one arrow pulling a 70-something lb bow.  The string was dang near a clothsline, and the bow wasn't what we'd call "high performance" today.  His broadheads were file-sharpened and double bevel, and didn't weigh 800 grains each.

My best friend's daughter killed a big whitetail doe (over 100#) with a quartering toward her shot (it was her first bow kill--she didn't know any better) pulling a little over 30# at maybe 25-26" with an arrow that weighed around 400 grains.  Her broadhead wasn't even a single bevel.  The deer went maybe 60 yds. before piling up.  10 or 12 strand Dynaflight '97 string.  Recurve.

There ain't no magic set-up.  There's no magic bow, no magic arrow, no magic broadhead, and no magic string.  People have been killing animals all over the world with bent sticks, hardened wood/bone/stone for points, and rawhide, sinew, or plant fiber for strings since the beginning of time.  Some still do.

Point being, it's fun to tinker and compare, but those who don't know any better that read these threads need to hear both sides of the story.

Should we be using the absolute best, most efficient weapons we can get our hands on?  You might want to think about that one a bit before you answer.

The original question was covered just fine.  5fps doesn't mean much when it comes to killing, or even hitting a target.  I'm fat and crippled and can easily cover 5 feet in a second.

Chad

[Predator Man]

Pulled this from the A&H website.  Enjoy!


What does it mean when you hear that a bow is faster than another?  

First of all, you must remember that measurements that are not acquired using precise and accurate procedures, equipment and testing techniques are suspect at best.  However let's assume that you have two bows that have been properly tested and one has an AMO speed that's 5 fps faster than the other.  Or maybe it's 10 or 15 fps faster than the other.  Is that a big deal or not?


Think of it this way - if you test most any bow (precisely) with a 9 grains per pound arrow at 28" and then again (precisely)  with a 9 grains per pound arrow at 29", it will be 4-5 fps faster.  Remember why that is?  It's because the stored energy for a 29" draw length is greater than for a 28" draw length, all other things being equal.  

Have you ever wished your draw length was 1" longer?  Have you ever short-drawn your bow by 1" and noticed the difference in arrow trajectory?  An accurately-measured difference of 5 fps in AMO arrow speed between bows is HUGE.  It is far from insignificant and anyone who says otherwise has never really thought it through.


Now, consider a 10 fps or a 15 fps (or even more) difference in AMO arrow speed.  Want to add 2 or 3 more inches to your draw length?  It's easy - just get a bow that performs well.


Remember - talk is cheap.  Proof is absolute.  Don't ever let anyone tell you that there is no difference between bows.  And don't ever let anyone tell you that 5 or 10 (or even more) fps difference in AMO arrow speed is insignificant.

[LBR]

Thanks Orion.  That really puts it into perspective.

[Predator Man]

Originally posted by Orion:
OK,because I have nothing better to do at the moment, here's the math. 20 yards equals 60 feet.  An arrow traveling 200 feet per second (much faster than most traditional bows,by the way) will reach the target in exactly .3 seconds (60 divided by 200).  If, on the other hand, the arrow is traveling a whopping 205 fps, the arrow will reach the target in .2926 seconds (60 divided by 205).  That's a whopping difference of .0074 seconds.  That's 74 one thousands of a second.  If the deer jumps the string, you gain maybe one hair's thickness on the deer with the 5fps faster arrow.  In short, it makes no noticeable difference. If deer can get out of the way of a wheelie shot arrow coming at them at 350fps or more, they're sure going to duck an arrow at 205 fps .Better to have a quiet bow, shoot at an unalarmed deer, etc.          

When you think about it this way, I should slow my bow down some more and hope that the deer goes down and comes back up before the arrow gets there.

Honestly that almost happened once.

[dpowers311]

Deer drop under the arrow on compounds so your trad gear will not be close to the speed required for that. You do have a edge if the string makes your shot have less sound. Speed may help with your range but will not help with an alert deer.

Dave

[LBR]

"And don't ever let anyone tell you that 5 or 10 (or even more) fps difference in AMO arrow speed is insignificant."

Not to argue with Larry or John, but for most of us 5-10 fps is insignificant, especially hunting.  It's only going to matter if you are right on the bare edge with your equipment....and I gave my opinion on that.  75 or so lbs will cleanly kill a bull elephant, even with a marginal set-up.  35# will kill a large whitetail, even with a marginal set-up.

On one of the other threads there's even a discussion about bow noise, and how much difference it really makes.  The deer will hear the arrow, if not the bow.  Spooky deer will react, period.  Wonder if there's been any studies on that?

[Steve B.]

As far as "jumping the string", it would not make any difference.
As far as "flatter shooting", who cares at 20 yds?
As far as "better penetration", it just might, especially with a 750 grn. arrow.

[Chris Shelton]

like I said in another thread, you dont buy a truck and worry about MPG so you shouldnt worry about FPS with a trad bow  

[vermonster13]

I never understand why so many are so against getting everything out of your equipment. If you gain quiet and speed/efficiency out of a thinner string, why be so against it? When you start adding up all the small parts you can do to improve your shooting it quickly adds up to a much greater whole. Clean release, getting a full draw(form, form, form!), properly tuned arrows, good FOC, and yes a properly tuned string. All parts of the equation that = accuracy/full freezer.

[wv lungbuster]

Totally agree Vermonster.

[LBR]

I'm not against it, I'm just trying to be fully objective.  It's not "free" performance.  You pay in durability, stretch/creep, and adjustability, and in some cases more.  Some folks obviously feel it's a good trade-off, others don't.  I feel like everyone should be informed about the pro's AND the cons.

Strings are my passion and my business.  I do my best to stick with facts.  I've been in this business for several years now, and plan to be in it for several more.  It's only in my best interests to give the best and most accurate information I can.  

Chad

[wv lungbuster]

Durability maybe but I always have a spare string in my pack. Stretch/creep my 8strand D-97 has stretched a whopping 3/16 on a 53# longbow it' been on the bow two months with out being unstrung, and been shot I don't know how many times. I seen only pros and no cons.

I seem to have a better release with the fatter strings.  I tried the skinny string on one of my bows and it seemed to me like it bit into my American leathers glove more than the fast flight or the bonnyl string.  When I shot heavy bows I never noticed this, but now I am down to the low fifties it shows up more. Even with the fast flight I have become pretty dependent on keeping powder on the glove.

[Orion]

I'm certainly not against more speed, and I do everything I can to get as much of it as I can out of my equipment.  The question was, to paraphrase, will 5 fps make a difference if the deer jumps the string.  The answer is NO!

[Jeff Strubberg]

Originally posted by Chris Shelton:
like I said in another thread, you dont buy a truck and worry about MPG so you shouldnt worry about FPS with a trad bow    

Uh, I worry about the performance of both my truck and my bow.  Why should I pay more than I have to in order to get the job done?