Arrow Spine & Fletching secrets

[jerry hill]

In the 80's I had a conversation with a friend of mine Jim Easton, of Easton Aluminum.I told him that back in the 50's and 60's Bear offered only four sizes of aluminum arrows and they seemed to fit everybodies desires.But, today with all the sizes that he was making, traditional archers were at a total lost as to what to buy.Bear arrows were X7 alloy and modern XX75 was the same.He sent to me for testing one dozen of each size made.I fletched them with 5 inch feathers,and had a difficult time making his arrow chart work out with bow weights.Then I remembered hunting with H.Hill and seeing him shoot 90+# arrows taken to Africa out of a 60# bow.I new that his arrows were fletched with 6 inch helical feathers the same as my personal cedar arrows. I went inside and got one of his arrows and shot it out of a 60# bow and it shot perfectly.I refletched the aluminums and found that with the increase in feather size,arrow spine became less critical.I had discovered a H.Hill secret, that had not been dicussed, only done as he instructed me in the making of arrows.Now I pass it on to you.Jerry Hill..............

[Cody Roiter]

Jerry, I'll have to try that out..

Thanks for the tip..

Cody

[FerretWYO]

More fletch is going to make your arrow stabalize faster for sure.

[Jerry Wald]

So jerry obviuosly he never bare shaft tested.

So I have fletch a bunch of arrows while I am waiting for my two new bows to show up with four fletch - 5" feathers this should add alot of drag like the 6 inch three feathers of HH.

So it should tune better according to your results or atleast be less spine dependant.

Well I am waiting patiently....I don't have a bow right now to test with, but we will see when they show up.

Jer Bear

[sou-pawbowhunter]

It makes perfect sense when you think it over.  Why didn't I think of it though?  

[tradlongbow]

I've tried the same thing. I have a 3" chopper and 5" chopper. The 3" feather is faster and flies more erratic and the 5" feather flies slower but stabalizes quicker.

Darren

[Jason R. Wesbrock]

That's exactly why you can use a wide variety of spines for flu flus and they will fly the same.

[cahaba]

"So jerry obviuosly he never bare shaft tested."

Mr. Hill shot 90 lb. bows on many of his African safaris. He most likely could not find wooden arrows spined properly for that kind of weight. He even modified his draw length so he could shoot a shorter arrow. Larger fletching was out of necessity rather than properly spined just to get as good of arrow flight as possible

[jerry hill]

He found 90 lb. spine arrows, as Ben Peason had a man sitting at the shaft doweling machine and spine testing machine, with each arrow shaft that spined out 90 lb. plus in spine, it was thrown in a seperate pile for the Howard Hill trip to Africa.But, with the six inch fletch you,re right, your arrows may fly a little slower. In doing this, one has to ask themselves which is more important,speed or accuracy. Accuracy is more important in my book. What good is a 300 ft. per second miss, speed isn't everything. Besides, I like to see my arrow in flight so I can follow its flight and know where I've hit an animal. Jerry Hill..........

[Night Wing]

First I've ever heard of this. The 6" length makes sense and for a person shooting aluminum arrows with a long draw and light poundage bows, this would be great.

[Jeremy]

Feathers can mask, but not eliminate, tuning errors.  Add more feather and you just mask more of them.  It doesn't mean they aren't there and robbing your arrow of energy better used to put a broadhead through an animal.

[Raminshooter]

Jerry,

Thanks for reawakening many on this site with some timeless archery wisdom. Even though you don't need the support here are two real life examples that support what you say precisely:
(1) I was at a shoot in S. California and was shooting my first custom takedown recruve at the time.  I was warming up at the practice bales when I broke a nock upon release and heard a loud crack.  My upper limb broker at the top of the fades and I was heart broken.  I would have to drive about an hour round trip to get another bow and was about to leave when my buddy said he had an extra bow in his truck if I wanted to use it.  The bow turned out to be one of yours, a 68 inch long bow around 55# @ 28 inches.  I had been shooting 65 lb wood arrows in my recurve with 5.50 inch high back shield cut feathers and decided to just make due with what I had.  I put my score card in my back pocket and told my group I would not be scoring that day, just having fun.  After three targets I had just about everyone in the group asking me to keep score because I was shooting so well.  I myself was shocked that I was able to shoot well with my arrows out of someone elses longbow, I finished the shoot and had a great time and it put me on the road to shooting longbows.  The testimony here is to the fact that even with stiffer arrows than this longbow would normally be matched to, the fact that I had large feathers allowed me an accuracy level that surprised even me.
Case #2:  My next longbow was a custom HHill style bow made by a california bowyer.  AT the time I was in my archery infancy and knew nothing much about aluminum spine wt. and matching it to your bows.  All I knew was that a 2219 was tougher than a 2214 so I bought a couple of dozen 2219's to shoot out of my 57 lb straight limb longbow.  However,  I did not that larger feathers would provide more stability so I chose Banana cut feathers (5.5 inches) for all my arrows and was able to attain amazing accuracy with them.  My arrow spine ignorance didn't really cost me anything as an instinctive shooter in this case proving Jerry's point once again that the larger feathers can make seemingly mis-spined arrows work out for you.

In closing I would add one more item and that is length of arrow.  As most know,  if you add length to a stiff shaft you can affect its paradox quite a bit.  All you have to do sometimes is get past the way it "looks" with an extra 1.5-2.5 inches of shaft sticking out past the end of the shelf!

Thanks again Jerry and keep em coming.

[Ground Hunter]

I've always used 5.5 inch shield or para feathers.  Never had any problems tuning.  And yes many of the different spined ones will work in various bows.  The larger feathers may decrease the range of the arrow with the additional drag.  However, I'm not interested in shooting beyond what's reasonable with the 5.5 inch feathers.  I'm interested in the arrows fast recovery in HUNTING conditions.  So - right on!!  Jerry!!!!   H

[BobW]

OMG!!! - you mean my using 105-115# shafts, and fletching them with 5.5" 7/8" high cut trads is okay from my 56# to 59# bows (I short draw when I draw 32")?  All the riddicule I have taken for this is for nothing?  Wow, I can now crawl out from under my rock and shoot my bow with pride!

**** please excuse my exuberance - a glass of Jack (on the rocks) has aided my vigor. ****

See, there is more than one way to do this.....  Jerry, thank you!!!!!!

I will now crawl back under my rock...

BobW

[Raminshooter]

I just re-read this thread and thought I could add some perspective.  When the St. Charles family had the archery museum up near Sea Tac I had the opportunity to go and see it 16-18 times during my business travel.  I got to see Howards hunting arrows up close and personal many times.  His fletching was indeed six inches long but the was only as high as a modern standar parapolic cut feather was, no higher.  But that highth ran the full length of the feather.  I have fletched up some arrows like this and they do fly very well.  Unlike a high back, shorter feather they make very little audible noise.