What is Baiting to you?

[GMMAT]

Baiting = anything placed or growing that is not indigenous...and is utilized (for the hunter's purposes) to lure in an animal.

[SERGIO VENNERI]

What Chuck and Jason said ! Plus it is the closest thing to Catch and Release in hunting !!!

[xtrema312]

I have to disagree with anyone who thinks hunting food areas is the same as hunting bait.  I am not saying bait is wrong, but bait attracts an animal to a very specific place.  A food source attracts animals to a general location.  There is a completely different way animals feed in these situations.  Bait concentrates them and at times that is not good for animal health.

I hunt food sources and see animals all the time.  It is still a lot of work and hit or miss as to figuring out where they will feed.  Really most times I hunt how they get there not the food.  You can't tell me a 100 acre corn field or woods full of oak trees is the same as a bait pile of apples out in the swamp.  It is not the same.

[ChuckC]

How about a half acre corn field.... or a SINGLE oak tree that is dropping a lot of acorns.  or a single apple tree growing where a homestead used to be.

How about, as in Texas where you sprinkle a very small amount of corn . . . along a half mile sendero ?  That sure isn't concentrating the feed.

Let's push it a bit.... how about you plow all the fields except one and the only way there (under cover) is the small ditch line that you left.  Any guesses which way the deer are gonna come ?

I guess there is a whole lot to this.
ChuckC

[Biggie Hoffman]

I used to be staunchly against baiting...That was pretty ignorant of me.

Believe it or not there is a time and a place for it. You just want to be careful that you don't end up "counting" on it instead of honing your hunting skills.

You're not gonna spot and stalk a bear in the thick pine forests of Canada and you won't ever see a hog in the palmetto swamps in south Florida unless you lure them out somehow.

Never say never until you've been everywhere and seen everything.

[imskippy]

I have and do hunt regularly over bait. Reason being that I hunt in very populated areas (NJ)One of the many reasons we hunt is to control the population and for this reason I choose to bait cause in some areas it's the only way to get them out into the wooded areas. However I do also hunt larger areas without bait aswell, learning the deers habits and patterns on their home turf too. It is in my own opinion a necessity to bait in some of the areas I am asked to hunt.

[pseman]

"Baiting is putting something where it is not growing or falling naturally. It is just that simple to me."

Pretty much my definition as well. If legal, then I see no problem in it. If not, then it is "illegal" and should not be done.

Just because it's legal doesn't make it right anymore than illegal makes it wrong. Bating is not a "right vs. wrong" issue. It is not a moral or ethical issue. It is a legal issue and an issue of opinion.

To say that baiting is somehow "morally wrong" is the result of someone letting their opinion get in the way of their common sense. It is not morally wrong to kill an animal for food unless you purposely cause the animal to suffer in death. If it was, then every cattle, pig, and poultry farmer in the world would be morally reprehensible.

"I hunt food sources and see animals all the time. It is still a lot of work and hit or miss as to figuring out where they will feed. Really most times I hunt how they get there not the food. You can't tell me a 100 acre corn field or woods full of oak trees is the same as a bait pile of apples out in the swamp. It is not the same."

It is a smaller version of the same. Just like you don't know where or if the deer will visit the corn field, you also don't know when or if they will visit a bait pile. You may know where they will be, IF they visit while you are there, but both situations have unknowns. Both attract deer. What if you are hunting a lone oak tree, you then know where they will visit IF they visit.

Baiting is baiting regardless of size.

It is not legal where I hunt, but I would not put out bait if it was. Only because I feel that it make my hunt somewhat "artificial" and I prefer to hunt "natural" bait.

Mark

[GMMAT]

I have to disagree with anyone who thinks hunting food areas is the same as hunting bait. I am not saying bait is wrong, but bait attracts an animal to a very specific place.

So...you're hung up on the size of the "pile"?

If someone practicing supplemental feeding decides to broadcast his "bait" over an acre.....and you're hunting a 1 acre food plot.....what's the difference?

Why are you hunting the artificial food source?  Why is the person hunting the broadcasted "bait"?

I'm not trying to be confrontational.  The questions are pointed, admittedly.

[Biggie Hoffman]

I think the difference is that a food plot takes a lot of time, effort and preparation where pouring out a bag of corn does not. In that respect I do see a big difference. We spend alot of days and dollars planting the 9 acres we have and plant them twice a year for best value to the herd. It's kinda stinky to think that the neighbor is pouring out a few bags of corn and drawing the deer off of us.

[GMMAT]

As with anything....if you use the "fringe" of each practice to bolster your argument....you can make either look bad.

I guarantee you there's people putting out food in some places that food plots would pale in comaparison to (in terms of nutritional value).

I also know of several friends who have food plots that they can reach ANY part of with an arrow.

I look to "intent".

Show me a man who plants food plots/ag fields and DOESN'T hunt over them (or leading to them)...and I'll concede that man is planting "for the betterment of the herd".

[BobW]

Originally posted by LKH:
Given the chance, I would support outlawing baiting for deer and other ungulates.  Bear I would support just to keep the predators in control.

Ouch... and the unhealthy overpopulation of deer in areas isn't needed to be reduced?

I go back to my original answer:

legal is "by the law"
ethics is "by the soul"
these can be mutually inclusive of exclusive......

one can be answered for you, one cannot....

[Ground Hunter]

I say - don't ask - don't tell.  H

[LITTLEBIGMAN]

Sorry Chuck But I have to completely disagree. Being from Wisc you know what baiting has done to hunting there. The deer no longer move like deer that have to forage for food .

There is A HUGE difference over hunting a trail to row crop field then to a pile of corn at specific longitute - latitude location. I do not want to argue but because we aren't supposed to do that here.

Calling with a grunt tube is not the same as baiting.

Hunting over a scrape is not the same as baiting!

Baiting is conditioning  an animal to come to a specific spot in the woods so you can kill it.

Thats not hunting ( in my opinion)
.

[Biggie Hoffman]

Originally posted by GMMAT:
As with anything....if you use the "fringe" of each practice to bolster your argument....you can make either look bad.

I guarantee you there's people putting out food in some places that food plots would pale in comaparison to (in terms of nutritional value).

I also know of several friends who have food plots that they can reach ANY part of with an arrow.

I look to "intent".

Show me a man who plants food plots/ag fields and DOESN'T hunt over them (or leading to them)...and I'll concede that man is planting "for the betterment of the herd".

Matt That's silly. The deer use the foodplots 24/7 . Corn doesn't have much nutritional value at all but it's like candy to a deer. You're just picking, I know you see the difference.

[GMMAT]

Biggie...

I'm not kidding.  Like I said, you can use the "fringe" (bag of corn v. 9 acre food plot), and I'd agree with everything you said.

I gave you mitigating examples, though....that would have them being congruent (citing hunter's intent and the ability to take the animals from any point within the source).  And again....supplemental food is often times of WAY more value (nutritionally) than anything you could grow in a food plot.  

And....BOTH food sources can be made available to the herd 24/7.

The biggest factor in me forming my opinion on this subject is a quite simple one.  It's legal where I hunt (though I've never killed an animal over it).  I'll support ANY hunter's right to pursue game, as long as his methods are legal, and his manner of taking is ethical.

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Baiting ?????? That is everything under the Sun.. from Scent to calls to food and even decoys It's all Bait. For Those that Think crop field hunting isn't baiting, Guess What... It is.. If You think Different, Your wrong....

I Feel if You do what ever You want to as long as it is legal in that State.. Have fun and Enjoy.. I won't judge You.

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Originally posted by LITTLEBIGMAN:


Calling with a grunt tube is not the same as baiting.

Hunting over a scrape is not the same as baiting!

Baiting is conditioning  an animal to come to a specific spot in the woods so you can kill it.

Thats not hunting ( in my opinion)
.

Baiting is conditioning  an animal to come to a specific spot in the woods so you can kill it. ????But it is... You use the grunt to bring them... You make a mock scrap or a real one Your bring the deer to a spot to kill them...

[Bill Carlsen]

People who think baiting is a panacea have not tried it, IMO....at least not seriously. It is legal in NH but I have to tell you, if you mess up once they will be on to you in a hurry and hunting over bait then becomes more difficult than hunting natural food sources. NH does not have a dense deer herd so the numbers are not there to guarantee that some other unsuspecting animal will come by. In the rut the bucks will often approach a bait from downwind or blow right by it in their travels looking for does. If no does are at the bait they just keep on going and they are usually out of range or in an area you have not prepared shooting lanes in. If the buck do feed at the bait it will most often be before or after the rut and more commonly in the dark.

However, the question asked had to do with defining what baiting is. IMO it has to do with something a man or woman does to establish a preferred feeding area in order to hunt the intended animal. I planted apple trees on my property when we built our house just to lure deer in and to keep them around.  I plant clover and chicory in the field where the apples are for the same reason. On the property we bought so we could hunt on it we use corn or apples that we buy or collect.

Another question is...how close to the food supply do you set up? For example, in NH it is not legal to bait turkeys. We have a game feeder across our pond that attracts both turkey and deer. This Fall I set up a DB blind about 80 yards from the feeder and shot a turkey. The local Conservation Officer saw the set up and assured me that I was not hunting over the bait so I was legal. Another time I was hunting in upstate NY. On the property was a large 50 gallon drum set up to spread corn for the critters. Bears were coming in so the landowner told me that it was illegal to hunt the bears at the barrel and I needed to be at least 75 yards away from it to be able to legally shoot a bear. So, in the incident with the turkeys and the bears was I baiting? In my mind I knew the food was the reason the animals would be where I could shoot them because of the "bait"....but in each case the hunting was legal and not considered to be baiting by the Fish and Game dept.

[HATCHCHASER]

"Baiting is conditioning an animal to come to a specific spot in the woods so you can kill it.  

Via a food plot?  This is really a matter of opinion not ethics.  I have never piled "bait" up in an area and hunted over it.  I have spinkled some out on a trail at a shooting lane.  I have cut an apple in half and rubbed it on my pants and shirt when hunting near a apple orchard.  I have put out scents and made mock scrapes.  I have let more deer walk than I have shot.  I do not know anyone who is more "ethical" than I am in any capacity.

[Burnsie]

Pretty simple to me.
Something that is placed to attract that does not normally or naturally occur there is baiting.
You wouldn't normally see a big pile of doughnuts in the woods,  thats baiting.  If there isn't an oak tree around,  there shouldn't be a big pile of acorns there -  if you dump a big pile then its baiting.  If there isn't normally a big steel drum with legs, and an electric motor that spins out corn at predesiginated times in the woods,  then its baiting.
I don't agree with the logic that hunting where naturally occurring oak trees drop there mast or where there are farm crops equates to baiting. Heck if you are against baiting and subscribe to the logic that farm crops are the same as bait you would never be able to hunt in my part of Illinois.  Corn and beans as far as the eye can see.