What is Baiting to you?

[acadian archer]

Bait usually refers to:

Bait (luring substance), bait as a luring substance

that says it all. unless you still hunt all the time you are likely using some form of baiting.

[getstonedprimitivebowhunt]

......Think I'll stay out of "THIS ONE" !!! Anyway ,,,  that big pot of (corn feed deer) stew I'm making is done...yummmmmm!!!

[Uncle Buck]

I personaly find hunting deer over a baitpile or feeder to be distatesful. It takes away from the satisfction I get from a day spent hunting.

[bill langer]

Scratching my wife's back for a year till she fell asleep...

So that I could hunt Africa for 2 weeks...

Jury is still out on who was being baited!!!

[GMMAT]

I have a serious question to ask......

With as much controversy (both real and perceived) in the realm of hunting as we have, today.......Do we not have better/more productive things to do.....than to tear down another man's pursuits?

[harvestmoon]

I have read all the posts, and it seems to me that a lot of you guys are having way too much fun baiting others with your words.  Baiting is really putting something out there to draw attention.
Just be legal and stand up for your rights to hunt as you see fit.

[getstonedprimitivebowhunt]

..I put apples out once and they were gone everyday. Found out it was a groundhog that was storing them in his hole. too many other things to do as I hunt than to put out feed. Theres plenty out there already....!!! I'm more interested in feeding ..."ME" !!!

[xtrema312]

Originally posted by GMMAT:
 

I have to disagree with anyone who thinks hunting food areas is the same as hunting bait. I am not saying bait is wrong, but bait attracts an animal to a very specific place.

So...you're hung up on the size of the "pile"?

 [/b]

Yes I am hung up on the size of the pile if you call a pile of bait a hunter drops on the ground and the 100 acre corn filed in my example both piles.  Your partial quote of what I said is a little out of contest don't you think?  I do believe there is a difference between using a concentrated attractant vs. hunting a large spread out food sources.  

My definition of baiting is the same and the US Fish and Wildlife Dep. and about every state in the country.  They don't have much of a problem defining what is and is not baiting.  That works just fine for me as an answer to the original question.

I hunt one farm with multiple apple orchards, pears, peaches, cherries, and corn mixed in between all the orchards.  It is surrounded by woods with acorns.  Baiting?  It is the hardest place I have ever hunted.  You have to be on the ball to figure out what they are eating and when.  It is easier to find a travel funnel than hunt the food.  It is a whole lot more like hunting the wild with many varying food sources spread out all over the place than it is hunting a bait pile.

As for the rest of this stuff, it is more personal definition than what is widely accepted by government agencies and most hunters.  You can go into all kinds of tangents and arguments if you really feel you need to defend baiting.  The way I see it baiting is legal or it is not.  If it is legal you don't need to defend it.  If it is not legal ............  

I hang out in doe areas in the rut.  I guess I am baiting the buck then by some peoples definition.  I guess the critters are baiting me with all that fun in the outdoors and tasty meat.  I am fairly certain my wife baited me.  I guess everything is baiting.

[Tom Leemans]

Baiting is generally allowed in places where that is about the only way you will have a chance to see the game. I once saw a film of Fred Bear saying that he was in favor of it, if that was the means that gave the hunter the best chance at a a successful hunting experience. (words to that effect)Just follow the regs in your area.

[getstonedprimitivebowhunt]

...I break up a fresh sassafras root and lay it in front of my stand. It seems to stop deer. What a great smell ....food for the nose. Is that baiting ...hmmmmm!

[Day Dreamer]

I harvested a whopping 2 deer since I been trade hunting and thats been without bait, had a few close calls also. It sure feel good to know that. I personally think baiting is a lazy or easier way to hunt just like using a crossbow or gun. It's just a personal choice. I have a buddy that shoots a crossbow, his reason, "I don't have the time to practice with a longbow or compound". That is a ethical reason that I respect. It's what a hunter sets his/her expectations, what you limit yourself with, how challenging you make it. Trad hunters are for sure a minority we stand out but some stand out more than others, where are you gonna set your standards.

[reddogge]

I don't get involved with these type discussions usually.  Pointless.  

I killed the two biggest bucks I ever killed with a bow by hunting a wild pear tree and a persimmon tree.  Don't feel bad about it at all.

[TimRadke]

I am not for baiting but I get a chuckle out of people who think baiting is unfair, yet don't bat an eye using a rangefinder hyper cam compounds scent killing spray scent killing clothes synthetic deer scents electronic calls and shooting a deer 50 yards away that they "scouted" via digital trail camera that automatically emails the photos to you from a treestand set up by a guide on property they have never been on after driving to their stand in a 4 wheeler...  Again, Im not a fan of baiting but let's put it in perspective

[Orion]

I'm a bit disappointed that in this discussion, most folks seem to ascribe to the lowest standard for hunting behavior, i.e., if it's legal, then it's OK. A lot of stuff is legal, but not necessarily ethical. For example, in this state, it's legal to shoot a deer that has its antlers locked with another buck preventing its/their escape.  It's legal to shoot a deer if it's tangled in a fence and can't get away.  Would it be ethical to do so.  Not in my book. The ethical thing to do is to break them apart or cut away the wire.  Additionally, some regulations are ambivalent regarding what is legal. For example, in my state, it's legal to bait in half of it, illegal to bait in the other half. What?  Why?

I don't see the concept of fair chase raised in many of these discussions.  In a nutshell, the concept of fair chase has to do with not engaging in practices and behaviors that reduce or eliminate the possibility for the animal to escape.  The instances I just mentioned, for example, involve situations in which the animals cannot escape. (High fences accomplish the same thing.)  Is it legal to kill them?  It is in this state.  Is it fair chase to do so?  Nope.  One might even extend the concept of fair chase to giving the animal a fair break in the interaction between the hunter and the hunted.  After all, we do have most of the advantages and we're not talking subsistence here.

In 10-20 years, sometime in the future, we may reach consensus on the appropriateness of baiting. But individually, to develop our own ethics toward the animals we hunt, it might not be a bad idea to examine our attitudes and behaviors in light of the concept of fair chase.

[GMMAT]

I don't see the concept of fair chase raised in many of these discussions. In a nutshell, the concept of fair chase has to do with not engaging in practices and behaviors that reduce or eliminate the possibility for the animal to escape.  

From the P&Y website....

 

The Rules of Fair Chase

The term “Fair Chase” shall not include the taking of animals under the following conditions:

*Helpless in a trap, deep snow or water, or on ice.
*From any power vehicle or power boat.
*By “jacklighting” or shining at night.
*By the use of any tranquilizers or poisons.
*While inside escape-proof fenced enclosures.
*By the use of any power vehicle or power boats for herding or driving animals, including use of aircraft to land alongside or to communicate with or direct a hunter on the ground.
*By the use of electronic devices for attracting, locating or pursuing game or guiding the hunter to such game, or by the use of a bow or arrow to which any electronic device is attached.
*Any other condition considered by the Board of Directors as unacceptable.
 

[Chris Shelton]

Okay I just read them all.  One thing that definatly needs to clear up is that a grunt tube is not bait!  There is a huge difference.  If you are fishing and you have jig with a hook and worm, the worm is the bait, the spinner above is not, that is a attractant.  Same goes with a grunt tube!  In trapping, when you set for bobcat in some states you can use feathers as a attractant, but the meat in the dirt hole is the bait.

 

Originally posted by GMMAT:
Show me a man who plants food plots/ag fields and DOESN'T hunt over them (or leading to them)...and I'll concede that man is planting "for the betterment of the herd".

I know alot of guys that plant food plots but dont hunt over them.  But they are definatly the "horn porn" type, so although they are bettering the heard are they really any better than the fellow that hunts over the plot and kills some does for his freezer.  Not saying you are in the wrong or anything, that is the only statement you made that I didnt agree with.

With that said there is a huge difference between a pile of corn and a food plot as far as the animals well being.  Deer are browze feeders.  They go along and eat, and go along some more and eat.  When the come along to a corn pile they will sit there and eat.  Ignoring there browze instincts untill they are full or the corn is gone.  So you may think that your big massive corn pile is feeding the herd, but in reality you may only be feeding a couple of deer.  Not to mention, IMHO it would be a ton cheaper to plant a food plot, you spend a couple bucks for a bag of seed, plant it and it keeps growing, and so does your wallet, but with corn you wallet may be empty alot of the time, lol

Add to the fact that all the food plots I have seen are decent in size, with a corn pile you are putting that deer exactly where you want it to stand for you to shoot at.  Most food plots last almost the entire year, wear as a corn pile will probably not, hunters dont put out corn during the entire summer.  A food plot in my eyes is alot better for the deer.  I am not really against baiting, I am just trying to play the devils advocate  

[hayslope]

Ahhhh...such interesting interaction here amongst the "gang".........

Some "food for thought":

Why would we EVER put a stand(s) up on the edge of a foodplot or on any trail leading or from said foodplot?  Certainly not because we would expect the animal to actually be "attracted" to said foodplot!  We plant them for their nutritional needs.

All fun aside.....I'm also a fisherman........a flyfisherman and flytyer to be specific...for about as long as I can remember.  My Dad reminded me of one thing when I was very young.....the ONLY difference between me and the boy drowning the worm downstream was that we actually built the "bait".  I can remember the day he explained this to me.  Thanks Dad for doing all you could to keep me grounded and I miss you with every ounce of my soul.

[Orion]

Thanks for posting GMMAT.  I was paraphrasing.  That's quite a list of practices that "reduce or eliminate the possibiity of escape," or otherwise take advantage of the prey."

[GMMAT]

It's also devoid of the term "baiting".  That was my point.

Like I said....I abhor the double-standard (Bear v. Deer baiting).  That's my biggest pet peeve in these discussions.  Someone always feels the need to saddle the elevated equine.

[vermonster13]