Shoulder question

[K. Mogensen]

When school let out, I started shooting my Savannah every day, sometimes twice a day. The first week wasn't bad, but I notice that starting towards the end of last week, I've gotten soreness in both shoulders. I don't think (and hope to god) it's not a rotator cuff, because if I hold both arms out to my sides level to the ground, it's on top of the shoulder. It's not really pain, just an ache that get's annoying. Is this just from shooting so much? Before I used to only shoot on weekends. Or, does it sound like a rotator cuff injury? I kind of need that shoulder for the next 3 months for football...

Thanks!

[K. Mogensen]

TTT

[TheFatboy]

Fatigue kicking in, no doubt. Take it easy for a few days.

[JAG]

If in doubt, get it checked out by an Ortapedic sugeron.

[Hud]

It is not unusual to experience some soreness, when over-doing it. Normally, it is best to shoot one day with one day off. Same for strength exercises. If it is not serious, you will feel better by laying off for a week.

Check into some strength exercises for the rotator cuff, they will help. Again, one day off between exercising.

If it is not better in a week, think about having it checked by a doc or therapist.

[K. Mogensen]

Okay, thanks guys. I'll take it easy till Tuesday or Wednsday and then go every other day.

I appreciate the help!

[Diamond Paul]

Are you warming up before shooting?  Try doing some side lateral, bent over lateral, and front shoulder raises with very light (1-5lb) weights, then some shoulder stretches before and after you shoot.  You can find pics of these by Googling them.

[K. Mogensen]

Never even though to try warm ups. Great idea! I have weight lifting every Tuesday and Thursday for football so I know what those are. I'll try doing those and stretching.

[Mike Vines]

suck it up.  It can hurt tomorrow.  That's what my Dad used to tell me.  Your probably just using muscles that you haven't in a while, and they are getting tired.

[Bill Carlsen]

I've had my share of shoulder problems. If you are playing football and practice has started I'de talk it over with the trainer. But, take it from an old guy, if the pain lasts more than a couple of days get to a doc and get it checked. If you have tendonitis it is way easier to deal with in the early stages rather than latter on. For the time being I would suggest that after shooting you ice the affected areas and learn some shoulder stretches.

[xtrema312]

I have had two shoulder flair ups this last year.  One I switched to 3 under for a while and something about the pull angle started one on my string side.  Then a new bow a month or so ago got me in trouble with my bow shoulder.  After measuring my bows I found some a little light and the new one 1/2# heavier than marked.  All in all I started shooting 2 1/2# more weight.  Not much, but if you shoot a lot most days that can do it.  I took time off and at one point shooting with overhead video noticed I had started pushing my bow shoulder out and in.  I changed that.  I had extended my draw length some, but thought it was by getting my string arm back more.  I was really pushing my bow shoulder out too far.  I did some general shoulder and upper back exercises.  I only shot every fourth day to tolerance.  I was able to have only mild discomfort on the draw, but it was the shot that hurt.  After shooting some to get warmed up I could shoot quite a bit with no problems.  I could rotate my shoulder all over the place and not problems so I was sure it was not a rotator.  At one point the back of my shoulder, front, into my bicep, and down into my chest was sore. It was just shooting stress that caused it.  After about 4 weeks of work on it and slow and easy on the shooting now I am as good as new. I shot 5 our of 7 days this week.  I shot 3 hours today all totaled and I feel fine.  I just had to stop doing something wrong, and take it easy to get the inflammation out.  Then build up the muscles some.

[36bound]

What you have described does not at all sound serious, probably just soreness associated with doing "too much too soon." How would your abs feel if you suddenly started doing situps and crunches once or twice a day? How would your thighs feel if you started doing squats once or twice a day for a couple weeks?  

Torn or partially torn rotator cuffs most often occur to people in their late middle-age years, and often are associated with a specific event such as a fall, or straining to lift an unusually heavy weight.

Ease back and you'll be fine.

[K. Mogensen]

Okay, I feel much better about it. I just ordered a new Lost Creek and was getting nervous that I'd have to drop in draw weight but it sounds like I'll be fine.

For what it's worth, right now, I only feel pain if I raise my arm up to the sides. I can rotate my shoulders, and even draw my bow. Just achey.

Thanks a bunch guys, that's a load off my mind!

[Earthdog]

K,,two things.
First off,that warm up can make a HUGE difference,,,just a few stretchs across the chest with each arm an a few like your trying to scratch your back by reaching over the off side shoulder,,,,for me they stop the type of ache your talking about in it's tracks.
The other thing is shooting relaxed.
Don't try to mussle anything,,your best power will always come from a relaxed beginning.
I have damage in both my shoulders,,thankfully not rotator cup,just tendon an mussle which can be managed quite easy the way I've described.

good luck.

[BRONZ]

Just from what you've described, I'm going to make a few assumptions; so let me know if I'm off base.
I agree that you are probably over-doing it a little and that could be causing some of the muscle aches.
There is only a very slim chance that you have a rotator cuff injury at your approx. age.  
The likely cause is possible tendonitis or bursitis in your shoulders.  Based on what you describe as the position of pain, that you lift weights and are a football player, I would bet on bursitis.  
Typically, young men are most concerned with the beach-going muscles:  military press, bicep curls, bench press...  A lot of overhead "pushes" cause the humerus to butt up against your acromion.  Over time the acromion lays down more bone and subacromial impingement occurs.  I don't think you would have progressed this far, but you probably do have inflammation.
Given this is an acute problem I would recommend the following:
1. Lay off shooting
2. Lay off overhead wt lifting and put in some cardio at the gym
3. Ice your shoulders for no less than 20 min. following activity that aggrivates them.
4. If the problem continues, a regiment of anti-inflammatories may help.
5. Possible visit to your family doc for an order to see an occupational therapist (we specialize in upper extremity rehab in an outpatient setting) or physical therapist to further assess and treat your issue.

Feel free to pm me if you have questions or would like to talk about it.  I'd be happy to help as much as I can.

Manolito

[TheFatboy]

Originally posted by Grapes:
suck it up.  It can hurt tomorrow.  That's what my Dad used to tell me.  Your probably just using muscles that you haven't in a while, and they are getting tired.

Normally I would concur, but this is not a good advice. Fatigue is fatigue, but if the muscles are tired, you are more likely to be injured. Better safe than sorry.

[K. Mogensen]

Hey thanks for the help guys. Didn't shoot yesterday (it was raining anyway) and my shoulders are feeling a lot better. Still a bit achey but I did some stretches with em last night and this morning and they feel loads better. I'm gonna lay off shooting untill Tuesday or Wednseday though.

Bronz, this came to me after I read your post, the week before week we did a Close grip bench press two sessions in a row along with front squats. Could that cause inflammation like your talking? Seemed like after that is when it got a bit worse. Our coach doesn't let us get too crazy doing a whole lot of fancy overhead lifts like Military and what not, but we do bench and squat and curl a lot.

Thanks!

[Hookeye]

I had terrible shoulder pain, in both (started in one then went to other also with reduced shooting).

Pinched nerve was my problem, in my spine.

Doesn't sound like yours is from a similar cause, I just posted to let others know that shoulder pain might not be from a shoulder issue.

Yours sounds like it might be simple inflammation (not funny though). If you can handle anti-inflammatories you might want to try them.

Rest alone might not be enough to get things settled. An anti-inflam and rest might make you good as new, you might not get inflammed again if you warm up like others have suggested, and don't overdo practice sessions.

Over-use syndromes suck.

[BRONZ]

It sounds like your coach is sensible.  Bottom line, don't get caught up in the machismo that tends to plague that type of competitive environment.  Be smart about what you're lifting and how much.  
Also, with any type of athletic training, you need to train like a triathelte.  I don't mean that you have to run, bike, swim-- you need to mix it up.  True body builders don't work the same areas, or do the same routine each day.  When you exercise, you cause microtears in your muscles.  If you don't give this time to heal, you can experience issues.  So, continue some of the same exercises, lay off anything overhead or that targets your shoulders, and don't forget other areas like your back, scapular rotators, etc.
I hope this is clear enough.  Let me know if you have any other questions.

Manolito

[K. Mogensen]

Very clear. Thanks very much! Our coach does mix it up, we have never done the same routine twice.