Horrible archery shop experience

[Hookeye]

I worked in a gun/bow shop for a while, hung out before that as tech help, and have sold guns with my dad (not same shop) off and on for years.

I know sales is sales, and the customer is your meal ticket.

But frankly, sometimes it's better to freakin' starve.

I have heard so much Bee Ess and junk science, outright lies and macho stupidity, on guns, ballistics, compounds and even recurves........it just makes it very tough sometimes to not whip out a judo point and thwap some jerk between the eyes.

Yeah, with those folks it won't do any good on their end, but man it would have made me feel better.

In defense of sales people........some customers just like being clueless or difficult. One of those can really test a retail person's character.

Maybe a jerk or jerks beat up the sales guy before our forum brother got there?

Not saying that the event was proper, but a one time experience may not be fully indicative of the shop or sales person.

[Hookeye]

BTW, I am so glad I no longer work retail  

[Spectre]

Originally posted by Hookeye:
FWIW the current aluminum charts do suggest way overspined shafts.

If the sales guy consulted a recent distributor's catalog it would be an honest error.

I had a customer come in with a 45# recurve and the charts showed 2117 or 2216 and I told him  forget that, go qwith 1816 or 1916.

He didn't want to believe me over the charts in the shop or those he saw online! I didn't try to push it, just explained I had similar bows and what worked well for me.

The conversation went to my current setup....and he was more receptive of my carbon arrow explanations. Mine shot well for him, so he had me build him a comparable set.

Stopped the talking, we went shooting, light bulbs came on, sales made.

Happy customer with proper gear that works well for him- proven before the sale (and after).

This, in a predominately compound shop.

I would like to shake your hand.

[Bowwild]

I get pretty excited about bows but I rarely get fired up (silly excited) over arrows.  However, the Beeman MFX Classic 600's I've been shooting are fantastic!  I have another dozen arriving early next week.  This is a very tough arrow and quite narrow which I like for my set-up.  I've been shooting them since March. I'm down to 6 of the original arrows -- lost 5 and broke one.  Some days I shoot 3-4 times (6-100 arrows) so I average at least daily shooting.  I've dug them out of trees, bounced them off cedars and banged up a lot of field points on earth-bound stones. Oddly enough, the one I broke snapped a couple inches below the feathers. I haven't had a single shaft damaged at the shaft end and I don't use any kind of spacer or "o" ring.

My only complaint is that the finish (wood grain) gets roughed up after slideing arrows along side each other -- of course these would be dents in aluminum or splits in some carbons.

[KEG]

I pull somewhere around 26.5 to 27 inches. Shooting a bow that light, I'm guessing 1816 or 1913. If you want to try a 1913 send me a message.
Ken

[Shawn Leonard]

Looper has it right as far as shop is concerned. I would get some 1916s and put 150 grains on the front and cut them to 29"s. If ya want 125 grain heads a 29" 1816 would work well. Do not be discouraged, half the fun in Trad is experimenting and learning through trial and error. If ya decide carbon is what ya want a Gold Tip Entrada 600 cut to 29"s with a 50 grain brass insert and 125 grain point would shoot awesome out of that bow. I also have some fiberglass arrows that would work for ya, if ya want them(half dozen or so) PM me with your addy and I will get them out to ya! Just let me know!! Have fun and don't worry about some joker ya don't even know!! Shawn

[Pokerdaddy]

Thanks again everyone for all the advice and encouragement.  I started this thread just after returning from the shop.  Now, eight hours after the fact, I've chalked this one up to experience.

[ishoot4thrills]

Originally posted by Grey Taylor:
I am pretty sure that rule is only for the bow classifieds.

Guy

Yes, I think the rule about the minimum number of posts applies to selling/buying/trading bows, not arrows and such.

[Tsalagi]

I don't go to my local archery shop because he doesn't have anything I want and expresses no interest in even stocking a bare minimum of it. So, despite all the pleas here in town to "buy local", I vote with my wallet and buy from Three Rivers Archery. There was one shop here some years back that would tell me "I can order it..." Well, so can I! And probably for less. Both have literally turned up their noses at wood arrows, so I'm not interested in supporting those kinds of attitudes with my money.      

One shop told me, "Nobody shoots wood arrows anymore!" I said, oh, is that right? So, many of the people I see in Traditional Bowhunter and all the people I see in Primitive Archer magazines aren't shooting wood arrows? No answer. It's like, look, I know you want to sell me carbon arrows and that's fine. But I already said I don't like them and don't shoot them. So why keep trying to hard sell me on them? I wanted to go check the sign again to see if I'd stumbled into a car dealership by mistake.

But, there was some sweet vicarious revenge. After Lord of the Rings came out, crowds of local teens were going in there and wasting the guy's time asking for "I want that bow like Legolas used in Lord of the Rings! NO! Not that thingie with wheels! He didn't shoot THAT! I want the bow Legolas shot!" And, gee, not that I SENT any of them in there looking for it...  

[RAU]

Yes getting traditional stuff or advice at a local archery shop is downright painfull. Atleast around here where the compound and crossbow rule, and the only trad stuff you'll see is hanging on the wall as a decoration. I know around here if I had a shop cut arrows and glue in inserts theyd never take em back no matter how much I carried on. As said above most of these guys look at you like your too poor or stupid to buy a "real" bow. If I was you I'd ask my questions here and stick with some sponsors here for your gear. Targets are easy enough to make and nothing beats walking the woods with blunts or judos glued to wood arrows you've assembled yourself. (or screwd into aluminum for that matter) If they made you feel lousy about your choice in equipment SCR#W THEM!!!! Good luck, this is fun stuff and they'll never know what their missing!

[Tsalagi]

RAU said, "As said above most of these guys look at you like your too poor or stupid to buy a "real" bow."

EXACTLY!!! Thank you for saying that! That's why I let my "fingers do the walking"---and the buying, LOL!!!

[COLongbow]

RMS Gear gets my money in our area. 3Rivers is great and I have bought from them in the past, but I'll drive an hour to buy the same thing from the Clum boys!

[dan d]

Originally posted by ripforce56:
If you get around Grand Rapids there is a Trad only store in Sand Lake called Wilderness Dreams  

I live in the thumb of Mich. and that is where I get a lot of my stuff from (wilderness Dreams) and I am very familiar with the shop in Bay City, they treat you great if you buy a $1,000 wheelie bow and spend another grand in accesorries, I haven't been there in years, last time I was there they didn't have nothing but high tech crap, probably don't even have much of a selection for aluminum arrows anymore. They do have a good business, because there are a lot of hunters who "have more money than brains" follow the advice of the forum members, it's the best resource we have !

[Big Riser]

I own a 42# PEARSON BOW, I have won tournaments with that bow and my 1916 arrows.Dont let these training wheel boys tell you what the men all ready know.1916 arrows will work the best.

[LAR43]

Stick with Shawn . .He's the arrow meister & has saved a lot of people a lot of money & frustration.

Larry

[Hookeye]

Sorry guys.......I've seen my shop owner get stuff for "customers" and they then change their minds, buy it elsewhere (to save a dollar or two, but burn 20 in gas) or flat out act like they never requested the stuff.

Either way, the shop then sits on the stuff, or sells it at cost, or less.

Ordering stuff "out of the norm" is expensive and risky for the general gun/bow shop owner.

You might be a decent guy, but that doesn't mean the 20-30 others that have special requests are.

Not saying stuff needs to sell fast, but it needs to move at a decent rate, to allow for flexible purchases based on general demand/seasonal changes.

Doesn't take much to strangle a small shop or one with tighter momentary expenses (like building expansion, increased market capture attempts etc.)

This stuff happens a lot, you try to be helpful and flexible, but in doing so you do get burned.

How much can one tolerate (process wise and cost)?

If one sets policies to minimize/avoid such loss, then most folks are going to consider the shop/personnel too "hard arse".

Again, you might have good intentions, be a great customer (or potential one) but it's the majority of others who set the tone for a shop.

Maybe the shop owners and staff should be condemned for some of their actions/policies.......but in most instances, from a bit of experience, critics need to look at their fellow bow and gun shooters for mucking things up.

[Hookeye]

To sum up: there are more jerks shopping than good guys.

The good guys: thank God there are a few well spaced to maintain sanity in the retail market!

We do appreciate you guys!

But there simply are not enough of you to counter the dishonest and or stupid. Their population is exponential to yours.

[Hookeye]

FWIW I was on the archery range (indoor) shooting my fairly new BW SA2 and some older guy, with his wife, laughed at me (was getting his brand new Mathews Ovation set up).

He loudly said my bow must have been a garage sale find, I didn't have much $ and that he was buying the best.

I was shooting well but he still scoffed at me.

Enough was enough. walked off the line to his wife, after I heard her say my bow was pretty, and showed it to her (he close by).

I was super nice, politely told her who made it, that it was custom made to my specs, and what it cost.

He shut the heck up.

Just one of many jerks I've seen/heard on the ranges and in shops.

Man it does get old. To have fun with it you have to let them burn themselves  

[Hookeye]

Will add that I too have seen shops treat trad guys as less than sophisticated, not give out the same care/attention in gear selection or service.

Shame.

Kinda tricky to get the right info to the guy wanting it, when you are just a customer yourself.

Most times though the non trad guys will accept your info, at least in part, and be willing to order the stuff for the guy, if you let them maintain some professional position.

Can catch a bit of heck for offering help when it isn't asked for, but if done with a bit of tact, a bad situation can be avoided.

The customer should get what he needs, but you might get labelled a jerk or know it all.

Eh, some archers have fragile egos. Too bad if they can't handle it.

If I go back and they treat me crappy I just tell them off and never go there again.

Amazing how childish so many adults are.

That's why you should always buy a take down. You can break your bow over their heads should things escalate and you don't wipe out a complete rig  

[Spectre]

Originally posted by Hookeye:
FWIW I was on the archery range (indoor) shooting my fairly new BW SA2 and some older guy, with his wife, laughed at me (was getting his brand new Mathews Ovation set up).

He loudly said my bow must have been a garage sale find, I didn't have much $ and that he was buying the best.

I was shooting well but he still scoffed at me.

Enough was enough. walked off the line to his wife, after I heard her say my bow was pretty, and showed it to her (he close by).

I was super nice, politely told her who made it, that it was custom made to my specs, and what it cost.

He shut the heck up.

Just one of many jerks I've seen/heard on the ranges and in shops.

Man it does get old. To have fun with it you have to let them burn themselves    

I had very close to the same experience, I was shooting my Gila selfbow. People can really be jerks at times---particularly show-off techno nuts. I would put me and that Gila against most with a *cough* wheeled doohickey gizzy anyday.