1st Time Cedar Arrow builder has questions

[SEMO_HUNTER]

Sorry if this is in the wrong place, but I didn't see a category for arrow building?

This is my first time spining, cresting, sealing, and fletching my own custom made cedar shafts.
I've built my own arrows for years using aluminum and carbon, but only dabbled in cresting, and never sealed or even fletched a wood arrow before.

My first one with a burgundy arrow wrap turned out fine because I could fletch right over the arrow wrap like I do on everything else, no brainer.
It wasn't until I decided to break out the cresting kit that I've had for probably 15 years and put it to good use.
Ok, so I spined, finish sanded, and stained my shafts and started cresting them.
I actually did a decent job with it if I do say so myself.

Now here's the problem......After my cresting had dried for over an hour and I could touch them without feeling any tackiness, I decide to go ahead and seal them with clear Polyurethane.
When I got to the crested part the colors started to run a little, so I made one real quick pass over them before they could run enough to ruin my cresting job.

Is there a certain type of paint and sealer combination that needs to be used so the colors don't run when sealed?
I know that all chemicals are not compatible with each other, but I used spray paint from a can sprayed into the cap to dip my brush in and I'm not sure what base they are made from, but evidently it's polyurethane based and they actually started to get wet again when I tried to seal them?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

[Grey Taylor]

You're using different materials than I use but I suspect that you need to give your cresting additional curing time. There is a big difference between "dry" and "cured."

Guy

[WESTBROOK]

You need to let your cresting work set overnight and cure befor dipping the finish.

Eric

[seabass]

i just finished a few.i used water based hobby paints and stains.then i went over that with a water based satin poly.i am by no means an expert on arrows.i have only done a few dozen.this combo was very easy and worked very well for me.good luck with your arrows,steve

[SEMO_HUNTER]

Thanks guys.
So there isn't anything wrong with what I'm using, I just need to give it more time to cure before sealing?
I thought that maybe the Polyurethane sealer was a no go?

Does anybody want to share specific brand names of paint and sealer they use?
I had read somewhere that some guys use Tester brand model paint for cresting?

[reddogge]

I paint with acrylic colors from 3 Rivers, Testors acrylic, other Hobby store acrylic paint.  I seal with Minwax wipe on poly.

[Orion]

I seal first and crest second.  Don't put anything over my cresting.

[SEMO_HUNTER]

Originally posted by reddogge:
I paint with acrylic colors from 3 Rivers, Testors acrylic, other Hobby store acrylic paint.  I seal with Minwax wipe on poly.

Thanks for that info, the Minwax Polyurethane is what I have. So, evidently I need some acrylic paint, like the Testors model paint?
No problem, one trip to Wally world and I'll be set.

[SEMO_HUNTER]

Originally posted by Orion:
I seal first and crest second.  Don't put anything over my cresting.

I also tried sealing, then cresting, then sealing over the cresting and the colors bled just a tiny bit, but not as bad. I must have just rushed the process too much?
I do need some new paint though. Right now I was just using what I could find in my paint cabinet out in the garage. That's what I get for not being prepared first.
It's ok though, they didn't run bad enough to ruin the cresting job, and you would probably have to look real close to notice, but the fact remains that I know it's there and that bothers me. I know, I'm too anal meticulous.
I think I have OCD?      :D

[Grey Taylor]

I use acrylic craft paints over the bare wood and then seal with gasket lacquer.
If the Testors paint is not water-based then it is not acrylic.
I really don't see anything wrong with what you are using, except for the inconvenience of spraying the crest paint out of a can. Just give it more dry time.
One more thing: is the polyurethane you're using water-based or oil-based?

Guy

[mahantango]

I don't care for anything water base or "acrylic" on anything that is going to be exposed to weather. I stain with oil base like Minwax, then seal with Minwax poly - gloss is the toughest. Mask shaft and spray "cap" with Krylon or Rustoleum enamel.Crest with thinned Testors model paint, then spray a couple more coats of poly for insurance. It is very important to let the paint cure well: overnight to a couple days depending on temp and humidity, and then a full cure before shooting or they will smear. This makes for a very durable finish, but if you are in a hurry, laquer would be the way to go.

[Grey Taylor]

Mahantango, when I worked for a major paint manufacturer I saw a lot of feelings like yours.
All I can say is that water-based does not mean water-soluable. Once the paint is cured it goes through a chemical change and water will no longer affect it in the same way. If you go to the local paint store you'll see a lot more water-based paints than oil-based. It will work fine when exposed to weather.

Guy

[lpcjon2]

I sand seal one coat (water based poly 3to 1 ratio)and then crest with Testors,and then 2 more coats of poly during each phase I let it dry at a minimum of 12-14hrs.sealing before cresting makes the color look better,and if you put a coat of white down before you crest the color will pop up bright.And the 2 coats of seal after help protect the crest.

[SEMO_HUNTER]

Thanks Guys!
Lot's of Great Info Here!!
There should be a seperate category for this topic, because obviously there are lots of great ideas and info here on the subject.

If any of the Moderators read this, Please consider an Arrow Building category for this type of discussion.

Thanks to everybody for thier tips, keep em' coming! Cause I'm soaking every bit of it in.

[NoCams]

Heh Semo,
I had quite a few disasters when i got started, mainly due to using the regular old testors at Wally World that is enamel based. I then went to Hobby Lobby and got me some testors acrylics and problems solved ! I am no pro arrow crafter by any means but here is what I use....

Minwax or 3 rivers stain

Krylon acrylic enamel in a quart can from Wally world thinned big time with water for my cap dips

Testors acrylic enamels for cresting

Dalys Profin in a quart can for 3 coats of clear topcoat.

Everything works well together and all can be bought locally at Wally World or Hobby Lobby except for the Dalys. I had to order it direct from Dalys and that quart will last me several years. The two greatest things about the Dalys Profin is it is clear and will not yellow over my white cap dips and no target burn.

I used to fletch with Duco and still do some but love the Bohning fletch tape. The Duco will actually melt down into the Dalys and you cannot even see the glue line when it dries. $1 a tube at Family Dollar, $2 at Ace hardware, O'Reilly's and other places.

[SEMO_HUNTER]

No Cams- I'm glad you mentioned the Duco because that was going to be my next question. I read on another forum that lots of guys use Duco for fletching, it's supposed to be the way to go?
I'm going to pick some up before I fletch these shafts up that I've got ready. First I'm going to let them hang for a day or so, just so I don't screw up any further.

Is there any particular type of Duco cement that I need, or just plain old Duco cement for general purpose?

Thanks.

[NoCams]

Heh bud,
Just Duco in the green tube. Use it for nocks and fletching. Use ferrel tite hot melt for tips and broadheads.

[SEMO_HUNTER]

Originally posted by NoCams:
Heh bud,
Just Duco in the green tube. Use it for nocks and fletching. Use ferrel tite hot melt for tips and broadheads.

Thanks Man, I'm gonna pick some up tomorrow.  

[Gene Gillis]

I usually use the wifes hair dryer to speed up dry time on the cresting. I do like acrylic for this. For the sealing I use both waterbase and polyurathane. Epoxy urathanes will sometimes lift the cresting if I use the enamels. Causing a wrinkle finish, not acceptable.