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Author Topic: Baiting pole  (Read 2064 times)

Offline Turkeys Fear Me

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Re: Baiting pole
« Reply #60 on: October 21, 2010, 08:10:00 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Wolfie2nd:
I just think when you live in a state as small as NJ with little woods for all the hunters we have and people are baiting it will put the others at a disadvantage that don't bait and chose to scout.

                                    :knothead:                  :banghead:                                    
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All depends on how you look at it I guess.  "Scouting" involves finding the food sources, bedding areas, and the travel routes between them.  Unless the deer are bedding ON the corn piles, I'd say that puts YOU at an advantage.  If someone decides to create a food source, why don't you hunt smart and intercept the deer before they get there?  No different than intercepting them before they get to a corn field, and oak grove, or a bean field.

Offline Bowwild

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Re: Baiting pole
« Reply #61 on: October 21, 2010, 08:43:00 AM »
A pile of corn and a 100 acre cornfield are the same only to someone who has never seen either and can't picture it in their mind. They might also be the same to someone who simply wants to be contrary.

I go back to my litmus test (same one I use on high fences). Kill over bait. Set up the picture. Is the bait pile in the picture or not? Your answer reveals your most honest opinion of a deer killed over bait. By the way, this is very concrete for me regarding deer but I admit to being torn about bears. Also, because I consider exotic hogs a blight on the natural landscape I'd support any (legal) method of getting them dead.

Last year when hunting with my best friend in Indiana I hunted stands bordering a picked cornfield that was about 160 acres. I saw three of the largest bucks I've ever seen during a few of those days - the closest @ 38 yards. I was hunting with a compound.  This year I won't hunt the edges of this corn field because the trails are so profuse one can't predict where the deer will enter and then move away from predator(Me)- hiding cover. So, becaue I'm using a recurve and have knocked 10 yards off my effective range I will hunt the woods for closer-funneled-shots.  

There seems to be nothing new under the sun when it comes to defending, offending or letting live opinions on baiting. The only thing I see that comes from these threads is that they bring out the worst behavior among many of us.  None of us like to be attacked for our hunting choices and I understand that. Even though many of these posts don't directly aim to cricize or judge another hunter's methods, that's how these questions usually come across and end up. I definitely think it is improper to get all puffed up and "demand" others make the same choices (to bait or not, recurve/longbow, far/close, heavy/light, camo/goodwill, etc.) that you make.

It would be recreation for me to read a post that pits recurve shooters vs. longbow shooters. But, I'm sure not going to start one just for fun because my mind is made up on that personal decision and I don't need any back-up for the choice.

I'm a retired wildlife biologist (KY Wildlife Director) but I started as a bowhunter and, God-willing, I'll end as one. I know the hazards to the resource (many are unproven by the way)and that matters to me. Some of these diseases that can be transmitted nose to nose, etc. are nearly impossible to get rid of once in the population. Baiting doesn't cause any of these diseases -- but the pile technique of attracting many animals to the same few square feet may sure help them spread if an infected animal is around. We don't want these diseases. If you don't live in WI or MI or haven't read about the impacts (CWD in WI and TB in MI), you should. The most common reaction of a wildlife agency to do battle with these diseases is to hammer the deer herd -- to as close to zero as possible and start over.

For me, the only scenario I could see myself using bait would be if I hunted small tracts surrounded by small tracts and the neighbors were baiting. In such a case, no matter the quality of your small acreage one might have to join the fray in order to share the fun. I know some of you deal with exactly this situation and I feel for you. I'm not saying I would and I'll do everything I can to keep my options (and mind) more open.

When I watch outdoor tv the only thing that will cause me to turn the channel quicker than evidence of tightly scattered bait is a high fence. The film directors are masters at hiding the fences in these shows but they don't mind pouring a bag of C'mere Deer on the ground for all to see -- especially as the sponsor shells out the motivativion. I even saw in a commercial the other day (because I'd never watch their show)a self-promoting celebrity eating the stuff.

Offline BobCo 1965

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Re: Baiting pole
« Reply #62 on: October 21, 2010, 09:11:00 AM »
Personally I do not believe there is anything wrong with baiting. Can't do it here in NY though.

Reasons: For one there is an aweful lot of natural food here including apple, oaks, beech,  crops, etc. Deer forage, so what difference does it actually make? These foods sources are provided all the time so the nocturnal agruement does not apply as I see it. I would be against bringing in literal tons of bait and leaving it in a pile. But for the the few pounds a feeder provides a day, I don't see the arguement. Personally I hunt apple trees which are a source of food (leaves included) to increase my chances, so I don't see the problem hunting over some other type of food.

JMHO.

Offline trapperzeke

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Re: Baiting pole
« Reply #63 on: October 21, 2010, 09:25:00 AM »
I respect the right of anyone who chooses to bait as long as it's legal in their state.  I grew up in a state where it was taboo, and when I moved to where it was legal, it just felt wrong to me.  To each his own, but it's not for me.

Offline chopx2

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Re: Baiting pole
« Reply #64 on: October 21, 2010, 09:34:00 AM »
Why do I care what someone else does on their land? I make my own choices. If we don't stop these silly and petty disagreements we will wind up like Europe.

In my parents home country you are not allowed to hunt your own land if it is not designated as a hunting area by the government. Landowners there have no rights. In fact you can't even own a cow for milk. You either have to be a farmer and have a minimum number of animals or you can have nothing.

I prefer having choice and I certainly feel like I should be allowed to do what is deemed legal on my own property.

We keep making up rules for others to follow we will soon all be faced with rules no one wants.

Sorry to rant, but we have to protect our liberties even if we don't like them all. Just make your own choice and let others make their own.
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Online Kelly

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Re: Baiting pole
« Reply #65 on: October 21, 2010, 09:58:00 AM »
Many things one does in life, like hunting are "personal"-we do it for ourselves and only that.

As long as it is legal, PLEASE DON'T TELL OTHERS WHAT THEY SHOULD DO BASED UPON YOUR OPINIONS OF WHAT IS ETHICAL OR NOT! Frankly, it is none of your business.

Likewise, I could care less how you want to do "personal" things.
>>>>============>

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Offline Red4arm

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Re: Baiting pole
« Reply #66 on: October 21, 2010, 10:17:00 AM »
Bowwild, good points. You never see a corn pile in the hero shot. A bait pile concentrates the area a deer uses much more than a field or a stand of oaks. I will support those rights to bait it, if its legal, I just hope it will not become legal in my state.
I try to live by this rule: If I were embarrassed to see it on the front page of the paper, or a billboard in town, then i don't do it.
I can see it now... local man kills fawn over bait pile.. way to go!!

Offline Mitch-In-NJ

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Re: Baiting pole
« Reply #67 on: October 21, 2010, 12:59:00 PM »
It's not for me.

I will hunt over corn, beans, acorns etc., but I don't bait.  Why?  Because I don't have to pay for corn, beans or acorns.

To me, that's the difference.

That said, I did hunt deer in San Angelo once and the guy who had the lease did have a feeder.  And I setup between the bedding area and the feeder.  Does that make me a hypocrite?  I don't think so.  I didn't put out the feeder and I didn't hunt over it.  But I did use it to my advantage.  BTW - I didn't get a deer on that trip but I did get two turkeys.

I was not aware of the scientific issues with baiting.
"The encouragement of a proper hunting spirit, a proper love of sport, instead of being incompatible with a love of nature and wild things, offers the best guaranty for their preservation."

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Offline RAU

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Re: Baiting pole
« Reply #68 on: October 21, 2010, 01:00:00 PM »
Its illegal here in pa, and im glad.  I dont hold anything against anyone who wants to bait where it legal its just not for me.Theres room for all of us out there. compounds rifles etc. (even crossbows i just wish they werent legal archery gear for everyone like they are now in Pa). I think the issue should be watched and studied where disease has been detected. I think Bowwild's Lithmus test is really, really acurate too for judging how one feels about bait.

The thing that really truly annoys me is when baiters get defensive and say things like "you're hunting a cornfeild? you too are hunting over bait!! You hunting an orchard? your hunting bait! Oak ridge? bait!!"   COME ON!! APPLES AND ORANGES!!!

Offline Wolfie2nd

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Re: Baiting pole
« Reply #69 on: October 21, 2010, 01:11:00 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Wolfie2nd:
I want to know if you guys think baiting should be legal and why?
Sorry about the bad wording

Offline Turkeys Fear Me

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Re: Baiting pole
« Reply #70 on: October 21, 2010, 02:27:00 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by RAU:
 COME ON!! APPLES AND ORANGES!!!
Those are bait too, along with pears, grapes, peaches, and...

   ;)

Offline mrjsl

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Re: Baiting pole
« Reply #71 on: October 21, 2010, 02:56:00 PM »
I live in the south, and practically 100% of the private land within driving distance of me is covered up with feeders and each feeder has a trail camera aimed at it, and everyone of these trail cameras is busy snapping pictures of deer every night. That is a lot of $$ invested in what?

I personally would rather quit hunting than hunt over bait. Having done it without bait all my life, I just have no desire to. I have been invited to S. Texas several times, and am not interested.

I wish it were illegal here, as we have tons of hunters who know no other way. They spill over onto public land where baiting is illegal, and bring liquid attractants, salt blocks, cans of aerosol stuff, and even corn. If you had the money that is blown on attracting deer in the south, you could buy an island. I firmly believe that if baiting were outlawed here, practically everyone would see more deer per day's hunt.

However, I am pretty sure that I am the only deer hunter in Mississippi or Texas who feels the way I do, so I'm used to being the minority.

Offline L. E. Carroll

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Re: Baiting pole
« Reply #72 on: October 21, 2010, 04:41:00 PM »
If you are sitting over a bait poured on the ground in front of your stand....it can in no way be equated as to trying to figure out how that big buck is entering and leaving that "darn big corn or bean field"... I have also never seen a bunch of tree's that dropped all of their mast in one hat sized pile in front of a tree stand... How can anyone not consider this "Apples and Oranges"...

IMO, if the circumstance permit, a good spot and stalk or fall "buck rub line" of trees during the rut [ a natural thing like apples naturally falling from trees], would be the way I would attempt my hunt.. sitting over a bait I would consider more "Killing than Hunting".

Again, I'm glad I live in the West and don't have to make the choice....

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Online Over&Under

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Re: Baiting pole
« Reply #73 on: October 21, 2010, 04:49:00 PM »
I just voted and was surprised how close the race was!

Interesting thread.  If it is legal for hogs why not deer?  Now baiting elk seems just wierd though.
“Elk (add hogs to the list) are not hard to hit....they're just easy to miss"          :)
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Offline wojo124

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Re: Baiting pole
« Reply #74 on: October 21, 2010, 04:56:00 PM »
I dont hunt deer over bait, never have never will.... but if someone wants to bait so be it...dosent bother me.
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Offline lpcjon2

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Re: Baiting pole
« Reply #75 on: October 21, 2010, 05:19:00 PM »
Just for the fun of it there is approx.200 kernels of corn to an ear,5 ears to a stalk. So if we dropped 1000 kernels of corn in a small pile every 18" in a row to cover a acre. Would that be the equivalent of mass product produced by an acre of standing corn? So would that be baiting if it equals the same amount spread over the same area as whats there?    :jumper:      :D
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Offline buckeye_hunter

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Re: Baiting pole
« Reply #76 on: October 21, 2010, 06:20:00 PM »
In the area I hunt...all the deer are in the neighborhoods since people put corn out for the deer. I am thinking about counter measures.......  :readit:    :saywhat:

Offline RAU

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Re: Baiting pole
« Reply #77 on: October 21, 2010, 08:09:00 PM »
lpcjon2 do you bait deer? I see no problem with you baiting deer if its legal in jersey I'm just curious. You hunt however you want to. As been said before hunting is a personal thing and its none of my buisness how you go about it. If baiting was legal in pa I wouldnt take part in it because to me (TO ME) its not interacting with the woods or the way things are working before i get there. Hunting agricullture, or oak ridges etc still requires reading sign and some woodsmanship. By dumping bait and sitting it you are MANIPULATING deer behavior. You control it. You are making it happen where you want it to.  You could always find a side on a bait pile to sit no matter what the wind is doing.

I said before if its legal and you like it bait away! You could have a sugar beet pile i could see from space on google map and I dont care! Its none of my buisness!! I just get annoyed when people say that hunting a pre existing food or other attractant is baiting!! Ive said all im going to on this topic. I get myself drawn into it every time it comes up and Im not going to again, I just wanted to say a few things before this thread gets yanked (and it will). I'm done now. Goodnight.

Offline Wolfie2nd

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Re: Baiting pole
« Reply #78 on: October 21, 2010, 08:28:00 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by RAU:
lpcjon2 do you bait deer? I see no problem with you baiting deer if its legal in jersey I'm just curious. You hunt however you want to. As been said before hunting is a personal thing and its none of my buisness how you go about it. If baiting was legal in pa I wouldnt take part in it because to me (TO ME) its not interacting with the woods or the way things are working before i get there. Hunting agricullture, or oak ridges etc still requires reading sign and some woodsmanship. By dumping bait and sitting it you are MANIPULATING deer behavior. You control it. You are making it happen where you want it to.  You could always find a side on a bait pile to sit no matter what the wind is doing.

I said before if its legal and you like it bait away! You could have a sugar beet pile i could see from space on google map and I dont care! Its none of my buisness!! I just get annoyed when people say that hunting a pre existing food or other attractant is baiting!! Ive said all im going to on this topic. I get myself drawn into it every time it comes up and Im not going to again, I just wanted to say a few things before this thread gets yanked (and it will). I'm done now. Goodnight.
Well spoken brother could not have said it better myself!

Offline champ38

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Re: Baiting pole
« Reply #79 on: October 21, 2010, 08:45:00 PM »
Not legal here, but if it was..I would sho be truckin the corn in. I would have no problem killin deer over corn or any of the other baits mentioned.
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