FF or B-50 Which is best for a Hill bow ?

[Ralphie]

I will soon be shooting a used HH bow which is able to shoot FF strings. The story I have been told is that using FF strings on a Hill bow will shorten the life of the bow. Others Hill shooters have said that is a myth.
 I was just hoping to hear some of the opinions of  Hill shooters.
Which is best, ..... and why

thanks

[LongStick64]

I've always used B50 and now use B55 and I don't see a reason to change. Hill bows are not speed demons, just hard hitting bows, so I don't see the need for a stiffer string. I like a bow that delivers a quiet arrow where I'm looking, I don't care how fast it gets there. As far as durability, I've never had a string break, so again I don't see the advantage.

[Rob DiStefano]

there is no such thing as a general "best" string material for any given bow.  ditto's for a "best bow" or "best arrow" or "best broadhead".  see where this is going?  :D  

there are essentially two types of "modern" bowstring fibers, polyester ("dacron" - b50, b500, b55, etc) and low stretch/low creep hmpe ("high modulus polyethylene" -  dyneema, spectra, vectran - fast flight, d97, 450, etc).
 
almost all modern laminated stickbows are designed to safely handle hmpe bowstring fibers, which includes howard hill archery longbows.

the bottom line is that *you* need to try out different string fiber types and choose what appears to work best for you.

my opinion - i only use hmpe bowstring fibers as they allow using less strands (polyester/dacron will not allow this), for a better feeling release/shot.  there are some who find less strand counts contributes to a quieter bow on release, and faster arrow speeds.

again - howard hill bows can safely use any modern bow string fiber, and it's up to you to decide what will work best for ... you.

[Ben Maher]

What Rob said!
I use both ... I have spools and spools of B 50b so it gets a fair workout . When using it I can often forego silencers as it remains whisper quiet. Using newer low stretch material I often find the shot has a "crisp " punchier feel to it . Its all good !
It really is a personal preference...

[Ralphie]

I guess I was more paying attention to the "advice"  I was given;

 that hmpe strings  on a Hill bow will shorten the life of the bow. That they could be shot, but were "not recommended".

I use FF D-97  on a Wes Wallace, and like it. If FF can be used on a Hill without "shortening  the bow's life", I think I would use FF.

thanks
And yes, ....  100%
Trying for myself is the only way to decide.

[JRY309]

I shoot a padded loop 8125 on my HH Half Breed and arrows of 9-11 gpp.Dacron on a Hill can increase handshock,probably where Hill's got the reputation of having alot of handshock.Didn't Howard Hill use a linen string material,that was low stretch like todays FF type strings.When I shot B50 on my Hill's I liked to spin up an endless string with no silencers,just the bare string.Handshock was minimal,but with a padded loop 8125 and whoolie wisps I don't even hardly notice any handshock.And it is quieter then the B50.The only bows I'll shoot B50 on is couple of older recurves,but all my longbows I use a low stretch string on.

[ron w]

B-50 or B-55 for me.......it just works!

[SCATTERSHOT]

That "myth" comes from Craig Eakin himself, who builds the bows and should know. He says they will shorten the life of the bow, but since a bow can last several generations, what does that really mean?

Lotsa folks use the new materials on Hill bows, Try it and see if you like it better than B50 for yourself.

[SpankyNeal]

D-97 on mine and I will never go back to B50...there is no advantage to it that I have seen, but that's just me. Try em and see which you like best, it's not going to hurt the bow.

[GingivitisKahn]

Originally posted by London:
 

Originally posted by LongStick64:
I've always used B50 and now use B55 and I don't see a reason to change. Hill bows are not speed demons, just hard hitting bows, so I don't see the need for a stiffer string. I like a bow that delivers a quiet arrow where I'm looking, I don't care how fast it gets there. As far as durability, I've never had a string break, so again I don't see the advantage.

Hill style bows are not fast so they cannot be "hard hitting" bows. This constant refrain about standard longbows has always annoyed me. It matters no what kind of bow launches the arrow. If it's a slow arrow, it's a slow arrow. Shoot that same arrow out of a faster bow and it's "harder hitting". Hill bows are more accurately described as "soft hitting".

Nothing personal, I own several Hill bows. I also own a chronograph. [/b]

So by your logic a .45acp can't be a hard hitting round because it's slower than a 9mm?  Hard hitting has more components than just speed.  I suspect many of us Hill shooters also enjoy shooting heavier arrows for a number of reasons.  Heavy arrows can (aren't necessarily but can) be harder hitting than fast ones.

Doesn't really matter - it's about pushing a sharp bit of steel (or rock) through stuff that bleeds.

[Ralphie]

The bow that's due to arrive is the Cheetah 43#@28 66".
I CANNOT wait !
and ....
I really appreciate the diverse & informative replies.
It has relaxed me about using, rather trying  a FF string.

ralphie

[LongStick64]

Ok so I can see how hard hitting and speed can be related but how about "quietly effective" with heavy arrows.

[Mr.Magoo]

D97 on my Big Five.  I think the bow feels better on the shot with low/no stretch strings.

[Al Dean]

Your 43@28 with FF will be nearly equal, performance wise, to 48@28 with B-50.

[frank bullitt]

Ralphie, maybe the ? should be, who has wore out a Hill with HP string material?

A Hill bow is not built with much reflex or pre-stress to begin with!

As Al Dean says above, it's a performance thing. Like putting a good set of tires on the ole truck, it will handle awhole lot better!

[ron w]

All I have ever read about different strings has said FF or modern strings give about 2-3 FPS more speed than B-50. If you can tell the difference your a better judge of such things than I !!!

[LongStick64]

Doesn't mass of the arrow have a lot to do with hard hitting and don't some bows perform better with heavier arrows than others. Are these traditional myths of just false impressions.

From my limited experience my 75@28 Howard Hill Half Breed "seems" to bury my heavier shafts a lot deeper into any target I shoot into, and I know I'm not shooting at any blistering speed.

Back to the question.  I have a 53 at 26" Hill Redman model from a Hill blank and tillered to match my Schulz on my tiller board.  I put a padded fast flight on it and found that it shoots about the same as an equal poundage recurve with an endless Dacron string.  With the fast flight it requires a 5 pounds stiffer cedar and it will nicely shoot 1918 eastons cut to 27".  This particular bow has very little hand shock to begin with, so with the fast flight there is less than with the recurve with the dacron.  My Schulz bows and my Robertsons are a bit quicker, but not that much, than my bows from Hill blanks.  I have seen some Hills that were harsh and others that were not, but a padded fast flight makes them all softer in the hand.  I have heard of string grove damage on them from fast flights, but I have never heard of one blowing up with the fast flights.  Equal strand tension and generous padding I think is the secret for not harming them with a fast flight string.  I would think that a good heavy set of arrows and generous silencers on the string would also soften the blow to the bow.  They do have a nice way of making the harsher Hills shoot with less shock for sure.  Forget about all the dissing crap on this thread and enjoy your bow.  Who do you all think makes the best padded fast flights?

[LongStick64]

Wasn't there a concern about FF strings and horn limb tips.

[Rob DiStefano]

it don't matter what launches the arrow.  heavier arras will penetrate more than lighter ones, with all given the same driving force.  pure physics.

hill bows that are braced with hmpe fiber strings ("fast flight") will very typically have a "performance edge" over those hills that are strung with dacron.  the difference is typically quite noticeable in terms of added release stability, lesser hand shock, lower noise and more arra speed.

as long as the stickbow limb tips (and limbs and riser) are overbuilt to handle the stresses of low stretch/creep bowstrings, there are no concerns.  all current howard hill longbows are easily capable of being shot with hmpe bowstrings and will last for more than a few lifetimes under normal use.

i've had a gaggle of hill longbows, all performed notably and easily perceived better in every respect when i used hmpe bowstrings.

ymmv.