Hand shock hill style bows

[greyghost]

Ben, well stated, politically correct. I would have went the other way.     :D  

Gingiuitiskahn:    


Earl

[straitera]

After 3 decades of nothing but straight handled  Hills, they will kick if you hold them wrong. Nothing to worry about however. Hold them to business & you couldn't ask for a smoother more  graceful ride. Wouldn't shoot anything else.

[Mudd]

I have felt hand shock that was so bad it actually gave me a headache and made my bow shoulder and teeth hurt.

All that I have said to this point just proves what my dad always told me. "There's no point in being stupid if you don't show it!"

The stupid part was that I kept trying to shoot a bow that was beating the snot out of me. It dang near ruined my willingness to shoot another longbow.

That was??... I can't be positive about exactly how long ago it was but I'm guessing 30 years and I was trying to shoot an long bow made by Pearson. I think it was an "Old Ben 500"(maybe someone can either correct or verify the name), anyway I hope to find one(not to own) but just to shoot a few times. I want to know what my thoughts would be today about the reality of it's hand shock. I truly want to know, was it me or was it the bow.

I recently traded for a bow that about all I heard and read was about how "shocky" they were and I had to judge for myself(that truly is the only reason I got the bow).

The verdict from me is.. what's the beef? Maybe I just got an exceptional Jerry Hill longbow but this one is about as sweet to shoot as any bow I've had the pleasure in shooting.

If anyone gets a longbow "Hill or Hill style" that you just can't get along with because of handshock drop me a line before you send it to the burn pile, I'll gladly adopt it and give it a good home or burn it for you..lol

Sorry I got long winded.

Now I'll go back and read the thread...lol

God bless,Mudd

[Stone Knife]

Nice one Jim  

[Carbon Jack]

Don't get me wrong, I'm a Hill lover. But to say you have to "hold them correctly" to eliminate hand shock is an admission of hand shock.

Any good recurve can be shot with a light, thumb and first finger hold. On release there is virtually no jump in the bow. Nobody says you have to hold a recurve "correctly" to eliminate hand shock.

Only the Hill bow has to be held correctly. This means there is significant hand shock and the adviser is simply telling you how to handle it by some technique. Still, there is hand shock to overcome.

Hand shock is not evil and the nature of straight longbows. Just like recoil in a big gun. Understand it and ignore it. Do not feel hand shock to be a some failing of the bow design or the person shooting it. I rather think of it as a badge of honor. Real archers overcome real obstacles - we ain't no stinkin' compound shooters with everything just perfect!! lol

Jack

[GingivitisKahn]

Originally posted by Carbon Jack:
Don't get me wrong, I'm a Hill lover. But to say you have to "hold them correctly" to eliminate hand shock is an admission of hand shock.

No. It's an admission of incorrect technique.  

If you hold a recurve by the lower limb tip and somehow manage to shoot an arrow from it, my guess is that you will feel some degree of shock there as well.  After you've done that, find the recurve, hold it right and viola - no shock!

That doesn't mean recurves are shocky.

Same with a Hill style bow - hold it wrong and you will feel it.  Hold it right and hey presto mesto - it works right.

[KPaul]

So How do you grip a Hill style bow?

[Mudd]

Originally posted by KPaul:
So How do you grip a Hill style bow?

I try to tell the folks I'm working with to hold it as if your holding hands with someone you like a lot.

It's firm but not smashing or crushing the other persons hand or fingers but not so loose as to let them slip out of your grasp.

Just my take on this one.

God bless,Mudd

[Jim Wright]

Some Hill style bows have a ton, sme have practically none.

[Mike Vines]

Originally posted by KPaul:
So How do you grip a Hill style bow?

As Howard Hill himself said..."With your arm hanging down at your side, now hold the bow the same as you would carry a suitcase".  I did this, and instantly had no problems with mine from then on out.

[BobCo 1965]

I've had many and love them, but they are just not for me. I just shoot too much and this style of bow was causing me medical problems. It's funny how just a little different style such as a Charlie Lamb Sunbear longbow fit so differently (no shock)for me. People maybe convinced that I am making up myths, have bad form, not holding correctly, etc,etc, etc and that's fine. If it works for you peronally, I am truly happy. But, it does not mean that since it works for one it works for all.

[Carbon Jack]

What happens with the straight limb longbow is the limbs come forward on release and stop all at once when the string snaps back to its starting point.

All that forward motion of the limbs drives the grip forward into your fingers. Typically hand shock is manifest by a pain in the ring and pinky finger as the grip slams forward. Holding the bow loosely and allowing this grip motion to occur makes the impact worse.

To tame this forward action of the grip, you hold the grip firmly and give the grip no room to get up a head of steam. All it takes is as quarter inch or so of slop in your hold/grip to allow the grip to rush forward and smack your fingers.

So you hold firmly and control the forward thrust. Result is much less pain or discomfort. After a while the longbow shooter who holds his bow this way becomes inured to any impact or "thump" in the hand. He goes off telling others there in no hand shock. Perfectly understandable.

I only own longbows but have shot (and owned) many recurves in past years. In my experience there is no comparison between modern recurves and traditional longbows where hand shock is concerned: longbows have plenty. This shock is, however, easily handled by a good grip and a willingness to understand that hand shock is not a social disease and nothing to be ashamed of.

Jack

[leatherneck]

OK, I keep hearing people talk about the grip on a HH longbow and holding it correctly to avoid handshock. Soooo, how about one of you enlightening us and doing a tutorial on proper vs. improper grip for a HH bow. I dont own one but would like to learn what makes a difference. Thanks.

[Carbon Jack]

Originally posted by leatherneck:
OK, I keep hearing people talk about the grip on a HH longbow and holding it correctly to avoid handshock. Soooo, how about one of you enlightening us and doing a tutorial on proper vs. improper grip for a HH bow. I dont own one but would like to learn what makes a difference. Thanks.

Just grab it like a roofing hammer and don't let it float around in your hand. A firm but not crushing grip. That's all there is. No straight-wristed feathery, floating grip like some target recurve shooters use.

Jack

[longbowben]

Everyone can go too Howard Hill longbowmens website Dick has a great section on this.

[redant 60/65]

Thanks Carbon Jack, and all others.  
This is the kind of info. I was looking for when I posted the poll.  

[tg2nd]

I've shot a dozen or so Hill/Hill-Style Bows. No handshock except fom one. Mud mentioned it already. I wasn't able to shoot this one without ruining my teeth. All the others I've shot had no handshock and I shot them with a Dacron-string and arrows in the lower gpp.

[WESTBROOK]

Not mine, 3 Northern Mist, all are as sweet as can be.

You want a really sweet shooting Hill style bow? Get your hands on a Miller all bamboo model or one of the Schulz all bamboo models.

[Rob DiStefano]

by most folks admission that they need to be gripped correctly and to use a decent weight arrow in order to minimize or erradicate any form of 'hand shock'. which tells ya that for the very most part, hills do have some manner of 'hand shock'.  

which is my point.  they are inherently not as smooth on release as an r/d longbow.  whereas you can grip an r/d longbow most anyway you like and not have 'hand shock', this is not true for a hill style longbow.  

none-the-less, i do love the looks and historic mojo surrounding howard hill longbows, and i do shoot them as well.