Arrow-WOES

[btjohnson]

I just started shooting a recurve and have never shot a compound so I am new to archery.  I have an older recurve that is rated for 40# @ 28"  My draw is about 31" so I don't know what the # is at that draw length. The shop that sold me the string also sold me some arrows.  They are CE Heritage 250 with 145 grain field tips and they are full length. I shot them at their indoor range and they worked well, the range being about 10yrds I think.

I then shot them in my back yard for the last couple of weeks at about 10yds and they did fine.  Today I went to my local conservation area and shot 30 stations on their field archery course.  What a disaster!  I am a new shooter so I'm not complaining about my lack of skill but I'm wondering if what I experienced with my arrows is normal.

Beyond 15yds the arrows we always WAY low.  I suspect they 145 grain field points are just too heavy?  I also had some really cheapo "Cajun" arrows with glue on knocks and points and I shot those so much better than the CE's.  Why?   The nocks on 4 of the CE's flew off in flight. Is that normal?  I asked the guy at the shop and he said that nocks are not glued in.  Is that right?  I  also shattered 2 shafts when they hit the metal part of the target (to be expected) but wow that's expensive.  So I started with 6 CE and now have 0 usable arrows.

Are carbons a bad choice for me?  Should I go with wood?  I am NOT going back to this shop and want to buy arrows online because I don't trust the sales guy to give me what I really need.  I've read a lot of the posts about arrows on here but am confused as to the process for determining the correct arrow for me and my bow.  Do I buy a test pack or just buy different arrows until you find the one that works?  I can't spend a fortune and I can't make my own yet.  HELP     :confused:

[Jake Diebolt]

If you don't want to go to carbon or wood, you could go with aluminum.

I would get a test pack of your desired material. Aluminum's cheap, relatively speaking, compared to carbon. Don't know about wood, never shot them.

[BOWMARKS]

If possable find someone in your area that is a traditional shooter to hook up with and get the one on one help. I would think there are some good old boys at your conservation area course. I'll bet that was not a traditional shop.

[Workaholic1]

First things first- Welcome aboard!  These guys here will set you in the right direction.
  I'll let the rest of the guys on here give you advice on arrows, etc, as i just don't have that much experience yet.  Good luck on this, I'm sure these guys will set you right in no time.

-rich

[Bud B.]

Can you post more about your bow? How long is it? If it's a 56" recurve it's likely too short for your long draw. And did the shop guy measure your draw?

I shoot a 40# @ 28" longbow but draw it at 29" and shoot full length GT 1535 Traditionals out of it with 125gr tips. yours might work with 100gr tips, but, if your draw is actually 31" then they would be too short for you.

The Heritage 250s are WAAAAY overspined for your bow and draw.

[njloco]

Also google and see if there is an archery club in your area, they will be more than happy to help. Get some advice about archery books and DVD's here on Trad.

Stick with it, it gets much, much better.

[slivrslingr]

Welcome!  

Call this place  www.thenockingpoint.com  , they are in Winchester Missouri and will help you out.  Your arrows are way overspined (stiff) for your set up and the nocks sound like they are too tight on the string, you shouldn't have to glue them in.  You can open the nock groove up with some sandpaper folded up a couple times.  Hitting the metal post or any other solid object will ruin just about any arrow, no matter the material, so no, carbons aren't a bad choice.  Also, since you're new, keep your practice close, 10 yds or so.  Your shooting will improve with the right arrows and as your form improves, so don't give up!

[btjohnson]

Originally posted by Bud B.:
Can you post more about your bow? How long is it? If it's a 56" recurve it's likely too short for your long draw. And did the shop guy measure your draw?

I shoot a 40# @ 28" longbow but draw it at 29" and shoot full length GT 1535 Traditionals out of it with 125gr tips. yours might work with 100gr tips, but, if your draw is actually 31" then they would be too short for you.

The Heritage 250s are WAAAAY overspined for your bow and draw.

I have a 58" PEARSON 730 "SPECIAL"  No, the shop guy did not measure my draw I did and told him it was about 31" but that may be wrong.  I just drew an arrow and marked it then measured from the lowest point in the nock to the mark and it came out to 28".

[btjohnson]

Originally posted by slivrslingr:
Welcome!  

Call this place  www.thenockingpoint.com  , they are in Winchester Missouri and will help you out.  Your arrows are way overspined (stiff) for your set up and the nocks sound like they are too tight on the string, you shouldn't have to glue them in.  You can open the nock groove up with some sandpaper folded up a couple times.  Hitting the metal post or any other solid object will ruin just about any arrow, no matter the material, so no, carbons aren't a bad choice.  Also, since you're new, keep your practice close, 10 yds or so.  Your shooting will improve with the right arrows and as your form improves, so don't give up!

Thanks I will call them.  This was not a trad shop but came highly rated from some on this site.  I will stick to the 10yd range for now.  No shame in that I guess when I'm just starting out.  There is a 3d shoot coming up with a trad category so I'm thinking I'll go to that to meet other trad archers and get some face to face help.  Thanks for the encouragment.  I won't give up.  What I didn't put in my first post was just how much fun I had!  Man I can see why you guys say this is addictive.  What a rush to send an arrow and see it fly and hear it hit.  WOW!!!   :D

[slivrslingr]

You're on your way!  Meeting up with some other trad shooters will definitely be of benefit. They can help you with form and possibly have some more appropriate arrows for you to try.   Getting your bow and arrows tuned will go a long way to accurate and confident shooting.  It's an addiction for sure!  

[Night Wing]

If your draw length is really 31", I think your 58" bow is too short for you. Long draw lengths like your's and short length bows are hard to control arrow wise when shooting distances go beyond 10 yards in my opinion. I've got a 30" draw length and the shortest recurve I would shoot is 64", but I prefer 66" length recurves. My arrows are 32" BOP (back of point) in length.

Since it's a production made bow, you're drawing somewhere between 46#-49# "if" your draw length is really 31".

For a newcomer to archery, I think shooting aluminum arrows is the way to go since they're easy to tune. Once you get more proficient with your bow, you can try carbon or wood arrows and then compare them against each other to find out which type arrow performs best for you and your bow.

[BEN]

I'm with "Bud. B"-----those arrows are WAY too stiff for your bow!
I shoot CE 250's cut at 30" with 250 gr. up front, out of a 62# Recurve, at 28" draw.....

I have a 54# longbow that is shooting the CE 150's at 29" with 200 gr. up front.....

Most compound archery shops have no idea of what to recommend for Trad. archery....went through it myself. I got the most help from guys on here and finally from a couple ffriends I met while shooting at a local Trad. shop.......

I'm sure you'll get some more help on this thread......  

[BEN]

Also, nocks on carbon arrows are usually NOT glued in, but will eventually come loose if the arrow repeatedly hits hard surfaces, like metal targets or hard-wood trees (or rocks)....

I've been shooting the CE Heritages for about 4 yrs. now, I've never had 1 shatter------And I am not a shooter who never misses by any means    The CE Heritage is the toughest shaft I have tried.

[btjohnson]

Thanks all!  I have decided I'm making a trip this Saturday to "The Nockingpoint"  I feel it is well worth the hour trip to get some real advice from a trad shop.  I will post the outcome!  Come on Friday!!

[Stoutstuff]

Your making a good decision to go to a trad shop and have them help. Save you money and time in the long run. I went to Rocky Mountain Specialty Gear in Denver to help me out with arrows. Bareshafts fly like darts and dialed in in less than 30 minutes. Now the only excuse is the guy pulling the string!

[Rob DiStefano]

yer absolute best bet is to find a local 1-on-1 knowledgeable trad mentor.  you have so many newbie issues going on right now to consider.  gonna be hard to help via posted words ...

[btjohnson]

Is this a rebuke of some sort cause it really comes across that way.

[Killdeer]

Knowing Rob, through the site here, I don't think that he was rebuking you. What I heard was sound advice.

It is so much faster to demonstrate a technique, such as how to eliminate slapping your arm with the string, or keep the arrow from falling off the shelf, than it is to write paragraphs and insert photos or videos.

TradGang is a valuable resource, one might spend hours searching this repository of collected, collective knowledge. The best part is when you can use it to network with your local archers, connect and enjoy the tradition and each other.

Killdeer

 

[BEN]

Originally posted by btjohnson:
Is this a rebuke of some sort cause it really comes across that way.

Would have to say "NO".......

Rob is pretty knowledgeable as are many on this site; however, trying to diagnose confusing arrow problems/ flight is very hard to do from hear-say. Much easier in person......

For example: with a new-to-me bow I recently picked up I was trying  to get carbons figured out for it. I was pretty sure  I had the right spine, but when I shot at home I kept thinking my arrows were porpoising...then I started watching my arrows instead of my target and really couldn't get consistent flight.  
I enlist my buddy. He says" FLight looks perfect to me"; my groups were great!
Problem: my back-yard is a steep hill; my targets are up-hill of me. With the new bow, I was more worried about getting my arrow flight right, and with not being level, I was catching the normal flight movement and paranoia set in, started watching my arrow instead of my target, making it worse.
If I would have just posted on here, but left out the steep back yard --I might have been put in the wrong direction. BUT, having someone experienced watch me shoot ---much better.

TG is a great place for info-----but can't always take the place of "human intel"    

So...keep asking questions....keep learning.....but it's will be much more satisfying and fun to find another trad shooter !  

[bucksbuouy]

check out Stu Miller's dynamic spine calculator. just google it. its very helpful.