TBM Article says it all

[Jeff Strubberg]

Originally posted by Glunt:
I get the introspective part of these types of articals, but reject the idea that the steepest path is the only noble or correct way of arriving somewhere.  

My elitism alarm started to blink as I read it.

I love traditional archery when its about having fun with simple archery gear.  When it starts to become about being against something different, the fun starts draining.

Hunt and let hunt.

 

I hunt with traditional equipment because it's simple and effective.  Sure, the history is interesting and adds dimension.  One thing that history shows cleary is that whatever technology makes the ol' stick and string more effective is what "traditional" archers of the times used!

[Morning Star]

Gap shooter from Chicago...  

[bowtough]

Very well said Ryan! It is an individual decision of equipment used.The road to becoming a human being is to not think too highly of yourself. I feel humility and respect of others run along side of each other. Traditional bowhunting offers much in the way of freedom,and the right to make our own choices! Don't worry be happy,after all Oct. is right around the corner. Gary.  

[RM81]

It's refreshing to read all the comments on this thread and the reason I come to TG everyday.

[smoke1953]

Most writers write based on their philosophy on the outdoors and how they interact with their surroundings while hunting. Writers in TBM, which of course includes Jason, provoke thought while expressing varied opinions on many subjects that are of interest to a readership that is unique. I welcome the thoughts and the reactions however I would hope the reactions would keep in mind that most writers are attempting to convey what they believe without necessarily trying to shove those thoughts down your throat. Cancelling a subscription is everyones right to express their distaste and I have done that in the past but the quality I see in TBM reflects much more that I believe than the contrary. By the way Jason I thought your article was wonderful and sure hit home for me.

[Gen273]

I am with Jason!!!

[Suty]

I Have shot both..... I now shoot Carbons, Why ? Does it really matter ? The point is that we shoot, we hunt , we enjoy the outdoors. Some of us will never let a Carbon Arrow grace our shelves, others, can't understand why use Wood when Carbon is available. I believe that it does not matter why, or that I am more Traditional than the next guy. In the end,  it does not matter if I am on the Primitive Side, or the slightly more Modern Side of the House. What Matters, is we are a Brotherhood.  Tu Carnales, Sutty

[Jason R. Wesbrock]

Originally posted by smoke1953:
 I welcome the thoughts and the reactions however I would hope the reactions would keep in mind that most writers are attempting to convey what they believe without necessarily trying to shove those thoughts down your throat.

I agree. Trying to convey a controversial message without sounding offensive can be a fine line. Someone mentioned Don Thomas earlier. To me, his writing walks that line better than most anyone else's. He has a knack for telling a hunting story in such a way as to include a message that's neither in the reader's face nor overtly judgmental. I wish more people with strong opinions and typewriters would follow his example. One can make a point without turning it into a spear.

[Scott Teaschner]

I just read the article myself and I have a few words to say. I am finding I am reading more crap in these magazines than I can remember. This guy is a follower all he does is quote people he knows or reads about. I have a strong sense of who I am and I admire many people. But I chose my own path and make my own choices. If he does not like food plots then he should never hunt Illinois or Iowa because it is one giant food plot. He should never hunt a good funnel area for that would be to easy. What about hunting in remote areas where game sees very little human traffic is that like shooting a partridge?


 He talks about tuning arrows and woods tune different and nobody really knows how to do it. It just shows this mans ignorance and lack of self try. There is no difference in tuning except there are more variables in each shaft. If carbons are cheating in his book he not only wears blinders he is blindfolded. There are many people who need to shoot carbons or aluminum's. Especially someone new to trad who does not need a variable such as wood arrows.


 He talks about trail cams and how bad they are. They are a tool that people use who really enjoy wildlife. They do not mean instant success. You still have to put in the time you still have to deliver the arrow. People I know who use them probably have more dirt time than he will ever have.


According to him I think every one should go out cut down a tree. Then build there bow and arrows. Build your broad heads and string. Using no modern tools or materials. I do not know what he shoots for a bow but if it has any glass on it he is a hypocrite.


 His philosophy is a joke. He is narrow minded and it shows his lack of intelligence. I think he should hunt the heavily hunted public land for that is the only true ethical way. That way the animal truly knows what is going on and they will not be taken by surprise which would be so unethical.

 

This is the type of person who will do more harm than good for our sport. He is the type of person who will help stop hunting bears over bait or put an end to chasing bears,cats and coons with dogs. He can not see the big picture and he has this grandeur that he himself is Aldo Leopold! He needs to stop day dreaming and come to grips with reality.


 I love to hunt I use a recurve because I feel it is the best tool for me. I use what ever I feel fit. If I wanted a challenge I would shoot a compound! How is that for murdering partridge.


Scott Teaschner


 P.S. I am not a teacher so there may be some bad grammar.

[Orion]

It's unfortunate that these discussions usually turn into shouting matches and personal attacks.  The main idea in this article, and several that have come before, is that the hunter should give some thought to the technology/methods he/she chooses to use, because that technology/methods can change the nature of the hunt and the hunter. This piece might be more proscriptive than others, and one could argue unnecessarily so, but don't overlook the big picture.  It's just to suggest that one do a little self evaluation and analysis now and again to establish and develop one's own personal ethics.

Things have changed a lot since I began bow hunting some 50 years ago.  Back then, we didn't have tree stands, scent blocking clothing, ATVs, GPSs, trail cameras, instructional videos, or compound bows. Baiting/food plots were just about unheard of. The only camo available was WWII army surplus.

There's no doubt that these technologies have changed the way we hunt, tipping the scales in hunters' favor, as evidenced by the vastly higher success rate of today's hunters. Of course, that success rate is also influenced by the fact that there are more deer, more widely distributed in this country than there were 50 years ago.

Regardless, a little self-reflection and analysis about why we do what we do is a good thing. It's my hope that the article helps to stimulate that kind of self-awareness.

[Swamp Yankee]

Quite frankly, I don't see either aluminum or carbon arrows as offering any real significant advantage over wood within the bowhunting/roving world.  The arguement that they make bowhunting easier is a red herring to me.
HOWEVER, the arguement that carbon and aluminum are better because they don't kill trees sure got my attention!  It's sort of a "paper or plastic" arguement I guess, but wood (in general with some exceptions like old growth) is a renewable resource; where both carbon and aluminum arrows consume much more in the way of non-renewable energy (primarily oil based) to produce.  In my opionion at least, from an environmental standpoint, wood (from renewable or sustainable sources) is good; carbon and aluminum, less so.

[bohuntr]

I read the article and I definitely agree with Jason. I have nothing against examining the ethical implications of different methods of  bow hunting but I firmly believe that different individuals can have different perspectives without anybody necessarily being right or wrong. I respect and admire both Dick Robertson and Don Thomas but that does not mean I have to believe all the exact same things they do. Although I am sure that what we would disagree on would be minor compared to the many important things we would agree on. I have to say that as usual Jason brings a common sense, down to earth approach to the issue at hand. BTW I use carbon exclusively because the arrows fly great, penetrate well and don't break or bend nearly as often as other materials. I like the simplicty of shooting a stickbow without sights and do not have to knap my own flint heads and chew sinew to consider myself an ethical hunter. I admire those who do knap their own heads and build their own selfbows but I do not think anyone who does something less is any less of an ethical hunter.

[Turkeys Fear Me]

Originally posted by Jason R. Wesbrock:
 Someone mentioned Don Thomas earlier. To me, his writing walks that line better than most anyone else's. He has a knack for telling a hunting story in such a way as to include a message that's neither in the reader's face nor overtly judgmental.

I would agree...when he sticks to the stories.  When he saddles up on the high horse, that "line" gets left on his backtrail.

[RLA]

Well said Swamp Yankee,

[Sant-Ravenhill]

I think all of us should occasionally examine what we do and how we do it. That includes bowhunting. Ethics and standards are rare in todays world.  

My wife teaches high school. She can count on two hands the kids that she knows will tell the truth and won't cheat in school.

Which is why I constantly see four-wheelers in wilderness areas here in Montana where they are explicitly banned.

If an article makes somebody think a little bit about ethics, more power to the author. Even if they completely disagree. The world is way too full of Washington politicians as it is.

[Roadkill]

I know a gal who became a guy.  I told the person "I am straight, but broad". Meaning it is not my thing, but if it does not affect or effect me, go on for it.  Well said Jason and Ryan. Thanks

[ChuckC]

The story being discussed is neither nit picky, bad, or good.  It just is.  It is a reflection of what the author thinks, and feels, and believes.  Those sorts of stories are typically written to tell the world what they think, and. .  hopefully. . to hoodwink you into actually opening your mind. . assessing yourself and what you believe.  

Let me tell you. .  thinking about what we do, and why we do it, or why we feel the way we do is something we all need to do more often.  Very often we will find out there is no basis at all for what we do.  It is what we did, or family did, or locals have done for years,  but never really thinking why.  

I can immediately come up with some examples that have nothing to do with hunting or trad, but everything to do with getting along with other peoples.

This story we are getting a bit hot about may be a good example that fits our trad past time.  

Change is not necessary.  Heck, thinking isn't mandatory either, but it would sure open some eyes, and thinking is actualy healthy. .  I think.  We don't have to all wear the same colors, or shoot the same bows or arrows.

BTW. . I am gonna stand up for the TB magazine crew. .  all of them, and especially Dr. Thomas.  It is their magazine.  They get to say what they want.  You can buy it or not.  I happen to love reading it, and, agreeing or disagreeing, I read it all, cover to cover. Then I wait for the next one.  

I happen to think extremely highly of Don's writing and read all I can of it.  I don't agree with all of it.  Don't have to.  That isn't one of the rules.

ChuckC

[Flingblade]

I agree with Chuck.  I haven't read this article yet as I buy TBM on the newstand but Don Thomas is a skilled writer and one of my favorites.  All this thinking and re-thinking what I am shooting and why makes my head hurt.  I drank two beers tonight and shot three (carbon) arrows.  One at thirty eight yards, one at twenty yards and one at 18 yards.  All dead on!  Why did I shoot carbon?  Don't know.  Why did I drink cheap beer?  Don't know.  But it is fun and I ain't apologizin' for that!

[Dale Sharp]

Orion & ChuckC,
Good thoughts.

[jsweka]

I have to admit, I liked the article.

I find myself agreeing with Kirby Kohler,Don Thomas,David Petersen, and Dick Robertson more than dis agreeing.

I use wood arrows, don't own a trail cam, and prefer a one piece bow over any sort of ILF bow (those things are just plain ugly to me).

I guess I'm an elitist at heart.  But that's the way I want to do it.  You do it your way.