Trail Cameras....ethical or not?

[Roger Norris]

I'm not sure. I try and do things "non-high tech", but I have often thought those trail cam pics I see are pretty neat...almost a hobby unto itself. So after thinking about it for a few years (seriously) i bought one Friday. I put it in the backyard, and got 41 pictures of racoons raiding my birdfeeder. Cool. Then I set it out in my "near home" hunting spot, this morning had a pic of a very large 8 point, and a couple does. Fun to look at. Being as they were cruising this runway at midnight, and I knew big bucks were around, 'm not sure how it helps me kill him, so I don't realy see it as an ethical dilema.

As an aside, my favorite trail cam pics are ones guys post up of odd stuff, like a bobcat where you don't expect one...

So what are your thoughts? Are these cheating?

My opinion right now is for me, no they aren't, but if a guy did all his scouting with them....well, maybe there is a line.....

[doeslayer]

is fiberglass cheating, how about fast flight strings. i veiw cameras as another tool that can be used if wanted. everything we use is cosidered an improvement of years pass. i use them more for pictures of critters more than scouting.

[wingnut]

I have one set up 10 yds from my front door with a feeder.  Last year we got pics of 12 different bucks including a couple of really big ones.  We look forward to getting the card and veiwing it everyday.

Oh also we don't hunt on our property.

I don't use cameras or feeders when I hunt.  Not an ethical question just a choice on my part.

Mike

[JimB]

"neat...almost a hobby unto itself"

That's a great point Roger.And that's exactly how I look at them.I have to use my sign reading ability to get the camera within 15 ft of the animal I want to photograph and I know what times animals travel most so from a hunting stand point they don't do much.I do enjoy getting pictures of bobcats,lions,wolves and anything else that doesn't happen by everyday.In the area I travel I get a lot of pictures all throughout the daylight hours so times wouldn't help much from a hunting aspect.

I have learned a lot from them though,about animal behavior.I once got a picture of a big boar black bear in a canyon and 2 1/2 hours later in another canyon 3 miles away with several ridges inbetween.I have a picture of an old sow black bear associating with her 6 1/2 year old daughter.I also know that the old girl lost two cubs one year,as she had new babies two years in a row.I have pictures of a mountain lion heading up a trail in the direction some whitetails went a few hours before and a coyote heading up a trail 50 minutes after a wolf did.All neat stuff.

In order to get the pictures,you have to figure out the animals travel pattern to begin with.If you can do that,you can hang a stand and the camera can't tell you anything about wind direction or any of the other important aspects of that.You will still have to be a hunter.

[Coonbait]

I love looking at all the great pictures posted on the trail camera thread and often wonder what happens to all those huge bucks that I see on those pictures people post. I like the hero pictures to, but I usually don't see the same quality of animals taken! I don't understand the ethical reason not to use game cameras in our scouting of deer on the properties that we hunt. I like to see what's wondering the places that I regularly hunt. Doesn't mean that they are tied to those locations. Yeck like I said at the beginning those bucks seldom are seen during daylight hunting hours. But it does help me stay on stand longer HOPING that they might show up!
Glenn

[straitera]

Neighbor across the hgwy had one to give me. Didn't want it. Like the pix but too much extra for me. Feel comfortable in your own shoes you're good to go. To each his own.

[Steve H.]

It all depends what you do with the things.  I use them on black bear baits to make sure I'm not just feeding brown bears--that is almost always the case where I live and I want to avoid confrontations with them.

[Mudd]

I've never owned one but not because of any ethical issues.

If someone were to give one to me I'd put it up somewhere just for the fun of seeing what's out there when I'm not.

I don't see anything wrong with that.

The biggest advantage for me would be the boost to my motivation in getting out there and/or hanging with it just another hr or so longer with anticipation.

My 2 cents worth.

If you got'em, use'em !!!

God bless,Mudd

[Pat B.]

Roger, I'm going hunting regardless of what the cameras tell me. So the pictures didn't influence me much. I enjoy being outdoors. I may not sit in the best spot on any given day but so what ??

I bought 4 of them 2 years ago, played with them for a couple of months and gave them all to a friend.. Again, I'm going hunting, period. And I only have one piece of ground I can hunt; hey, I'm blessed I have that !  

So, the cameras didn't mean much to me. Fun to play with but that's about it..

[Looper]

So how could someone use one unethically? They're just taking pictures. They aren't attractants.

I use one occasionally, but it basically confirms what I already know.

[Shawn Leonard]

I have a problem with them when guys use them to the point of them becoming their main scouting tool. They put out 15-20 on a property and than pin point a big bucks location at a certain time than go hang a stand and kill the buck. To me that is kind of cheating, ethical is not the questions, guys decide that for themselves. I have a couple out, but just to see what is on the property I hunt, not to pin point a very close time they are in an area and try to kill them. I want to make it clear I have no problem with guys that do this, it is just not for me. I beleive it may become an issue of fair chase eventually. Is that fair to an animal? I have thought about using one of the new Ozone machines, the science is sound and they can work when used properly, but again I am worried that may not be fair to the animals we hunt. I am using one to de-scent my clothes as I type this, am I cheating? Maybe, but what about the sprays and scents and camo. It is a fine line and as long as it or anything eles is legal, who am I to judge?? Shawn

[Shawn Leonard]

Just to answer the question above, we cannot judge what is ethical for everyone, but if someone sets out 20-25 on a 100 acre property and checks them with their cell phone and computer without going in the woods and pretty much uses them to pinpoint a bucks movements, not a question of ethics per se' but is it really fair to that animal? Shawn

[adkmountainken]

wow i am auctually with Shawn on this one! ido not like it when hunters use them to pin point the time a buck is crusing through that particular aera, that is just something that should be done with leg work and woodsmanship! i think MANY people rely on technology WAY to much. i do not have any trail camers right now but i have used them in the past just becouse i love the pictures and as Roger said it is a hobby in its self!

[Gil Verwey]

I feel they are ethical and can get you pretty fired up when you see what kind of deer are around, that you never knew existed. You will also be amazed at how much antler they grow from year to year. You may start passing up younger bucks to let them mature, even if you are in a heavily hunted area like I am. You also start to learn a lot more about buck habits.

Having said that I stopped using them. After watching these bucks year round, I actually started to get attached to the deer and root for them to make it through the season. I prefer hunting when I don't know what is actually there making the rubs and scrapes. I won't even hunt my own farm any more because I like seeing these deer. I must be getting old.

These bucks pictures were taken on my farm. The farm is across the street from a large gun club and state WMA that gets a lot of hunting pressure. The WMA is stocked with pheasants and gets a lot bird hunters. During shotgun season   gun clubs do large deer drives. One club that drives the WMA has drives with 200 standers and drivers. These bucks live 99% of their life on that WMA. You wouldn't think that with all the deer drives the gun clubs put on and small bucks that get taken every year there would be bucks of this size and age bracket. The deer in the front right of the picture is a nice 11 pointer that was a spindly little 4 point the year before. After watching these deer all year I didn't even hunt my own farm. This type of hunting isn't for me any more. There is nothing wrong with it and it is a great tool if you are trophy hunter. I just prefer not knowing. I let my son and his friend bow hunt my stand the year I took these pictures and his friend took the 11 pointer opening day of that season.  
 

Here is the 11 pointer on opening day.

 

If you like it and think it is ethical for you, it is, as long as it is leagal.

Good luck and have fun taking the pictures, you will be surprised what you see.

Gil

[Acuna]

I think they are a lot of fun and I enjoy seeing the pictures and videos they take.  I have more hogs than deer on my place and I have learned a lot about hog behavior from them.

I personally can't imagine owning 20-25 of them, not to mention WITH cell phone capabilities... and using them in the way Shawn describes is pure craziness to me, but I don't doubt that someone is doing it somewhere.

[Steel]

I have ran trail cameras for over ten years now I use to build my own back before digital cams were out and there was only one or two 35mm models on the market.I can tell you all the do is tell you what was in that spot they do not tell you the buck/deer/animal will ever be back again.They are nice and like stated a fun hobby I enjoy running cameras and checking them almost as much as hunting itself. I find it something I can do year around, everyone at home/work love to see the pictures and it does allow you to  see animals you may never see with your own eyes.

[Shawn Leonard]

That is my point, there are hunt clubs and groups of guys doing it all over. It is not just a few, watch Mid-West whitetails and shows like that. They watch buck grow from 1.5 to a minimum of 4.5 than go out and kill them!! It is happening a lot more than people think. Ethical as I said that is for the indivdual to decide, fair to the animal, I myself don't think so, put some of these so called great hunters in my area without their trailcams and all their other techie stuff and I bet 75% would have trouble killing a 2.5 year old. Shawn

[Eric Krewson]

I don't use them and prefer to do all of the leg work myself. I guess I am my own game camera. Hunting is all about actual feet on the ground hunting for me, not taking short cuts.

I have 4 acres of woods I don't hunt and will probably get a game camera to see what is walking the trails and visiting the salt lick. If I ever decide to hunt the place( unlikely) the game camera will come down.

Just my way of doing things.

[xtrema312]

They are great fun.  I got three last year in the summer.  It is amazing how many different animals of all kinds will cross a major scrape.  There is nothing unethical about them regardless of how many you have and how you use them as long as there are no laws being broken.  Use them if you like and don’t if you don’t like them.  Leave others to do their own thing.

I hunt three properties.  On about 70 acres, one abut 10 and one 100.  That is a lot of ground to cover seeing only about 200 sq. ft. at a time.  The deer change movement patterns with time of year, hunting pressure, food source changes.  It would be impossible to nail down all the options and know where and when a particular deer will be there unless you know you are on a core area or great funnel spot.  But then if you know that you don’t need the camera to tell you that.

I sometimes set them right where I hunt just to see what is going on when I can’t be there.  Why do I do this?  Because I have scouted it and know it is a good spot to hunt already.  If the wind is right and that locations works for my schedule to be there, I will hunt that spot.  I also put them in spots I can’t hunt due to the wind, terrain and lack of a good spot to set-up.  I do this just to see the deer.  

This year we did some logging and a major corner of our woods was changed.  The deer used to take three different ways to come into the area.  Now tree tops reach from in a pond all the way up and over a little hill.  The deer are force to move around it.  I almost cleared the tops in a couple areas to make paths, but then though better of that idea. So I sat a stand where I knew the deer would go to get around the barricade of tree tops.  Then I set a camera.  With a three shot burs and short delay I got 535 pic’s in 20 days.  Many of the same deer or missed shots, but 300 good ones of a lot of different deer and about eight different bucks.  90% outside of shooting hours. I had deer 15 yd. from my stand four days in a row in shooting light right up to opening day.  The only wind that will work for this spot is a northerly wind due to the bowl type area it is between higher ground east and west, which causes wind swirls in the area.  We got north wind opening day.  No other stand on that site is well suited for northerly wind because most are set up for westerly winds and the lay of the land tends to move deer north and south from food to bed.  I sat the stand morning and evening.  I saw no deer! Guess they don’t like to go through there with a north wind.
 
I have yet to determine when and where to hunt based on the camera only.  It rarely is more than a minor consideration in when and where I hunt. It is a lot of fun to see stuff on the camera including people who don’t know it is there. You also learn real fast that there is often very little in pattern for most deer.  They come and go all different times and days.  Often only coming through an area once a week, or only once every three days and different times going different directions.  What I mostly learn is that I need to be in a good spot with the right wind and stay still and quiet because you never know when something could show up.

[BowHunterGA]

First year I have tried cameras and honestly I have had more success capturing squirrels, racoons, possums and TRESPASSERS!

I am actually looking forward to working them more after the season as I think it will be a solid means of extending my hunting season and providng an excuse to stay in the woods more during the off season.

Regarding the ethics. Personally I don't see the arguements against them. If trying to use them as your sole scouting source then you might get lucky, then again there are a LOT of lucky hunters out there, that doesn't make them unethical, perhaps lazy but not unethical.


In the past I have used various methods that do practically the same thing as cameras do.

I have used thread across well used trails, when placed carefully you can verify the trails are being used and alot of times you can identify the direction the animal was traveling. I have even used cheap LCD clocks (like the kind with magnets that go on your refrigerator and such) along with thread or fishing line for figuring out when animals walked a particular trail.

Clearing leaves, depositing fresh dirt or saturating a spot on a trail with water can also reveal clues about the animals. I have also spent hours in a stand far away from trails to monitor activity before archery season opens. I would not consider these activities unethical. But I do like to maximize my chance for success with the limited time I have available to be in the woods during season.

Cameras are just a tool. Like any tool they could be used in an unethical manner.