Carbon in bow limbs worth it?

[Mic W]

I know that in fishing rods carbon is more sensitive, but heaver rods are made from fiberglass for strength.

Arrows, from what I understand are made from carbon because it maintains straightness better.

So what is the benefit of carbon in bow limbs?

Is it truly worth the extra cost or just a marketing scheme.

[FerretWYO]

This will be interesting.

I know that if I had it to do over I would not choose carbon again in a palmer that was a long time ago though.

[Gen273]

I have a Zipper SXT with foam and carbon in the limbs. I love it, it is the smoothest limb I have ever shot. It is also dead in my hand and fast to boot. I hope this helps a little.

[jsweka]

Here's some of what Jack Harrison says in his book "Traditional Bowyer, More Unnecessary Fun":

"Fiberglass is almost as strong in compression as it is in tension.  On the otherhand, carbon is not as strong as fiberglass is in compression.  In fact, carbon has so little compression strength, I avoid using it by itself in any bow limb on the belly side."

"I combined bamboo in the core with carbon on the back, an a blend of carbon and fiberglass on the belly.  This combination seemed to give me the best results compared to everything else."

"I know the "laminators" put carbon in all sorts of locations in the core of bow limbs, but in my opinion, this is a waste of material.  Carbon in the center of a bow limb is nothing but a spacer.  It does nothing to contribute to the elasticity or cast of my bow limbs, so I suspect the same applies to any other bow."

Jack has done more scientific bow testing than probably anybody out there making bows, and his bows fetch top dollar (even used ones if you can find one).  So to summarize Jack's findings, carbon on the back and combined with fiberglass on the belly is best, while carbon in the core of the limb is useless.

[non-typical]

I've had a couple of high end carbon bows and didn't care for either of them...too stiff to suit my taste. However...foam on the other hand...if it's available I will have it on every bow I buy from now on. Best thing since homemade maple syrup..shoots sweet.

[Bjorn]

It depends somewhat on the individual; if you are young and strong and can endlessly pull back powerful limbs maybe not. On the other hand if you are an old fart like me who had to drop down 10# then absolutely yes.  I would not buy limbs today if they were not carbon back and belly.

[Over&Under]

My experience has been that foam seems to have more benefits than carbon....but you can't go wrong with either one.  To answer your question, I would say yes it is worth it.

[7 Lakes]

A .020 carbon lamination will add almost 15 pounds to my R/D bow.  .015 wood only adds 5 pounds. This eliminates a lot of limb weight to achieve the same results.  This can only be a good thing.

[Bob Morrison]

I love carbon and foam in anything I shoot. Foam is a no brainer for any draw length, Smooth quiet about 3 fps in our limbs, no humidity problem. Carbon again gain about 4 fps in our limbs. With my short draw(26") I'll take all them help I can get. Long draws I would not pay the difference for carbon.

[FerretWYO]

Originally posted by Bowbldr:
I love carbon and foam in anything I shoot. Foam is a no brainer for any draw length, Smooth quiet about 3 fps in our limbs, no humidity problem. Carbon again gain about 4 fps in our limbs. With my short draw(26") I'll take all them help I can get. Long draws I would not pay the difference for carbon.

If that is not convincing I dont know what could be more so.

[GANDGOLF]

Not trying to start any Problems.. Question is : With the Chinese , N. koreans ,S.koreans , trying to BEAT each others BRAINS out.. In the sport of archery .. Can we not believe ; They have done their due digilence on the fastest limbs??  

[KentuckyTJ]

Originally posted by Over&Under:
My experience has been that foam seems to have more benefits than carbon....but you can't go wrong with either one.  To answer your question, I would say yes it is worth it.

I agree with Jake. If a bowyer offers foam cores I would never order wood cores over foam. The benefits are night and day. If I had to choose foam or carbon I would no doubt go with the foam cores first. Carbon makes the limb lighter and thus a tad bit faster with less recoil as well. If you can afford it I would add the option. If not I wouldn't sell a kidney to get it.

[BMG]

imho, its overrated.  Had a few longbows with carbon in the limbs and felt no advantage over glass.  Actually I much prefer how the glass bows shot & handled over the carbon ones.

[ksbowman]

I'm with you Ferret. I have Palmers with carbon and some without. I have an old classic that has glass in the limbs and it is the same weight as the carbon and I swear it is faster and more stable than the carbon limbs.

[Steelhead]

I have had quite a few bows with foam/carbon and some with just foam and glass and some with bamboo or wood cores and carbon backed with glass bellies.

Most of them were excellant for me.Excellant speed and low handshock.Some have a higher pitched sound when shot.

I have had a few of these same bows in all glass versions that I actually preferred over the carbon or carbon/foam versions.Some not though.

It may depend on the bow and design of the bow as to which limb materials are gonna work the best and some things are subjective as to what individuals may like or not like in how a bow draws,feels,sounds and shoots overall.

I recently bought a recurve with a carbon back and later bought the same bow in all glass.Same length bow.I like the all glass bow in that model and so does the bowyer.He says the all glass bow is actually faster in his design.He does have a shooting machine and quality chronograph and is  precise  at measuring such things as bow performance.

The same bowyers longbow I prefer with the carbon back over the glass back and belly one.Its faster and shoots really crisp and feels great.Its not noisy or high pitched either and is stable.

[Raminshooter]

That is interesting feedback on your Palmers ksbowman.  I had read something a while back in Traditional Bowhunter by Mike where he says that high speed film showed him that a recurve limb with double carbon would resist the twist motion caused by the "S" curve the string travels in when you shoot fingers.  Because of that he thought that the more stable limb would yield more accuracy.  Never shot so don't know myself.

[MarkE2006]

Depends on the design of the bow and limbs.  JJ at Bob Lee bows has it in the limbs on his personal bow, and according to him from his testing, the carbon in the limbs did not lend itself to any improvement in the bow.  My personal experience has shown it to make the bow appreciably lighter and faster according to the two very similiar longbows that I own.

[Sixby]

Glass is not even close to being as strong as carbon is in compression. Its exactly the opposite. Carbon barely compresses if it compresses at all. It is so strong it delaminates the core next to it by overpowering the core. The core is bending and the carbon is not compressing.
 
Carbon has to be used correctly. the belly carbon has to be lighter than the back carbon. It also helps to add a strip of carbon or glass in the center of the core to establish the neutral zone ./ This helps eliminate stresses that are generated by carbon on the back and belly.

I read Jack's book and found it extremely knowledgable , but I have come to some conclusions by my own usage of carbon that are slightly different.
I apologize that my way of saying this offended other Harrison fans of which I are one.

Another thing. There is no such thing as just carbon. There are dozens of grades, layups, ect. It takes time to learn what to use and where and what the results are when you use certain types compared to others.

You can use uni carbon for gains in speed, 45 degree and 90 degree for added stability,. or you can very successfully use a combination of both laid up together or in different placements in the limb to gain certain things.

I am using a layup at this time that makes a limb like a crowbar torsionally but also has layers of unicarbon for speed. This has a 45 degree layer on the top layer for added torsion stability. That goes directly on the back. Next to the belly glass and veneer is a thin layer of carbon that is 90 degree unicarbon 90 degree. This layer adds so much stability to the limb that it is unbelieveable. These layers of carbon take the place of over twice as much glass. Add yew or foam core lams and you end up with a limb that is as light as a feather. Super smooth to pull, extremely fast if not only because of the light weight at same poundage and so dead in the hand at the shot it is unbelieveable until you shoot one.

Carbon and foam are worth it , or carbon and yew or other light smooth cores. but only if used knowledgeably. There is way more to the benefits than just speed alone.

God bless you all, Steve
I have had good successs with double carbon especially in longbows. I am presently experimenting with it in recurves and have not completely formulated my stack layup in a curve yet.

[legends1]

I agree with most of the things said on this subjest for the positive points on carbon.I do want to add though that bow limb design plays a large roll in the overall ballance of the use of carbon.The feel and performance of a limb has many factors.Limb length,wedge length overall bow lenght.I use .020 carbon in "my limb design" after alot of personal research. Smooth, hand shock free,(in a recurve)and ads 6-8 fps in my limbs.All the reason i need.I think my customers will agree.  

[Gator1]

Interesting topic, and good to see some feedback from outstanding bowyers.

The one thing I have noticed, is ask your bowyer these guys have all the tools knowledge and know what is a good set up for your requirements.

Obviously the bowyer sponsors on this site are top shelf....