Not EVERYBODY on here has trad values

[Turkeys Fear Me]

In my opinion, the "traditional archery community" is a microcosm of society.  To assume otherwise is not only naive, but foolish.

[Kevin Dill]

I have faith in everybody I deal with.

I don't trust any of them to be perfect.

I've never been burned on TradGang.

[Eric Krewson]

The guy who stiffed me had 6 months to tell me he changed his mind, had he done so before I finished his bow I would have been no hard feelings about the deal whatsoever.

The fact that he was such an irresponsible, thoughtless jerk is what ticked me off.

I don't know if other bow makers have done it but I have sized up potential customers in person, face to face, nice guys, humble and sincere people and tactfully talked them out of buying one of my bows. I could tell that the money they wanted to spend on one of my bows would be better utilized for family expenses.

I also run into guys who have little or no traditional experience who want one of my bows really badly once they see one. Again, I tactfully steer them to another choice, a good used or vintage recurve most of the time.

This type of dealing is what typifies "traditional values" to me.

[Bud B.]

Originally posted by Cyclic-Rivers:
 

Originally posted by Bud B.:
Depends on the size of the emergency.

You are right, I had a clause in the there that had me off the hook, but must have edited out.

It does depend on the emergency.  Things come up, and always will. I think everyone will understand true emergencies.  

Some people seem to come up with emergencies often.       :rolleyes:    I am referring to someone who backed out of a sale 2 times and strung me out over the course of 4 months.    :mad:      

Now that I have worked through my bad day a little, I will will reiterate I have had much, much more positive experiences, than poor. That is a true testament to the people I share a cyber campfire.

       [/b]

When I read your post the first thing I thought of was Joplin. And by emergencies I mean emergencies.

Hugs to you CR.  

[Shifting Shadow]

Even in church groups there are some dishonorable people.

Regarding one point of the discussion: it's OK not to ship before the money comes, even if it is someone you trust. Stuff happens. It is not insulting. Some failed transactions can be prevented by common sense.

"Trust in God but tie your camel."

On a lighter note. This site Rocks!

[Steve B.]

I still agree with Cyclic's first post.

[Bob Palmer]

Luckily, I haven't been burned on any of my many dealings on TG. BUT, I do go through some "back ground" checking efforts before I agree to deal. I always look at the buyers/sellers recent posts just to see who they are. I may lose some deals if it's not obvious they are good folks but that's OK.

Also, and think we all should more, call out not only the bad actors (e.g. hall of shame) but the GOOD ones as well. Rather than a simple TTT in the classifieds, I'll help out someone I have had positive dealings with and give them a "Good guy/gal to deal with here". A little positive reinforcement could go a long way    

Sorry Biggie had to go through some bad dealings but I think this may end up helping us all!!!!

[chopx2]

I recently sold a bow to a guy on here with 0 posts and a memebr for 8 years. It didn't compute so i asked him a bunch of questions in the end he called me and I got a good vibe. Would up send him the bow and a few shafts since he was returning to trad to try and still haven't cashed his MO because I want to make sure he is satisfied with the bow.

When I give a buddy as TTT on a post for a bow I will comment on my positive experience if we did business before so any potential buyer can have more piece of mind. I think that is a good way we can help each other out.

It is scary to even give stuff away. There are always newcomers and those that don't know what they are doing that can bash a perfectly fine product and the real problem was that they did not now what they were doing or talking about.  The education that one can get from other Trad Gang members is going a long way to educate newcomers, but I still run into those that claim they have longer draws than they really do and then blame everything on the equipment when things don't go like they expect.
I was going to thin the herd by giving some of my bows away to those in need, but I have even had one of local  boys try to take advantage of that. The fellow really 'needed' a bow and some arrows, he had a new baby on the way, no job, and a spanking brand new Harley he just bought in his garage. He could not understand why I turned him down and now I'm the biggest A-hole around. I did find homes for the bows with arrows and I have made certain that the set-ups will work for those that are getting them.  The last of the group a 52# 52" Pearson and arrows is boxed up and ready for delivery.

[Mike Mecredy]

OH, I usually just roll with it when that happens, but I see your point and I'm glad you spoke up.  Sometimes it's the best thing to do.  

-Mike

[Jack Whitmire Jr]

Have sold ,bought and gave a away a few things on TG . Have NEVER had a bad transaction . BUT it can and does happen unfortunately .

COMMUNICATION is the key to any honest transaction .

Thanks to tradgang for all the friends I have made on here  

Jack

[COLongbow]

Turkeys fear me,
The traditional archery community is NOT a microcosm of society. Far from it. In my experience they are the cream of the crop, as in the best rises to the top.

The social median is way below the character of folks that I've gotten to know on this site!

[GreyGoose]

Bud's comment about some people having a lot of emergencies reminds me of my old teaching days - I never got too bent out of shape until the third grandmother up and died on a scheduled test day!

[Turkeys Fear Me]

Originally posted by COLongbow:
Turkeys fear me,
The traditional archery community is NOT a microcosm of society. Far from it. In my experience they are the cream of the crop, as in the best rises to the top.

The social median is way below the character of folks that I've gotten to know on this site!

Yes, there are a lot of good people here, but not all.  If they were all good, there would be no "Hall of Shame."

People are people.

[COLongbow]

TFM,
Yea you're right, people are people, but my point in my rebuttal of your premise was that the character of the folks on this site do not represent a cross section of society.

All you gotta do is lurk around the other sites to know what's up. Pretty objective evidence.

I'm just glad they allow me on here.

[kennym]

I've sold a ton of bowmaking supplies on TradGang.

I've been burned a couple times, but you play the odds every day in some way.

This is a great site and trad guys are THE best folks to deal with day in and day out.  

[kennym]

EDIT:

 Trad gals too!

[Hit-or-Miss]

I have bought, sold and traded a bunch of bows on here, aside from 1 delay, an honest mistake that was above board (and the guy threw in a Helle knife to make up for the delay), I have had NO issues on here. I don't ship a bow until I get a PMO, and I don't expect anyone to ship a bow to me until they get my PMO. Fair is fair. The only issues I ever have, is when I try to sell the bows for a fair price, what I paid for them, or often less, I get quite a few low ball offers. Some are tire kickers, looking for better photos or a lower price. Perhaps they are interested but can't afford it. That I understand, although if I didn't have the cash, I would bother asking to begin with. And a few, not many, are looking to buy low and resell at a substantial profit. They don't care about hunting, shooting or collecting old bows, respecting others, or Traditional values, ONLY making a quick buck. Once, I had an "occassional" member here, full time on the "other" site, try to low ball me and tell me both my bows were over priced, flawed, etc. He went on and on, essentialy trying to get a free bow via a trade. He only wanted it to resell elswhere and turn a profit. Reputations spread quick, even between sites, and I later learned I was not alone.    I felt like I was getting e-mails from a used car salesmen, hungry, hard up and on the draw. It was insulting to say the least, and very un-traditional IMHO. But the other 99.9% of the guys I have dealt with on Trad-Gang are Solid Men, Men of character, Men of honor.

[xtrema312]

Originally posted by Mudd:
A man's word is paramount in my book.

But I think each person deserves grace.

I try to give each one some as I have been the recipient of it unconditionally.

I am proud of how this thread has worked out.

You folks are just the best of the best.

God bless,Mudd

 

I have never gotten ripped off.  The vast majority of the time I have had great dealing on this site, but it has not been perfect.  

I had a broadhead deal drag out for while and got my money back this fall.  Heads were lost in the mail and guy was off hunting a lot I was told.  Could well be the case.  I have no reason not to believe it.

I had a bow trade not work out well.  I got one with undisclosed limb finish issues in trade for a brand new bow.  When I complained, I was told there was something wrong with my bow but he would work with it if I did. I just moved on.  I am not done buying and selling bows, but I don’t plan to do any more sight unseen trades unless it is someone I really trust a lot.  

I have had more than a few back outs including a couple from very well know bow traders on this site including one that never did return a PM  or e-mail.  

I am not perfect.  I know I backed out on a purchase because I goofed up on the bow model or weight.  Can’t recall now what it was for sure, but I made a mistake and got back to the seller as soon as I realized I messed up.  I don’t believe we even finalized payment method.  I know I have had a change of heart a couple times, but ended up just buying it because I said I would.

The big thing for me is that someone communicates.  If I don’t get a steady stream of communication, I figure the deal is not done and move on.  

Things do happen particularly in this economy.  There are little emergencies like car problems and then there is the big stuff like medical issues, and loss of a job.  You shouldn’t be wheeling and dealing bows if you can’t handle a few unexpected bills.  However, you can have plenty of money for a bow, but lose your job and you better be putting that bow money in the take care of the family fund even if you have the spare cash over the short term.

[MTArrowLauncher]

I just wanted to update the situation. My buddy who was to facilitate the buying for me so my wife to not find out, called me today and said that the items showed up today, and he did infact buy them. Just as the deal was set up.

So, just to clear my name, I did not back out of a deal, and I am not devoid of Trad Values. Although between my friends busy work schedule and trying to figure his paypal account out, it did take longer than necessary, and for that i am still sorry for and still appologize.

I just did not want to be forever wrongfully labeled as untrustworthy, or that i back out of deals. I was trying to do something nice for my wife and it blew up in my face, and caused Mr. Hoffman some trouble and i feel bad about that.

This is in no way in spite of Mr. Hoffman, or intended to be snotty, I just wanted to be honest about how it ended up just as i was honest in taking responsibility in Mr. Hoffmans post and appologized.

So to Mr. Hoffman, I am sorry it was drawn out and took longer than necessary, but I am glad it worked out in the end. I hope there is not long lasting hard feelings with you or with anyone else who saw the original post. I truely cherish this site for the info, the camaraderie, and the great people.

thanks for listening,
Fin