Trad Gang is not Popular Mechanics - UPDATE page 30

[BTW]

Great thread Terry!  I love my Dad, but I've lost track of how many times I've told him to stop worrying about the technical side of our sport and focus on hunting. I don't care how fast, quiet, pretty, etc. your bow is. How sharp your broadheads are, etc.; If you can't find or get close to the critters, none of that matters. He'll say, "I swear my bow is making more noise today!", I'll say,"you're nuts, just hunt for once." LOL
I've gotten a kick outta the "skinny string" threads lately. 5fps there, 10fps here, high frequency, low frequency, chronographs, noise meters, etc. Wow, it's funny.  
But, to each his own. It's all good. Let's just have fun and tinker n hunt! We're a good crowd to be a part of.

I love traditional archery because of it's simplicity. For hunting. But the tinkering side is fun too...to an extent.

[Pat B]

Thanks Terry for keeping TradGang as it was originally intended.

[eddings220]

Hey Terry, you make some really good points and observations.  The one word that really jumps out at me is "woodmanship".  Growing up here in western Ky., it is a word that I have heard all my life from my grandfather and my Dad. Reading sign and knowing various types of trees, snakes, tracks, etc. was something that seemed to be more important than the "high tech" aspect of equipment rather it be bows or guns. The main thing was could you hit what you are shooting at, cause that would bring home supper. I am in the process of trying to teach my 11 year old son "woodsmanship" and it has been somewhat difficult due to I think the fact that we are living in the age of technology. I find myself drawn to the stories on this site of those that make their own bows and knapp their own arrowheads, and then take a deer or other animal. Spot and stalk with a traditional bow takes woodsmanship and patience, no better or more exciting way to hunt.

[Jason Jelinek]

Terry,

You've got to be kidding me...

I like this site for things I can learn.  The stories and pictures are great but it's the stuff I learn (hunting techniques, equipment or shooting techinique) that keeps me coming back.

If you want to limit the content of this site go ahead...  I can wade through the content and pick out the diamonds, I guess not all can.  It sounds like many want just what they think should be here and nothing else.

Do what you must.

Jason

[NightHawk]

same reason I hate watching hunting shows!! They all say if you don't have this gadget or that whiz bang, your not going to be successful. Glad to see it being monitored here, I've tried to avoid those threads

[mountain trapper]

I'm happy as long as we stay away from compounds and crossbows.  If some one wants to hunt with them, fine, but they already have sites for that so why talk about it here?

[trashwood]

Well here is the good news.  it is not all that hard to figure out....least for me.  I post what I am doing or what I am interested in.  

I don't have a chip on my shoulder (well i really, a bone spur).  so if "they" don't like it they pull it.  OK by me......that was not what they are after    .  Maybe next post will fair better.  I have always let Terry and the Mods sweat the small stuff.....like posting rules.  My job is to follow my interest, have a good time,  try to be nice and apropriate to other posters.  

It is not hard for me to sort the the threads that insterest me.  There are some posters i always look for their wit and sense of humor.  some poster I look for because of their expertise and some I look for because they can actually write.

I can well say that the "A" poster don't get enough credit.  I can think of quite a few posts that took a lot of time to get good pics, write up a readable report, get the presentation ready, up load of the graphics and I enjoyed reading a lot.....well that is the only point I disagree with Terry on....yep it is his house and he gets to say......but to read the "A" posters is why I come back

rusty

[Mr.Vic]

 Thanks for letting me be a guest here on your site for the last few years, Terry. I too came here for the simplicity of Traditional Archery. And anymore in this world, i can agree with Biggie. Don't like the bed, check into somewhere else.

[artifaker1]

I got to say that I'm surprised by all the people who claim to be unhappy with the site. I was having a great time. But I only look at the threads that I find interesting. I can't imagine why all these people are looking at threads that they claim they don't like. It doesn't make sense.
I don't do this (archery/bowhunting) because it is easy, I do it because it is hard. And studying your gear is not necessarily a bad thing, some do seek to better themselves on a constant basis and it can be annoying to others I guess. The studying kind of people are the ones who brought us all this cool stuff and that is always going to be there.
But it has been getting a little weird too I guess. But what is going to be too techy?

[Vig]

Here's some irony: I'm sitting here staring at my 19" HD flatscreen computer reading about a rant on the internet by a bunch of "traditionalists" griping that the online "discussions" are getting too techie.  Sounds to me like we all need to get off the computer and shoot our bows some more.

Maybe then we'll see that another .05% FOC or that getting the exact 25 degree angle on my single-bevel edge doesn't make a hoot of difference if I can't get a buck to walk under my stand.

-Vig

[LC]

Well once again I'm confused. Sorry doesn't take much for me. Actually it's all making alot of sense or cents lately. I agree it's your yard and ball so we play by your rules or go home.  Problem is the rules keep changing. I can only imagine how tuff it is to keep a site like this working and seriously have got to commend you on doing it.

I've learned ALOT here through the years. Don't actually post much only when I have something to add. I've watched alot of threads go through that don't interest me in the slightest and just go on. I guess that simple process don't work for alot of folks here. I've never bought into alot of the tech things or the latest FAD bow, gadget etc.

I'm confused where you WILL DRAW THE LINE from now on? Right now theres a thread "2 thumbs up to Terry Green" thats 2 pages that has absolutely nothing to do with trad bowhunting but hasn't been pulled.Why?

I've sent alot of folks here to learn to spin a endless string on the how to forum but I honestly don't think it's listed there anymore, but Rob has a video on how to spin a Skinny string? Why?

Heck the knife forum use to be a bunch of ol bowhunters making knives from old circular saw blades and files but it's been taken over by sponsors and it you don't have $1500 belt sander and using "known" steel with specific quenchent for the steel don't bother posting cause your gona get a chewing. Why?

Ah heck I could go on but one last thing, you've got 13 pages averaging 15 posts per page praising or worshing you but you've got 18,000 out their going HUGH WTF?

I agree totally most beginners should work on the basics of form,stand placement,woodsmanship, reading sign, but I gotta be perfectly honest when I see a thread stating "OK heres a topo of my lease where should I put my stand or bait pile" I just sigh and go on.

So seriously where do you draw the line in? No more ILF or WARF threads,no more EFOC, no more skinny string threads, heck no more no new bow threads that boost how they are better than older bows.

It would get pretty dry here just rehashing the same ol same ol all the time in my opinion. After reading alot of the posts here I get the feeling alot of folks have came to trad bowhunting because it's simple.Grab a bow some arrows(don't have to be matched) have a ball and go sling some arrows. Thats all well and good till you go to a 3-d shoot and you see them same guys having a ball missing a deer target five times at 15 yards laughing it up and then talking about going hunting. Maybe they do need to learn how to get the most out of their bows and themselves. And those that punch the kill zone regularyly maybe they want to learn how to consistently get the most out of their equip and become a even better bowhunter. Just my opinon.

[SteveL]

I don't post much, but I sure as heck learn a ton, technical and otherwise, from all the archers who are gracious enough to respond to my and others questions.

I'm with Mr. Jelinek and LC on this one.

You are correct sir, this is your site. Do what you will.

[BowsnLabs]

Terry - I haven't read this whole thread but have to agree with your opening post.  As a long-time member, I've noticed the slow change over time as well.  This is still a great site with some of the best folks around, but Tradgang doesn't feel as "unique" as it used to compared to all those other sites.  It is easy to get drawn into the "latest and greatest" gadget-quest, but I've found that in the end this is just a distraction from the simplicity and tradition of what makes traditional bowhunting such a rewarding path to take.  Greg

[Steve Kendrot]

I don't think you can avoid this. Ther are so many choices one can make. Look how many bowyers, broadhead ans arrow manufacturers etc there are. Any time you have choices, people are going to have favorites and they will defend them. It seems like like it is really the behavior rather than the topic that is getting people riled. Making certain subjects taboo will only enflame and divide. I would suggest that enforcing the rules of civility would maintain the spirit of tradgang more than limiting the topic of discussion. I personally think the "who makes the best bow" threads are the most pointless and oft repeated threads. I just pass em by.   I think folks should be able to choose what to read and participate in but be held accountable when they break the rules of civility clearly stated on the forum.

[sagebrush]

"Thanks for letting me be a guest here on your site for the last few years, Terry. I too came here for the simplicity of Traditional Archery. And anymore in this world, i can agree with Biggie. Don't like the bed, check into somewhere else."
I agree with Mr. Vic. This is your site Terry. There are a lot of people here because of the way you run it. You can't please all the people all the time, but you do pretty good. Gary

[LoweBow]

Being somewhat new to the site I just kinda figured that's what it was all about.  Yeah I've been registered here for while, but I used to check in and then just kind of wandered away and did my own thing.  In the past few months i started revisiting the site again and must say have been very confused by what I thought the site was about.  I too figured it was mostly about tuning and performance.  I too like utilizing the search and newer threads to help me figure new arrow matches for new bows, but wondered why there was no real discussion about management, habitat, treestand setups, funnels, etc and that is a huge part of what I love.  
I love shooting trad archery, but I'm not a shooter..I'm a hunter 1st.  I'm all about the whole game of taking animals w/ trad archery equipment....how to get them in range, how to identify and/or create funnels, food sources....This IMO is what has been missing for me here and has caused me to search it out elsewhere...
Don't get me wrong..I love reading the successful hunt stories and seeing the pics, but there's not enough real discussion on what it takes to consistantly harvest game w/ your equipment.

[Ragnarok Forge]

Terry,

I have to both agree and disagree.  I agree that there has been a lot of what you have been mentioning going on.  I have to disagree that getting rid of all the tech stuff is a good idea.  Lots of folks enjoy it and learn from it.

What I have seen is that lots of guys who don't want to read or hear about the tech stuff constantly post their views against it on tech posts in a very repetitive manner.  While they are welcome to their opinions, I would bet they are the ones who also are feeling like things have changed.  Every time I hop on here I read some posts and avoid others.  Simple enough to self police.

I think that one possible solution would be to create a tech forum and let the folks who are interested in posting and reading up go there.  ya, I know easy form me to say, I don't have to do any of the work.  

I definately agree that we all need to remember that we like and shoot is personal and not for everyone.  We all need to make sure we don't have a chip on our shoulders.  Just because others like and support their ways and preferences does not mean they are knocking mine.

[tradtusker]

Come on Fellas
I Think alot of guys are missing Terry's Point, or miss interpreting what he typed.

take a positive and practical outlook and read it Carefully again... Twice    

[tradtusker]

Originally posted by Terry Green:
Not sure how we are going to handle it...but I'm chatting with some of the charter members about the site taking on more of a compound mentality, and I'm not going to let that go any farther.  I'm not knocking compounds or folks that hunt with compounds.  I wouldn't trad my compound years for nothing.....those years made me a better hunter when I gave up gun powder.  But I got into trad to push myself even further. For more personal satisfaction of what I did than what my equipment helped me do....or 'supposedly' helped me do. Instead of 'looking' for an edge, I started creating an edge.

It looks as though many folks are way more worried over the 'performance' of their equipment than the performance of their own self.  What once use to be more 'self improvement' questions as the norm here, now as of late, seem to be more 'equipment fix' discussions.  It really does sound like the 'must have/gotta have - make you a better hunter' battle cry of the equipment hype in other facets of hunting.

I see the same threads and same arguing over and over and over. Some even have a rabid agenda to cram it down folks throats, and even call others unethical if they don't 'do as I say'.  Even going as far as taking personal pot shots at those that 'don't abide by the new fangled fix'.  Most of the folks that argue over equipment don't even congratulate other's when they post a successful hunt.  They seems to be more worried over what broadhead someone use than the ten pointer they posted or HOW they succeeded on taking him....or his set up....or what clues tipped him off to his pattern.

Why is it that folks do not want to improve themselves instead of using a crutch that often is made of straw?

Nothing is going to get you closer to an animal but YOU.  Nothing is going help you draw the bow at the perfect time but YOU.  Nothing is going to make that arrow go into the vitals but YOU.

I just saw GMMATT's question...."Shooting with a pack on"?....I've seen this guy ask question after question....and all he seems to be worried about is his self improvement.  That's the way it use to be here.  Not to say there there shouldn't or wont be equipment discussions....but they have been running amok lately, and we are going to do something about it since its seems to be causing too much divisiveness.


When is the last time you've seen a guy put up a pic of his property and ask for stand location advice based on the terrain?  This use to be pretty normal along with many other scouting questions and tips threads.

I don't know if its just me this morning or what, maybe I shouldn't be posting this, but this is just not what I see, but many of the guys I hunt with and many that have been frequenting this site for years have been bothered by the direction lately.  Something to think about folks.  I am not trying to slam anyone, or single anyone out....just calling a spade a spade.  Maybe we should all take a minute to look in the mirror....me included!

Do we really want to rely more on our equipment than ourselves?  Do we really want some other gadget to dull our woodsman ship?  Do we really want to argue over a broadhead to the point that we don't work on our shooting skills?


Trad Gang started with a vision and it grew and grew and grew....and that vision is not going to fade or morph into something that wasn't intended. Not on my watch.

What say ye?

[Thumper Dunker]