?Best stat to compare bows PERFormance?

[duncan idaho]

How does the new static recurve design stack up with the ones tested? I know that Bigfoot, Eaglewing, Cari-Bow, and RER have bows either in developlment or on the market.

[overbo]

''Ease to shoot accruately w/''

Only stat that matters to me.

Speed,smoothness,quietness,ect,ect will always take a step behind accruacy.

If I have a bow I'm dead confident in,I could care a less what joe blows bow shoots thru a chrony.

[Bowwild]

Lots of sound reasoning in this thread.  I've only experimented with a couple dozen bows over the past 3.5 years. However, I started keeping a spreadsheet of my bows with FPS out of a Pro Chronograph divided by draw weight at my 26" draw very early on.

It is my only objective performance rating. I agree with Steve (Sixby) that so many other things are important besides this measure. I also agree, and have experienced this myself, that readings can be impacted by operator error.

If I had a random pile of bows in front of me most would never be tested. If I don't like the look or the feel, I don't care how it shoots.

Conversely, if the bow shoots very fast that won't make it a keeper for me if it is harsh to draw and shoot. I despise hand-shock and any bow that disrupts the mental and physical aspects of my shot is headed out the door.

The most surprising thing I've learned by doing all this is how little difference there is, at my draw length and the same draw weights shooting the same weight arrow in many top bows.

I have one bow that is 24 years old (1999). It has the highest performance rating (according to my protocols) than any bow I have owned. I have some very close runner-ups. Some of them are slightly smoother drawing so they get a bit of a nod over this older one.

That bow is the 1st LH Mamushi Chris Cox and Habu made (1-piece). I bought it here from the Classifieds. It is also the 2nd most inexpensive recurve I have owned. It is the only Mamushi I have ever seen pictured on Trad Gang.

[DaveT1963]

deleted my original response as it didn't follow thread topic.... sorry I didn't go back to first page.  

For me, I would want to see the stat comparing how bows shoot a heavy hunting arrow.  I don't care about IBO standards as I never hunt with an arrow that light.  Not every bow that performs "best" with light arrows does the same with heavy arrows.  I am not to concerned with how fast an arrow gets to its target, much more interested in what it does when it gets there.

[Nativestranger]

Easy to shoot and shoot where you look. Those are important qualites no doubt but a little subjective depending on the person. A more efficient bow will allow one to shoot the same as a heavier bow but at a lower draw weight. That often means better accuracy as you are in full control of the bow. That's what this thread is about: quantifiable and measurable differences in efficiency between bows.

[overbo]

Sorry delete post.

[Elk whisperer]

a bow that is dead in the hand

[Sixby]

Accepted and thanks Steve.

God bless you all, Steve

[DaveT1963]

Everything is subjective including performance!  Just because someone chronographs one bow it does not mean the next one built by the same bowyer will produce similar results.  Furthermore, you could shot a bow at 200fps hand it to the next guy who can only get 190fps.... same arrow, draw, etc.... there are too many factors (especially when adding in human differences in shooting mechanics)to compare a brand of bows based on one bow/one shooters performance.  For me, the final stat, which I know will not meet the orginal intent of this post, is the string of game that fell to a well placed arrow from a good bow.  I have one or two bows that just get it done time after time and have produced confidence for me in that bow. I will take that every single time over handshock, balance, fps, kinetic energy, etc., as the truth is there really is not a heck of a lot of performance difference between modern bows of the same style/make.  There is a heck of a lot more variables/differences between modern archers.

[LittleBen]

I think Laurent (Hybridbow Hunter) hit it on the head. Efficiency across a range of arrow weights paints a very detailed picture. With that said, it also requires the most information collection, but you cant get something for nothing.

DaveT1963 ... this is a basic philosophic problem. Some level of evidence must allow us to make a reasonable inference about the future. I.e. a bow of one design and construction providing a certain performance leads us to reasonably assume the next bow which is as identical as possible, will perform the same or at least nearly identical. If we can't accept that, then no testing can ever tell us anything except about one particular, unique item.

[hybridbow hunter]

This year we are going to test under our  protocol border HEX6 bb2 black Douglas, RER the Vital, Big Jim Buffalo , Toelke Lynx, and a few others.

To date with a naked string the fastest bow mesured by us ( aka Foudarme here on TG) Is the 2013 black Douglas border 62"w HEX6 bb2 at low brace 6 5/8": all at 28" on a Hooter  shooter

206@9gpp
197@ 10 gpp a monster speed...
171 @ 14 gpp            
156. @ 17,16 gpp                          (980 gr arrow out of a 57# @ 28"   !!)

[Chuck from Texas]

Over the years I have owned lots of bows from the best makers. Realy the biggest difference is not speed. It's stability, shootability or forgivness, whatever you call it some bows will punish you much more for minor form and rlease flaws. I have found that these bows are usually harder to tune and picky about the arrows they like. My theory about why some of the older bows were so great is that they were designed before everyone had a cronograph.
We each have to figure it out for ourselves our bow arms are stronger or weaker we each deflect the string more or less on release so the bow that is great for me may not be for you.
Chuck

[BWD]

Originally posted by ron w:
If you can hit what your shooting at with a given bow, then the performance is spot on...at least for you!!      

If that ain't working for you, nothing else matters.  

[Nativestranger]

Originally posted by hybridbow hunter:
This year we are going to test under our  protocol border HEX6 bb2 black Douglas, RER the Vital, Big Jim Buffalo , Toelke Lynx, and a few others.

To date with a naked string the fastest bow mesured by us ( aka Foudarme here on TG) Is the 2013 black Douglas border 62"w HEX6 bb2 at low brace 6 5/8": all at 28" on a Hooter  shooter

206@9gpp
197@ 10 gpp a monster speed...
171 @ 14 gpp              
156. @ 17,16 gpp                             (980 gr arrow out of a 57# @ 28"   !!)

Smoking results. Those hooks really work like cams for energy storage. Do you have results with a fully with string silencers for a fair comparison with other bows?

[BigJim]

If people spent more time worrying about the target and less time about the bow and how it is performing, all bows would perform better.

The best bows that I have shot didn't even exist the moment I set eyes on the target.

BigJim

[Bowwild]

BigJim has a strong point. Of course then we could all save money and trouble and stop at the first bow we lay hands on.

A lot of my fun in archery has nothing to do with the target though.

[Sixby]

Some of us have a little of the High School hot rodder left in us; Building the machine is just as much a part of the fun as driving it. JUst cannot help myself. I see this stuff in my sleep. LOL its way more than a job; Its like a journey with something new around every corner.

My experience of over 55 years with bows and archers is that a lot of us are tinkerers. Good enough is not existent in our lives. We always look for a way to improve the current status quo. Raise the bar to a new level; It may even be the human nature;

The Borders numbers are impressive indeed; We now need to raise the bar to 210.  :bigsmyl

God bless you all, Steve

[Shawn Leonard]

Performance is way to broad a term, because for me a bunch of things add up to performance. I can perform a back flip, it may be lousy but I can, same with a bow just because it is fast does not mean it performs well. As Joe said AMO standards were 60#s at 28"s and 9gpp(540 grain arrow)that would bea great place to start on the how the bow performs in the speed department but there are way more things at least for me that dictates how a bow performs and what performs well for me may not perform well for others. Shawn

[Nativestranger]

Speed isn't everything. That's a given. However, draw smoothness, Stored energy, dynamic efficiency, noise and even handshock can be measured and give a pretty good indication of a bows shooting qualities. A bow that stacks badly will have poor stored energy figures. A bow with lots of handshock and vibrations usually have poor efficiency figures. Now both of these are directly related to arrow speeds. As long as you keep brace height reasonable the fastest bows are usually the most comfortable to shoot. A smooth curve at the end of the draw and greater arrow speeds also help in vertical groupings.

[michaelschwister]

I use 10 grains of arrow per pound of draw weight at 28" to comapre bow to bow.  However, the ability to consistantly put an arrow where I look is the metric I use when deciding rank order in the stable.