33# enough for deer???

[chris K.]

I would say do it, I wouldn't worry about what people say. As long as she is able to shoot the bow in an accurate matter there is nothing wrong with her equipment. If it is legal in your area do it. We shouldn't be in the practice of disagreement of equipment that she chooses to use as much as we should be supporting a new hunter or archery shooter to the sport. Some people are going to argue the facts but they will do this simply because they beleive they are right and they like to argue until everyone just agrees or chooses not to argure with them and lets them get the last word. Tell her to keep her head up and tell her I said good luck.
Chris Kiefner

[Rick McGowan]

I have read ALL of every single post on this thread and most of it leaves me very disappointed. The "yeah go ahead and do it", don't seem have any regard for the animals or bowhunting in general. Bowhunting isn't easy, now add in a beginner and give them a bow that will work IF, she pulls it all the way, waits for a close, perfect angle shot, with the right heads, perfectly tuned arrows(can't really add "heavy arrows" with that weight bow) AND has perfect shot placement and the deer dosn't move and the wind dosn't blow etc.! Sounds like an awful lot of "ifs" to me. EVERY time one of these threads comes up, you hear from all those that know someone who killed umpteen animals with whatever very light equipment, you NEVER EVER hear of the animals they hit, but did not recover, WHY? Do not tell me its because it didn't happen, I KNOW better and I have seen some good potential bowhunters give up because of it.

[larry]

I would take her out and do all the small game hunting that you guys possibly can, while that was going on, I'd see if she could build up her weight to 40lbs at her draw, if she can build up to 40lbs, and with some small game under her belt, then I would say lets hit the deer woods.

[hockeyref]

35# is the legal minimum for whitetail in PA......

[chris K.]

#35 is legal in Indiana also. But if it was legal to use less I wouldn't see a problem, what is 2-5 lbs. You can screw up with 50lbs as you can with 30 lbs. If you screw up you screw up, it doesn't matter how many lbs you are shooting. You shoot a deer in the guts with 70 lbs. compound chances are it is going to go as far as a deer hit in the guts with a 30 lbs recurve. And plus, I don't think we can talk about deer that we wound during deer season anyway, they told us last year that they didn't want that posted so you are going to be one sided on this anyway.
Chris Kiefner

[jojotater]

Rick, how many animals are not recovered with heavy bows? You don't hear bragging on that either. You make it sound as if you can take sloppy shots with heavy bows.

I've asked earlier "How do we know 35# is not enough weight." Maybe someone should do some tests. Maybe it is and maybe it is not, but this bad hit stuff is possible with all poundage.

I read that people have taken a lot of deer with light bows, but I seldom read where deer get away with bad hits from heavy bows. I've been bow hunting for over 30 years, and I know it happens.

I haven't seen proof yet that a 35# bow is not more than enough. I don't know, but I would like to, because I have a young daughter just starting out with her first bow. She is shooting a 16# now. I hope some day she will make it to the 40# limit that Arkansas requires if she decides to hunt. I don't know if she will make that poundage because she is small--very small for her age. If lighter bows ARE enough I will push that in this state. If not, well, it is just is not enough and she will not be able to hunt with a bow.

Does anyone know if there have been documented tests on this subject?

[Biggie Hoffman]

I'm with Rick, there is more at stake here than a single shot at a single animal. TV has soured allot of the public perception we've taken years to instill of Fair chase and bowhunting ethics. Adding to the problem by shooting a lightweight bow shouldn't be encouraged.
Bowhunting is not for everyone although the compound device and allthe gadget manufacturers want you to believe otherwise.
If you think hunters and non-hunters make the laws on hunting and seasons, you have allot of catching up to do.

[Rick McGowan]

jojotater, I think I better reread what I wrote, because I am very sure I never said that heavy bows allow sloppy shots. I KNOW that I have seen animals taken with heavier than the minimum gear and less than perfect shots, that I am sure would NOT have taken with lighter gear. Nearly everytime this discussion comes up, the light gear advocates bring it to,"a good shot with a light bow vs a bad shot with a heavy bow", yeah, so what? I haven't noticed that there is ANY corellation between bow weights and shooting skills. The thing is that with very light gear EVERYTHING has to be perfect, with heavier bows, arrows and bigger broadheads, they can do a better job if everything isn't perfect.
    I have posted THIS question a number of times and am still waiting for the first answer, "suppose you have that very light setup and determine that it is fine, if everything is perfect, on a average sized whitetail, that is broadside and not more than 15 yards away, NOW the monster buck of a lifetime, 200#'s plus, comes by at about 20 yards, quartering away, are you going to pass up the shot, really?"  
   I don't know, I guess its the common thread running through our society, when I started bowhunting, the question was always, "how much weight do I need to work up", now the question is ALWAYS, "what is the minimum".

[jojotater]

Every bow has a limit. If you see a deer of a lifetime at 50 yards, will you pass with a heavy bow?

Speaking of limits: That's why we hunt tradional anyway, isn't it? Limits=more challenge. Why not use a state of the art compound or a rifle.

It's like comparing a 30-30 to a 7 Mag. A 30-30 will get it done, but it has more limits.

I didn't ask the original question here, but I still would like to see some concrete evidence on what a 30 pound bow will do to a deer. Is it enough or not? I know what a 50# compound will do. I also know what it will do on a bad shot. I know what a 200 pound crossbow will do on a bad shot too. "You want a good shot!"

The question: Is a 30 bow enough if you hit where you are suppose to within its limit--maybe 18 yards?

[Mr.Magoo]

Just for kicks I took a 35# Quinn recurve and shot it thru the chrono.  462gr arrow clocked at 150fps (course that's a 28" draw).

[Ray Hammond]

Rick,
a thread just about like this one, and another one where guys were advocating 100 yard shots at elk were the reason I left the "other" site.

It is obvious to me that you are wasting your time here.

[buckeyebowhunter]

I'd check your game laws first but I'm sure it wouild kill a deer, Ive heard of Native American Indians using bows as low as 30lbs of draw and killing buffalo.

[Biggie Hoffman]

yep you can kill a deer with a .22 rifle too....
That don't make it right

[jojotater]

Ok, I'm curious. What is the least poundage you fellows think is ok since many are of the opinion that 35 is not enough?

[Shawn Leonard]

I agree with both sides to a point, were the archers of yesteryear any less moral than us, or ethical. Who can answer that, because I know for a fact a lot of hunters shot deer 45-50 years ago with 40# bow and a lot of them were not pulling a full 28"s. Respectfully, Shawn

[Jason R. Wesbrock]

Originally posted by Rick McGowan:
I have posted THIS question a number of times and am still waiting for the first answer, "suppose you have that very light setup and determine that it is fine, if everything is perfect, on a average sized whitetail, that is broadside and not more than 15 yards away, NOW the monster buck of a lifetime, 200#'s plus, comes by at about 20 yards, quartering away, are you going to pass up the shot, really?"  
   

Well then, let me be the first. Not only is the answer yes, but hell yes. What your question is basically asking is if, as individuals, we have the restraint to stay within our limits, no matter the trophy caliber of the animal in front of us. And that queston's not exclusive to those hunting with lightweight equipment. Quite honestly, it's a question every hunter, bow gun or otherwise, should answer before going afield.

Asking a person with a 35# bow if they'd extend exceed their effective range by a third because they're looking at a buck of a lifetime is no different than asking you if you'd exceed your range by a third under the same circumstances.

In twenty-plus year of bowhunting I've lost track of how many "whatevers" of a lifetime I've passed up because they were a bit too far away, the angle was wrong, there were obstructions like brush in the way, or any other list of reasons. As a matter of fact, I passed up shots on the first two P&Y-class whitetails I ever saw from a treestand. The first one was because he was 5 yards beyond my effective range. The second was only 4 yards away, but he was facing me with his head down, and I don't consider "base of the neck and between the shoulder blades" a very good shot angle.

I understand what you're saying, Rick, and to be honest, I have no idea what minimum poundage is good for whitetails. But a person who would exceed their limitations or effecive range with a 35# bow would do the same if he or she was hunting with 40, 50, or 60+ pounds. I think we've all spent enough late nights tracking animals for folks who said "I know it wasn't a good shot, but it was the only shot I had" to know that people don't suddenly become responsible and ethical just because they bought heavier limbs for their bow.

[Plumbob]

Hell if somone tried to answser they would just get badgered to death.

These threads get so old.......do want you want within the law and don't blame anyone for the outcome but please learn from your mistakes.

[Shawn Leonard]

Well said Jason. I have read articles in TBM on the owner of Rancho Safari, he took some out-of this world shots. Am I advocating that, hell no, but it does come down to a person knowing his equipment and knowing and staying within their limits. Shawn

[Rick McGowan]

Ray, you are right. Biggie, you are too!
jojo, still no one has ever answered my question!

[Shawn Leonard]

Rick, Jason just answered it and that would be mine as well, I have passed up many shots at quite a few large deer because I felt I could not make a quick clean kill, not only with a bow but rifle and sluggun as well. Shawn