bivy and tarp or tent?

[lovethehunt]

A couple of fellow tradgangers and I are headed on another backpack hunt this year. Our last was a secluded Island in Alaska for Sitka Blacktails, this time it is for Elk in Colorado. We have picked a location and have a 6 mile hike in and plan on ten days from a base camp and spike out form there. So here is the question, would you rather carry a full tent ( fly, tent body, poles, ground tarp), just the ground cover and fly/pole combo or bivy and a tarp. I think the tarp/bivy is most likly the same weight as the my fly/pole combo. I don't know if bugs are factor at 10,000 + feet of elevation in mid September. I will be taking a 0 degree bag this time, I was near hypothermia on the AK trip and used too many calories trying to shiver my way warm at night.

I appreciate any help, thanks.

Todd

[reddogge]

Hardcore man. Why don't you weigh each combo and then make your decision. A tent is mighty comfortable in inclement weather.

[mellonhead]

I have spent many a night in a USGI Bivy bag.  The coldest has been 14 degrees.  I usually don't use a tarp unless bad weather is coming.  The tent can be worth its extra weight though if you end up waiting out some weather.  

Toby

[beaver#1]

Hennessy hammock all the way. That's my opinion. I won't sleep on the ground ever again.

[wapiti792]

Man I have spent some miserable nights in Sept in a bivy and a tarp...the last 3 hunts "up top" I carried a Eureka 2 man tent that weighs about 7 pounds. Total weight of my pack was 50 pounds and I did a 5 day hunt. I can honestly say I'd rather lose 7 pounds of fat off my own arse than stay another night in just a bivy. Just my 2 cents...also my hike was only 2 miles which may make a difference.

[hayslope]

I have a small bivy tent...weighs about 1.2 pounds with stakes and rain fly.  It's not a useful tent...pretty tight quarters....unless you are backpacking in a long distance and use it for spike camps.  Then it shines.  No room for anything but you, your pad and bag. You can find many similar one person tents.  A tarp is a pretty handy and useful addition for additional cover.

Your choice of pad and bag is more important in my opinion and there are tons of choices out there.....but take Richard's advice and weigh everything.  Not many flat areas in the mountains of Colorado, so around mile 4 is when you start feeling those extra pounds and ounces. (At 59, my legs hurt just thinking about it!)

[Orion]

Might consider a Kifaru tepee tent.  Very light and strong.  Can leave the center aluminum pole at home and just cut a center pole at camp. When my buddy and I hunt, we take the stove along as well.  One carries the 6-man tent, the other the stove. Each weighs about 4#.  Very comfortable regardless of the weather. With the stove, can even dry clothes inside.  

Bugs aren't much of a problem in the high country in Colorado in September.

[canopyboy]

Just bought a 2 person (really just a roomy 1 person) that weighs under 3 pounds with everything including the bag, stakes, and ground cloth.  Big Agnes Fly Creek UL2.  I've set it up and played with it, like it a lot.  Seems tough to beat the weight by too much more with other options, and the comfort seems worth it to me.  I like a tent in bug season and for a little more warmth in the cold.

[Bernie B.]

I haven't used a bivy and tarp, but can comment on tents.  Look for a free-standing tent in the five lbs. or less range.

 I use a Kelty Gunnison 2 for self contained bicycle touring and also for backpacking into elk country in Colorado.  It's a very comfortable tent, and is very well made.  There are a number of good tents available in that weight.  I don't think you'd be sorry going the tent route.

Bernie Bjorklund

NC Iowa/SW Wisconsin

[JimB]

Without knowing the type and weight of tent,I'm not sure how to answer your question.

A good tent that blocks the wind can add 10 degrees or so to your sleeping bag's effective rating.This probably won't be an issue with your 0 degree bag if the rating is true.It would have allowed you to use a lighter bag though but I know what you are saying about living through a trip like that.I suspect bugs probably won't be an issue at that elevation and time so the only other issue would be inclement weather.

I use this MSR Zoid I which I don't think is still made but there should be plenty others to choose from.I can use it with the whole works for less than 4 lbs.My bow and pack will fit in the tent with me but no room to spare.The bow and pack will also fit under the vestibule for more room inside the tent.
 
 

For real light traveling,I can leave the tent body back and use the "Fast and Light Pitch" which is 2lbs 1 oz.That's light.

A complete tent can be a real comfort in inclement weather,high winds or lots of bugs but you may not encounter any of that.

You just have to literally WEIGH your options.The truth is,using new equipment the first time you do a particular trip is a crap shoot.You found that out on your AK trip.You may want to err on the side of caution which may mean you have to endure a few extra pounds,till you have been there and done that.Hopefully you will get to do it again and can fine tune your choices.

[gringol]

I have both, but only used the bivy once because it blows.  You'll wake up with a wet sleeping bag from condensation.  The weight you save will quickly be negated by your wet sleeping bag.  Go with the tent.

[sledge]

1st, bugs aren't generally a big issue at 8500+, in september, in my experience.

i carry an rei bivy in my hunting pack, as survival gear.  i spent a sleety, snowy, unexpected night in it a few years ago.

i believe it saved my life.

for planned camping, give me a tent, though.

joe

[awbowman]

I spent 10 days last Sept. in Colorado and I would have packed it up by the third day had it not been for tents.  I had a Hubba tent (freestanding, very well built, and you could pitch only the fly if you wanted) packed for spike camp, and I was soooooooo glad.  We never did spike in, we were within striking range of the elk from base camp.  We stayed at the base camp with a canvas tent and heat.  It rained, snowed, or sleeted on us 9 out of 10 days ..... sometimes as many as five times in a day.  I am not from the west, so maybe I'm not the best one to ask, BUT I COULD NOT HAVE FATHOMED THE THOUGHT OF SPENDING TIME IN A BIVY in the weather we experienced.  Hunting hard for 10 days at 10,000+' is a chore by itself.  You simply cannot afford to add extreme discomfort to the mix.  At least this is my take on it.

Bugs were not an issue.

Oh, and get a footprint if it's offered

[Glunt]

If you will be 6 miles from "real" shelter for 10 days, I would be looking for a light tent.  You can grab the fly and use it as a temp shelter for a 1 or 2 night bivy camp from your base.  

When you are packed in and don't have clothes to spare, a full tent is pretty nice.   Weight is a huge issue for a 10 day backpack hunt where you are burning calories hard everyday so a lighter option is pretty tempting, but its all a trade-off.

If you mean you will be camped at the vehicle for 10 days and spiking out for a few days from there, I would chance a lighter set-up and have  a nice big comfy tent at the truck.

[sledge]

1st, bugs aren't generally a big issue at 8500+, in september, in my experience.

i carry an rei bivy in my hunting pack, as survival gear.  i spent a sleety, snowy, unexpected night in it a few years ago.

i believe it saved my life.

for planned camping, give me a tent, though.

joe

[huntnmuleys]

I much prefer the tent myself...

[Biathlonman]

Can't imagine doing 10 days in a bivy.  If the weather was perfect it might be ok, but the weather is never perfect when I'm out.  Kifaru Sawtooth for me.  For shorter/lighter trips I like a Tarptent contrail.  I expect from now forward to always have my bag in a ultralight bivy sack for protection from condensation, but hope never to have to spend the night in just the bag!

[ron w]

It's all about the weather......you have to pay attention to what's going on with mother nature. As far as bugs, last year camping at 9,500 feet the biting flies were a real pain in the A__! And I had a 4 man tent! I have a 1 man Bivy tent that is tight quarters but priceless in a storm! Good luck on your hunt!

[Lost Arra]

My Colorado experience is similar to Biathlonman.

I've used a Kifaru Supertarp with no complaints and no bivy sack. As I get older I would prefer his Sawtooth just for the added height but the Supertarp is very light and simple to pitch in many configurations.

I've also used a Tarptent Scarp 1. Nice solid floored shelter. Compact but not a place I would like to spend a lot of time other than just sleeping. It can be pitched with just the fly.

I spent a week backpacking in Utah in a Golite Utopia 2 and it was a nice floorless shelter also.

For me a bivy sack is a survival accessory. If you haven't used one I would suggest spending the night in it in your backyard the next time it storms. I did it and decided the bivy was not for me.

[gringol]

BTW, a ground cloth is usually not necessary with modern tents...