rattle snake skins

[wapitirod]

I mistakenly posted this in the classifieds too but maybe that is a better place but I figured I'd share here too since I'm not out to make any money on anything.  I also forgot to mention in the other post that the juvenile rattlers have beautiful markings and the adults have either a green or brown tint to their hides which I think is due to their sex.

I've seen a couple posts about snake skins and even some in the classifieds. I take an annual camping trip to Eastern OR and one of my favorite past times is hunting rattlers. I normally do it with revolvers, with cap and ball being my favorite since the smoke adds a challenge and some excitement, especially since the NW rattler is considered the most aggressive although one of the smaller of the rattlers. My point to this is I normally kill anywhere from 30 to 100 in the week I'm there. The snakes can range from 12" juveniles to about 40" with the avg being about 30". I've been out of traditional archery for a while but I'm guessing you use them on limbs and arrows. I just sent my son back to my ex with over 30 hides from this year but if any of you are interested I'd let any future ones go for shipping and maybe a couple bucks for skinning. I do have at least a few in my freezer right now but I'm not sure of their condition. I'd probably thaw them in anti freeze which helps with preserving them. If any of them are any good and anyones interested just let me know otherwise it will be next summer before I have a new bunch but you guys are welcome to any I kill if you want.

[Ga.boy]

100 per week?

"To each his own said the mule as he painted his rear end sky blue".

[wapitirod]

I like snakes but I have an extreme dislike for rattlers, the few locals in the area just run them over so I hunt them.  I just haven't figured out how to do it with a bow and not ace an arrow on every shot.

[Grey Taylor]

Rod, I put a reply on your classifieds post.

Guy

[wapitirod]

thanks guys I'm getting alot of interest.  I dug out my snakes in the freezer and have them thawing so I'll get the salt cleaned off of them and get them cleaned up and take inventory on number and sizes.  I'll just go in the order I was contacted but if your interested send me a pm and let me know what the minimum is your needing and I'll try to make them go as far as possible.  I'll definitely save alot more hides next year including the road kill rattlers and bulls as well as any of the other species that are large enough and that have nice colored hides.  I'll let everyone know if these end up salvageable or not.  One of the guys suggested using borax instead of the glycerin treatment using ethlyne glycol.
Thanks again and I hope this helps some of you out, as much as hate rattlers it does make me feel better to know they aren't being wasted.  I'd thought about trying the meat but I can't bring myself to eat something I just removed whole or partially digested rodents from, call my picky.

[bowless]

A good time combined with a generous offer, tough to beat that!

[Ted Fry]

Not to put a damper on your idea but you better check with Oregon State police regarding the sale of rattle snakes from Oregon , they are protected and you can not sell or trade a protected species, just thought I would give you a heads up before you get in trouble.

[Mike Yancey]

2 x what Ted said, most states snakes are protected and once you send them across state lines it is more trouble than you want to be in.
We get ALL our snakes from legal states with paper work to back it up.
Mike

[Brad Robins]

I'll be hunting in your area next weekend.  Maybe I can stop by and pick up a couple from ya IF you have any left.  I'll donate, not buy from you?

Thanks for the great offer!    

Brad

[JimB]

Originally posted by Ted Fry:
Not to put a damper on your idea but you better check with Oregon State police regarding the sale of rattle snakes from Oregon , they are protected and you can not sell or trade a protected species, just thought I would give you a heads up before you get in trouble.

Ted reminded me,I had heard it was illegal to sell snakes from Oregon-maybe it was just rattlesnakes,I can't remember.

As Mike Yancey alluded to,for sure,if it is illegal-AND-crosses state lines,the Lacey Act makes it a felony.When buying or selling wildlife parts,it pays to understand all the laws.

[wapitirod]

well that sucks, of course I don't care about selling them so I'll go down to fish and wildlife on Monday and double check what the law is on it.  I'd never heard about them being protected, most of the ranchers I know pour diesel down the dens in the spring and torch them.  I'll keep you guys up on what I find out.  I really don't care about making anything on them, I kill them regardless and this way if it helps someone else out that much better.  Thanks for the heads up.

[wapitirod]

so far doing a web search all I'm finding is you can't sell or trade so if I can get hold of an ODFW biologist I know this weekend I'll talk to him otherwise I'll go in on Monday.  If it's only the sale or trade part of it there may be a loop hole, although for those of you that contacted me about large numbers it may make that difficult but like I said I have no intentions to stop killing the rattlers.  I did get part of the skins thawed today and I re salted and sorted them.  I have a few that may work for limbs and a bunch that would work for arrows and I still have 5 more I threw in the freezer and forgot to skin.  I need to wait for them to thaw but I think maybe 4 of them will be long enough for limbs.  If there is any way to make it happen I will get it done.  This is just another reason I've pretty much had it with this state.  I can see a home in Wyoming in my future.

[WINDTALKER]

Wapitirod, you may want to call the local game warden where your hunting snakes as they usually know the laws, usually not always. I called the state office here in  Salem and was told by a person whom I seem to remember called her self Tracy, that crotalus viridis oreganus or the pacific rattle snake fell under the rules of a nonprotected native species. That means you can hunt them for personal use with a hunting license, but you can't sell barter or exchange them. That being said take a look at the Oregon state archives page under headings 635-056-0060&0080 and635-044-0130 and 635-056-0130. I beleive the last one refrences gophersnakes which are illegal to hunt. On a side not if you need a hunting partner I try to get over east or south a few times a year I usually only take a few as not to deplete the area and allow the mice to over run the area but I still enjoy the hunt and photographing them.

[wapitirod]

Thanks for the info, everything I've found so far shows the Lacey act wouldn't apply because it specifically says illegaly taken animals.  I was just looking to help out some fellow archers that may not have access to rattlers so I don't know if I'm just giving them away basicly if that is ok too or not.  I know a couple of the biologist here in Tillamook so maybe they will know otherwise I'll call ODFW in John Day.  The property we have is 15acres on the middle fork of the John Day, half way between HWY 395 and 7.  It's my wifes family's and when the time comes it will be her and her brothers.  It sits right on the Desolation/North Side boundary line just inside the Desolation unit.  If I can find a way to legally supply some of the guys that have contacted me about larger numbers I'd definitely take you up on the hunting partner aspect.  I'm through Salem alot going to my Dr in Bend so maybe we can grab a burger or something one of these times.  I'll let you know what I find out.

[Eric Krewson]

For bow backing you only want to skin and dry your skins, no salt.

You do need to flesh them before you dry them. Some skins like our local timber rattlers have a lot of flesh attached to the skin, local copperheads have no flesh attached and don't need to be fleshed.

Flesh, tack up on a board with a staple gun, flesh side out. Let the skin dry a few days.

 

Trim off the belly scales, roll up dry and put in a zip loc bag.

 

[JimB]

The Lacey act does apply if it is illegal to barter or exchange them.There have been many cases of legally taken animals being involved in Lacey act cases due to some other infraction in the way they were sold or transferred.I don't know a thing about Oregon law but even being reimbursed for shipping or whatever can be construed as selling in a lot of jurisdictions.

Dealing in sale or trade of wildlife skins and parts is highly regulated these days on state and federal levels and you really have to understand all the ins and outs if you want to avoid serious trouble.

[Tree Killer]

Originally posted by wapitirod:
The property we have is 15acres on the middle fork of the John Day, half way between HWY 395 and 7.  It's my wifes family's and when the time comes it will be her and her brothers.  It sits right on the Desolation/North Side boundary line just inside the Desolation unit.

wapitirod...The background look familiar to you? I killed this turkey in 2011 in the area you just described, but just upstream in the national forest.

 

 

[snag]

Hi Rod, if you can spare another set I'd love to put some on a selfbow I am building.

Love that country!

[wapitirod]

Tree killer, that looks very familiar.  If your familiar with where Big Creek dums into the Middle fork the property ling goes down the middle of big creek and crosses the river and then east a little ways and back across to the north and it follows the middle fork road down to the forest service road that goes up big creek and then it follows the forest service road for a half mile or so and then back dow to the creek.  We normally see alot of turkeys but this year I didn't see an turkey or chukars and they used to be everywhere.  I don't think it's the coyotes because they haven't been as heavy recently and the guy at meadow brook store said they are getting 60-70.00 per hide in the winter so they've been hunted hard.  There have been several reputable wolf sightings in the area though.  I did see alot of whitetails and mulies although not very many horns.  We are trying to figure out a way to move over there and be able to make it just with my disability and my gunsmithing business.  The older I get the more of a recluse I'm becoming and I love it over there.  We've even considered living in our 26ft travel trailer for a while until we can get something permanent figured and we are still considering possibly buying the store.


snag I have to check the legal stuff first but the snakes I had were some I'd had in the freezer for a while and they are pretty well spoken for.  I do have a bunch that wood work for cresting arrows as long as I can ship them. I'll get to the bottom of the legal issues on Monday.

[wapitirod]

I didn't want those of you that have contacted me to think I'm just blowing you off and there are too many to email and pm so I wanted to give you an update.  I went to fish and wildlife yesterday and talked to the district manager and he wasn't even sure.  Here in OR fish and wildlife law einforcement falls to a division of the state police so he was going to check with the local sgt in charge of that division and if necessary check further and get back to me.  He had hoped to have news for me today but I haven't heard anything yet.  I'll give him a couple more days before I bug him again.  The interest in these snake skins has blown me away so if I can legally transfer them I'll just go in the order I received interest.  I think I probably only have enough 30+ inch snakes to do 5 or 6 bows as these snakes are alot smaller than most of their cousins.  I'll make a list of those that are interested and when I go back next year I'll just continue to work down the list if those people are still interested.  I've been asked alot about cost but for now even if it is legal I wouldn't want anything until after you looked at the skins as some may have small holes or just in case they aren't big enough.  If all is well then postage would be the main thing.  I've also been contacted by some people that would like them in volume but obviously that will depend on the legal aspect of it and how often I can get over there to hunt them and like all hunting nothing is guaranteed.  Like I was saying some years I'll kill 30 in a week and others I'll a hundred or more but size can vary.  Some years I'll kill almost all 30"+ and others they may all be two footers or smaller.  I do have a bunch that would work for arrow wraps if it's legal to ship them and anyone is interested.
Thanks for all the interest guys and I'll do everything I can to help as many of you as I can.  I'm one that figures hunters need to stick together and help eachother out whenever possible.