Bear spray vs a handgun

[Chromebuck]

Chignik, AK 2010

Special Education Teacher from Pennsylvania.

  http://www.alaskadispatch.com/article/wolves-killed-alaska-teacher-2010-state-says  

It must be remembered that wolf populations are thriving up here and this land is different than many.  Wolves have never been re-established, just managed.  Wolves up here can spend there entire life without a human encounter.  Perhaps other than the legal aerial assaults!  

We provide all our clients with bear (pepper)spray.  And is what I endorse completely.  Unless it's Jerry Miculek I'm not loaning any firearm for bear duty...

[Mark Baker]

Plenty of bears here in MT, too.  And plenty of hunters get mauled.   I carry pepper spray, and there is a reason F&W officials do as well, where they are a problem.   It works best!

No griz in WI, last I knew, and I would'nt worry about it.   Black bears and wolves are not a likely problem at all.   We have both of those as well, and have almost no problems in their interactions with hunters/people.    

Mountain lions are another worry altogether here, and they will come into calling setups, and stalk hunters....especially bow hunters.   And their motivations for doing so are quite different than those of a griz, which is likely charging in his own self-defence.   That's why playing dead works, and why bear spray works...IMO.   Look at the animals motivations for attacking you and then decide, if you still feel threatened, what to carry.  That includes humans for some.    That's my 2 cents.

[eflanders]

I live in NE WI right on the UP of MI border.  We have bears and wolves and plenty of both.  In the 40 years of hunting here and elsewhere, I have never had a threatening issue with bear or wolves. (Cats are another story altogether.) However, IMO the potential does exist with bears more-so than with wolves here.  There have been several documented and non-documented cases of black bear attacks to humans in WI.  I think most if not all were due to cubs being very close to the people.  One encounter happened while an individual was on-stand and had no other option but to try and defend himself as the cubs curiosity had them seeking out the hunter.

As another person has already pointed out, be sure to check the state hunting regulations regarding handgun carry during the archery season!  Yes, we have conceal carry now in WI, but that does not permit you to "hunt" with the handgun and a game warden is likely to question you accordingly.

I have always avoided all bear issues with noise.  They don't want to go anywhere near someone making a loud noise.  The same holds true for wolves.  If you see one (bear or wolf) and if you don't want it to get anywhere near you, just blow a sports referee type whistle. A whistle is safe, reliable, legal and very effective.  It will scare them out of there in a hurry (and it is also good to have one along in case you ever need help). I learned this from my cousin who works for Idaho Fish & Game.  He does fish counts for them and encounters bears on a daily basis when he is in the field.  He doesn't carry spray or a gun on him when working (even though he is actually required to have it in his truck) as he has never had an issue when he just makes a little noise.

[David Mitchell]

captain caveman, I own a Taurus Judge and have it stoked here at home with Winchester home defense rounds--three slugs and 12 BBs per shell.  That might also discourage a wolf or bear and wouldn't be too tough to hit with at relatively close range I think, but no experience with such situations like some of the folks posting here.

[WidowEater]

Yeah, a handgun will get the job done.....ONLY if you do your part.

Doing your part on a charging animal, be it a wolf or bear, is going to be tricky at best.  When you have to hit a critical central nervous system component in the heat of the moment, my money is on that you wont wound the animal, you will miss entirely.

Spray, wind factors considered, will pose a much better hit potential, if you blind yourself in the process, well, hopefully the statistics are right.  If they are not, well, that bear was gonna get you whether you were blind or not.

Id also be willing to bet the vast majority of us are not as proficient with a handgun as we are telling ourselves.  That goes the same for a bow for that matter.

[Gary Logsdon]

When bear hunting I carry a pocketful of rocks to chunk at any overly aggressive bear I might meet along the way . . . but then I'm from Kaintuck, and we tend to be pretty good at chunkin rocks :^)

[LKH]

I hunt where there are grizzlys pretty regularly.  I don't carry anything but my bow, but then I don't carry a lightning rod either and the odds of getting hit by lightning are much higher than getting attacked by a bear.

Spray  95% effective
guns, including longguns  70% effective

Ever watch the rolling ball down the hill test?

Even the good shots were ineffective.

[Mr. Bones]

dead wolves dont bite. I like my colt 1911 45.

[BowHuntingFool]

Originally posted by stagetek:
If it were me, I would aways opt for something that goes BANG, over something that goes pssst.

I agree with Mike on this one.....BANG!

[Orion]

You're talking northern Wisconsin, not Alaska.  I've been hunting in far northern Wisconsin for more than 30 years and have never felt threatened by wolves or bears.  You don't need spray or a gun, just some cahones.  

[wihill]

Originally posted by wissler:
Well,
Bow season here in Wisconsin opens Satruday.
I rarely hunt opener, but utilize the weekend for setting up stands and trimming shooting lanes(and fishing for smallies and musky!)

This is the first time I'm going by myself. Usually my brother-in-law(limbhanger on here) or my dad is with me.
The last couple of years there have been an increasing number of wolves in my area(Presque Isle)
I'm not really worried about bears, but the wolves bother me a little. Hearing them howl at times, it seems like they are 100 yards away from me. I did not apply for Wisconsins first year of wolf tags.
I do not own a handgun.
Do I borrow my buddies 44 mag, or just carry my Grizzly bear spray?

Setting up stands in the middle of no-where is a little creepy as well. I will be using a harness when setting stands, but if something happens.....Hope my wife isn't reading this. LOL

From what I understood about the law and what was explained to me from a warden, you're not allowed to carry a pistol while bow hunting unless you have a CC permit.  Now what you do on your own land is up to you I suppose, but I err on the side of caution regarding the law(I have a CC permit).

Bear spray is fine for WI - I'd be more worried about wolves than bears, but that's my own opinion.

The chances of getting attacked by black bear is so close to zero it is not worth concerning yourself about. Us whimpy BWCA canoeists cross paths with them all the time, it is not a big deal until they are running away with your food pack and even then some stern words and a rock will get your food back. The wolves are a completely different deal. No one in history has ever been attacked by a wild wolf. How anyone should flatter themselves into thinking that they will be the first is beyond me.

[JimB]

" No one in history has ever been attacked by a wild wolf. How anyone should flatter themselves into thinking that they will be the first is beyond me. "

Yes,they have.Rare,but there have been fatalities.Same goes for coyotes.

[Shane C]

For what it's worth, there has been considerable research done on the handgun vs. bear spray debate. ALL things point to bear spray. Rarely, a bear will be taken down by shooting it and even rarer are you able to take it out with one shot. Research also says that people get more severely injured when they do use a gun over bear spray. Now, I know that I'm referring to bear, which is what the research is done on, but I'd be willing to bet that the same will hold true for wolves. In reality toting a gun around gives us a warm and fuzzy feeling inside but when the situation arises that we actually need to use it it is useless at best and dangerous at best. So, my advice would be that if you want to get that warm fuzzy feeling inside then bring the gun, but make sure you have that bear sprayand that's what you go to first!

[Shane C]

Originally posted by pavan:
The chances of getting attacked by black bear is so close to zero it is not worth concerning yourself about. Us whimpy BWCA canoeists cross paths with them all the time, it is not a big deal until they are running away with your food pack and even then some stern words and a rock will get your food back. The wolves are a completely different deal. No one in history has ever been attacked by a wild wolf. How anyone should flatter themselves into thinking that they will be the first is beyond me.

Yeah they have. A woman bow hunter in Idaho was attacked by one that she shot and killed. It was a pretty big deal

[Brock]

singer in canada attacked and killed by coyotes....on busy park trail

[JimB]

Originally posted by Shane C:
For what it's worth, there has been considerable research done on the handgun vs. bear spray debate. ALL things point to bear spray. Rarely, a bear will be taken down by shooting it and even rarer are you able to take it out with one shot. Research also says that people get more severely injured when they do use a gun over bear spray. Now, I know that I'm referring to bear, which is what the research is done on, but I'd be willing to bet that the same will hold true for wolves. In reality toting a gun around gives us a warm and fuzzy feeling inside but when the situation arises that we actually need to use it it is useless at best and dangerous at best. So, my advice would be that if you want to get that warm fuzzy feeling inside then bring the gun, but make sure you have that bear sprayand that's what you go to first!

Actually there have been a lot of bears stopped by handguns but I would still like to see your links to those studies.

These threads come up often and always,there are a lot of opinions offered.I wonder how these threads would go if the OP asked " if you have never used Pepper spray on a bear or killed a bear with a handgun,please don't respond." ???

Anybody???

[Shane C]

Not sure where in Montana you are from (wish I was still there) but I just moved from Bozeman a little over a month ago. And earlier this year the local newspaper had an article talking about how bear spray was better than guns. Also, I know guns still get the job done, but the bear spray is better. Here's an excerpt from Field & Stream's May issue. (They also have the article about the woman shooting the wolf while bow hunting in Idaho.)

"Preventing an attack means paying bears deserved respect and being grizzly-bear aware regardless of the season. But when avoidance isn't possible, do not assume a rifle will keep you safe. In analyzing hundreds of grizzly attacks, bear expert Steve Smith, who contributed to Herrero's report, found that pepper spray  deterred a charge in more than 90 percent of the cases. Bullets did the job just 66 percent of the time, and it took an average of four shots to stop the bear. A U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service study also revealed that hunters who wounded bears with bullets suffered more serious injuries than people who used capsicum. For both species, spray a one-second burst when a bear closes to 40 feet. At 15 feet, spray a second burst. If the animal continues to charge, empty the contents directly into its face."

You might be able to call up the fish and game and get some of the actual data from them or the stuff that was used in the newspaper article.

[wapitirod]

I always laugh when people talk about "odds"  what are the odds of winning lotteries, getting struck by lightning, etc.  It doesn't matter what the odds are it happens every year to a few people and it only takes once.  Cat's are the most concerning although there are more bear attacks, but what people forget is a Grizz will normally only carry out an attack until it feels your not a threat, most predation cases are black bears which is why you don't play dead with a blackie.  Wolves will attack, I know of the woman bowhunter in ID that recently had to kill a charging wolf and I know it's happened in AK.  They say there is no way to truly know how many wolf attacks there are because they generally don't find the victims and there are no witness's because of locations most of these attacks occur in.  My father in law had a run in with a pack of aggressive coyotes and I've had a run in with a black bear and a couple with cat's and in the case of one of the cats a gun saved my life.  It's a free country and you can choose to do what you will but don't talk about odds.  Air travel is the safest form of transportation in the world but that is little comfort to the thousands that have died in air crashes.

[chinook907]

I usually don't respond to these threads as they don't seem to go anywhere, but I think I can add something to this from experience and maybe help Wissler make a decision (nice buck in your profile pic btw !).

I've killed a few black bears with a handgun and a number of wolves with different firearms but none of either were charging.  A wolf takes some killing for its size but of course they're really not that big and if it works well on a whitetail it should work well on a wolf.

I've only had one wolf follow me close that I know of and it just seemed curious, it got as close as 30' ghosting me.  I was armed and didn't feel threatened in the least, in fact when it got tired of watching/following me I started following it just to watch it for longer.  It was late spring, season was closed, or it would have been a dead wolf.  I don't even consider wolves when I head out the door, but as previously stated, a schoolteacher was run down, killed, and partly consumed about 150 miles or so from here, just 3 years ago.  But nobody seems to remember when it ever happened before, either.

The whole charging bear thing.  About every year I take and sometimes help teach a bear safety class as part of what I do for a living, the class was also mentioned previously.  Yup, buckshot is considered unreliable for bears, and personally I always thought buckshot was for coyotes and people that couldn't shoot lol.  But for wolves, it has sometimes been used for the aerial shooting that has occurred and it is effective at close range.
My only experience with pepper spray is firing off the test ones that only have water in them.  One reason I don't like it is you can't take it on planes of any kind as there is a danger of it discharging so that limits things but mostly I'm probably just old school in my attitude towards it.

And if it was me in your situation, I'd just carry my bow because I like to do that and don't forget it is a very effective weapon.  And enjoy the wolf howls 'cause that's pretty neat stuff.