Frusterated with the Wenssel Woodsman

[stripe55]

Worked up my firt WW's last night.  I had all the tools at my disposal and I must say you best have some time on your hands for the initial sharpening. I started on the big file with the first one and quite a while later I resigned myself to the belt sander to even out the edges so I could put the finished edge on. I am curious to get the finished product on a scale to see where my 150 grain head is now. That said, once I got them evened out it was pretty easy to finish them up and they do fly soooo sweet.

[Terry Green]

Like I said earlier.....get to a belt sander and it don't take long after that.  If you finesse them just right, you can make them hunting sharp right there on the belt sander.....kinda like a sharp file edge.

[Terry Green]

Originally posted by Roger Norris:
..sorry, in my opinion it's a poorly designed head.
 

Roger,

Always like to read your post, but gotta address this one.....

There's a BIG difference in a 'poorly designed' head, and a 'poorly manufactured' head.

Nothing wrong with the design, as it really penetrates well, and does its work if you do yours in making the shot.  Its just got some manufacturing deficiencies by the company that's commissioned to make them. NOTE: These heads are NOT manufactured by Gene and Barry, but were designed by them.

If they came with the bevels even, it would be real easy to put a razor edge on them....and its a piece of cake to pyramid the head to make it more durable.

I addressed this same company, that also manufactures Snuffers, about this very problem with Snuffers before Trad Gang ever existed....and they have yet to address it as it seems.

[northern trapper]

My 2 cents . I make a jig using two 2x4's with a small seperation between the pieces as they lay beside one another. This lets me set one blade down securely and have two blades up to run the file across. The file I use is very fine and only about 5 or 6 inches long 1/2 inch wide. Like has been mentioned very light strokes , I do maybe two or three strokes and then rotate the broadhead until satisfied that every edge is sharp. Next and most important for me is I lay a triangular ceramic sharpening rod flat and slowly draw the broadhead from back to tip across the rod . The end result is scary sharp , Using this method they are sharper than any two blade for me. Most important is light strokes repeated with both the file and ceramic

[Roger Norris]

Terry - I said poorly designed based on these observations:

1. The adherence to the 3:1 ratio (time proven, I know) puts the blades so close together that the edge angle is not easy to address ( I'm thinking 6' file vs. a beltsander here).

2. That needle point...sure, it's easy to get right, but why is it there?

3.Some of you guys have gotten real good at sharpening these. I applaud the effort I'm reading about here. Belt sanders, 14" files, etc. I believe you guys when you say they will shave.  But I have NEVER seen one (and I have seen a couple in hunting camps) that are as sharp as a good 2 bladed head. How many guys are hunting these heads without all the effort you folks put into them? I think we can at least agree that it isn't the simplest head to sharpen...

I should have said "poorly designed in my opinion"...thats all it is, my opinion.


P.S...I sat down with a toolmaker friend several times over the course of six months, and tried to design the ultimate broadhead...at the end of six months we had nothing but a head I consider "poorly designed"...so I don't mean those words as harsh as they sound.  

[MikeW]

Does anyone know what angle the WW's are. It's my understanding to get a shaving sharp edge you need the angle somewhere between 17 & 22 degrees.

I can get them what I would call hunting sharp but not scary sharp. In other words they will shave hair with a little pressure but won't pop hairs on their own weight.

I use a wide file that gets two edges at once and then a fine diamond stone.

[NoCams]

MikeW
The angle is 30 degrees, but who cares.... Keep working at it and you will be able to get them scary sharp soon !

nocams

[Fletcher]

I've always found the WW's to be quite simple to sharpen.  I use a 6 or 8 inch mill file and file two edges at the same time from heel to point, rotating the head with each file stroke, until the head is sharp.  Some pressure is OK initially, but very light pressure is needed to make them sharp.  I then finish it with a ceramic stick or fine diamond, again working two edges together, but now working more across the blades rather than heel to point.  Use light pressure here, too.  From new to done is just a few minutes and when done will shave hair easily, snag your thumbnail or pop the rubber band.  Yes, I have noticed that the blades aren't ground exactly straight, but it really doesn't seem to make a difference.  

I've hunted with WW's and have seen four deer shot with WW's I've sharpened like this; none made it more than 50 yds.

I normally hunt with an Ace Express 2-blade, but wouldn't hesitate to shoot a WW, either.

[TaterHill Archer]

I like the idea above about a jig to put them in.  I might have to come up with a jig to use with my belt sander.

[Terry Green]

Ron,

I don't use a jig....jut lay them two blade down at the same time...and rotate.  Set one aside when it gets too hot for you to handle and start another, and go back and start over till you get all the bevels the same.

[TaterHill Archer]

How big is the belt sander you're using?  I have a 1" I use for my knives but it runs vertically.

[cajunbowhntr]

After reading this I decided to try and sharpen some I had gotten in trade.I bought a new 12" Nicholson file.I clamped it down and used the method Charlie showed in the video.The sharpie on the edges is a must i can see why people can have problems.You have to watch the hand pressure on the head to get an even bevel.After that i held it in my hand and using the other side of the file alternated strokes from medium to just the weight of the file.Doing it this way just gave me more "feel" for the edge.I then used a steel to hone and they are shaving sharp.Not what I would call scared to handle sharp but no doubt they would kill  a deer.Gonna try some ultra fine sandpaper and see if I can polish the edge a bit.In all I had 4 heads sharp in about 45 min.i did not use a stone,just file and hone.


CB

[hill boy]

I went home and took a belt sander to my new ww broadhead and it took all the time consuming work out of getting it sharp.Just as terry said.Once I sanded it down in about 3 minuts. I hit on the file then diamond stone then leather went from 21 minuts a head to about 8 minuts.And yes it's very sharp.

[Roger Norris]

beltsander vs 6" file.

[[email protected]]

I can remember talking with Terry about sharpening Snuffers way before he started Trad Gang.  Fact is he sent me a WW that he sharpened; had a secret code (to me) that he had painted on the head. Terry remember the soap?

When I was getting my gear together for this years elk hunt I found that head in my gear box and its in number one position in my quiver.  So hopefully it will have an elk to show for itself !

I too have noticed that Snuffers seem to get a little sharper than WW.  At first I thought I was doing something just a little different but that didn't seem to be the answer.  

Now, I attributed that to the fact that while the angle (120 degrees) has to be the same, the distance between the blades is a little greater...therefore the  sharpening angle is less acute (severe) so it is actually sharper.

Yes, the problems with the blades being "wavey" is still with us...perhaps it has something to do with the heat applied during the welding process.  Still after all this time the problem should have been solved.

Seems to be  lots of different ways to get them sharp.  If you are not successful going heel to toe then try holding the head perpendicular to your stone.

Also they seem to really respond to stropping, just makes a huge difference in the final results.

Bob

[cajunbowhntr]

I see ya'll are using the flat belt sander what about using a bench grinder?


CB

[lt-m-grow]

I have the same complaints as many have stated above including the folks that think they are great.  They took alot of belt sanding to get the edges in the same plane.  I did three and quit.

So help me understand this.  I don't understand buying a product like a broadhead then having to machine the heck out of it to get it to a point where it should have been when I opened the pack.  It is ok if they aren't sharp, yet they should be ready to sharpen.   To me, that is a poor product and who trusts poor products when you need it most.

It is a little like buying a finished bow and then having to tiller it and then bragging how good the bow maker is.  Isn't it?

Any broadhead that is sharp will kill a deer (and most other things for that matter) and there are hundreds to choose from.  Why give a product a second thought if they aren't even produced right?

- Dave

[jojotater]

I borrowed a big file from the tool and die department at the plant where I work. I had to clean the grease off it. I used a sharpie on the edges of the broadhead. About 5 minutes each on the file, applying pressure  at different points on the broadhead until the ink was removed. My daughter had got me a little fishing hook stone for christmas. I ran the broadheads across that a couple of times. I then stropped them across my bluejeans a few time. They shave like a razor. I've never got a head sharper.

People must be getting bad batches of broadheads, because sharpening mine was too easy.

As far as the bad design of the angle--Like I said, mine are razor sharp.

After getting the heads straight on the adaptor, they shoot great.  

[Yolla Bolly]

So now a new question:  Long ago, an elderly acquaintance who worked as a machinest/tool maker etc.  told me that one should always "chalk a file"---I was too young and dumb to ask the questions that now arise in my mind.

What purpose does the chalk serve?  What kind of chalk?  Is it used in all kinds of filing situations or some specific instances?

[cajunbowhntr]

The chalk fills in the space between the teeth and prevents metal fillings fron building up in the file.They also make a file card which is a small wire brush to clean out the teeth.


CB