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Author Topic: D shaped longbow without hand shock?  (Read 777 times)

Offline RC

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Re: D shaped longbow without hand shock?
« Reply #40 on: August 27, 2013, 06:43:00 AM »
Northern Mist shelton is sweet shooting. i like`m all.RC

Offline LongStick64

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Re: D shaped longbow without hand shock?
« Reply #41 on: August 27, 2013, 07:49:00 AM »
Choose the right arrow and the "shock" will be how little you will notice the so called handshock that D bows are accused of having. I have a Shrew Hill, Northern Mist Classic, Robertson Vision, and Great Northern Critter Gitter, all have a D profile when at brace, neither has any hand shock that I notice.
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Offline Pete McMiller

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Re: D shaped longbow without hand shock?
« Reply #42 on: August 27, 2013, 07:57:00 AM »
Not all bows are made the same and some will thump the shooter more than others.  Even the same bow can really vibrate one shooter and not the next.  Try playing around with your string and see if an 8 strand string or extra/different silencers helps.  I had a HH Big Five that rattled my elbow something fierce - I hated to shoot it.  I switched the original Dacron string out to an 8 strand 8125 fast flight string and it was like shooting a different bow.  The whole vibration pattern changed drastically.  Adjusting your brace height/increasing arrow weight, etc. can also alter the vibration pattern.
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Offline DaveT1963

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Re: D shaped longbow without hand shock?
« Reply #43 on: August 27, 2013, 08:09:00 AM »
JD Berry Bows
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Offline BowHunterGA

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Re: D shaped longbow without hand shock?
« Reply #44 on: August 27, 2013, 10:11:00 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by LongStick64:
I think the problem when handling a Hill bow is to have a natural bow arm, any forced extension will result in a more felt shot. Try a natural bow arm. Raise your arm up to point at something in your line of sight, you don't hyper extend your arm.

As for Hill style bows, If you can find a Shultz Old Favorite, buy it. These bows tend to have some string follow due to the fact they do not have any glass backing. The string follow helps soften then shot. Another bow is a Shrew Hill, with it's tiny tips and wedge grip, there is hardly any felt shock.
X2

Also, be sure to "heel" the bow if it is a straight or dished grip and allow your elbow of your bow arm to break just slightly. In other words do not lock your elbow. I shoot Hill style bows almost exclusively and some are pretty heavy thumpers and I have never once noticed "hand shock" while shooting. (and I do own some R/D bows as well so it isn't like I have nothing to compare them to.  :)  )

Offline BowHunterGA

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Re: D shaped longbow without hand shock?
« Reply #45 on: August 27, 2013, 10:12:00 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Mudd:
I don't notice any hand shock with any of my "Hill style" bows.

God bless,Mudd
X3

Offline Daddy Bear

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Re: D shaped longbow without hand shock?
« Reply #46 on: August 27, 2013, 11:04:00 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Gregg S:
I like the looks of the Hill bows but my shoulder doesn't like the hand shock. Any suggestions on a 66" or 68" longbow that has the D shape when strung but is easier on your shoulder?
The D-shape of the particular longbow you speak is the cross-section of the limb, not profile of the bow when strung.  Normally these bows are built with either some limb backset, straight, or string follow.  Cannot speak for everyone, but myself, I like backset in a hunting bow that is a size shorter than a textbook ideal length, I like straight limbs in an all around bow that is at a textbook ideal length, and string follow in a target bow that is a size longer than a textbook ideal length.  The slightly longer bow with string follow tends to be more forgiving to me when trying to shoot most accurately.

As for handshock, I can easily take my most forgiving and sweetest shooting Hill bows and turn them into vibrating monsters by doing a combination of a few things.  The pivot point on the bow handle where the equal energy of the returning upper and lower limbs divide upon loosing an arrow, is at a lower point on the handle than some other high wrist bow designs.  I can raise the heel of my hand to effectively choke up on my grip above the pivot point so that the limbs do not return in time to create shock.  Add to this having the brace outside the sweetspot, and/or the arrows a tad on the light end, and you can turn a silk smooth bow into a tooth rattling beast.  It is easy to duplicate in a well built bow, so I'm of the opinion that much of the handshock debated is operator induced vs bad bow design.

Even with B50 string, the musical tone that may resonate from well tuned and properly shot Hill is most pleasant in the hand and to the ear.  If this is bothersome, one may need to pad their feet when walking across deep shag carpeting to prevent their footsteps from shaking loose a tooth  :)

If I may pass along some sage advice given to me years back by longbow archers far more experienced than I:

Use the heaviest bow you can shoot accurately with ease. In that context, it is very important that you fully engage the rhomboids between your shoulder blades to execute proper form. You hold with the rhomboids and not with your arms. In doing so, it is very important that you keep your bow shoulder down and back to prevent long term shoulder injuries. If the bow is of such weight that your shoulder is forced up and is compressed while at full draw, you are on the fast track towards impingement and long term injuries. An old rule of thumb when shooting Hill style with longbows is to measure at full draw the distance from the lateral center of your bow arm bicep directly across to under the arrow. Anything under 5" is a sign that the shoulder is collapsed and is not down and back into the socket.

Hope this is helpful.  As for recommendations, I just recently switched to a Hill "Wesely Special" built to my hunting specs.  Though not quite as fast as my old "Cheetah", this bow is on the upper end of the scale for being very smooth and forgiving.  It's a great feeling to have a light and lively bow draw and loose so smoothly.

Best  :)

Offline Vesty

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Re: D shaped longbow without hand shock?
« Reply #47 on: August 27, 2013, 11:06:00 AM »
Two Tracks Echo. Sting follow and sweet.

Offline joe ashton

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Re: D shaped longbow without hand shock?
« Reply #48 on: August 27, 2013, 11:12:00 AM »
take a look at Mohawks too...
Joe Ashton,D.C.
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Offline Orion

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Re: D shaped longbow without hand shock?
« Reply #49 on: August 27, 2013, 11:30:00 AM »
Lots of good observations and advice from Daddy Bear.  Until bows are 100% efficient, they will all impart hand shock. It's just the excess energy left in the limbs when the bow limbs snap back to brace.  It has to go somewhere, and it's dissipated by vibrating throughout the bow.  How much depends on bow design, riser and limb weight, string material, arrow weight, tune, etc. And, how much of that shock is felt also varies from person to person.  What some consider a soft push, others consider a teeth rattler.

With straight, or moderately set back limbs, I've found that limb mass is a pretty big factor in imparting hand shock.  Keeping the bow a little shorter (say 66 inches instead of 68 inches) and constructing the limbs with bamboo laminations rather than various woods, both help to cut down on overall limb mass and reduce felt hand shock. A fast flite string and relatively heavy arrows are two other ways to substantially reduce hand shock. Lots of other contributing factors, as others have mentioned, but it's worth keeping in mind when you select your next bow.  Good luck.

Offline Mojostick

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Re: D shaped longbow without hand shock?
« Reply #50 on: August 27, 2013, 11:56:00 AM »
The Toelke D is a great bow.

As far as the shock, before my surgery, any shock radiated across my shoulders and neck. It was quite unpleasant. Any pain may be a red flag you may want to heed, before you end up wearing one of these-LOL

 

Offline awbowman

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Re: D shaped longbow without hand shock?
« Reply #51 on: August 27, 2013, 12:09:00 PM »
Mojo, if you had that much hand shock with a Super D you were not gripping the bow correctly.  Too many great reports on Dan's bows.  I also have one and I can shoot mine (and have shot mine) literally hundreds of times in a given day with no discomfort.
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Offline Mojostick

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Re: D shaped longbow without hand shock?
« Reply #52 on: August 27, 2013, 12:13:00 PM »
I wasn't talking about the Super D. I suggest the Super D.

Offline awbowman

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Re: D shaped longbow without hand shock?
« Reply #53 on: August 27, 2013, 12:19:00 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Mojostick:
I wasn't talking about the Super D. I suggest the Super D.
OOPS sorry Mojo.
62" Super D, 47#s @ 25-1/2"
58" TS Mag, 53#s @ 26"
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Offline Mojostick

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Re: D shaped longbow without hand shock?
« Reply #54 on: August 27, 2013, 12:21:00 PM »
No biggie.   :)  

If you want to rattle some teeth, try a Martin Stick.   :scared:    ;)

Offline awbowman

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Re: D shaped longbow without hand shock?
« Reply #55 on: August 27, 2013, 12:22:00 PM »
Maybe some of the bowyers can chime in about the hand shock as Orion did.  I agree with what Orion said in that it is excess energy, but I am wondering if it's more a tillering problem with UNEQUAL energy in the limbs.  Kind of like a wheelie bow that's out of tune.
62" Super D, 47#s @ 25-1/2"
58" TS Mag, 53#s @ 26"
56" Bighorn, 46#s @ 26.5"

Offline Orion

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Re: D shaped longbow without hand shock?
« Reply #56 on: August 27, 2013, 04:27:00 PM »
Out of tiller will certainly exacerbate hand shock.

Offline mahantango

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Re: D shaped longbow without hand shock?
« Reply #57 on: August 27, 2013, 05:26:00 PM »
Just to throw another one out there, I see you are from Hazleton. Jim Martin, Mahantango Custom Bows down in Mt. Pleasant Mills makes a mild D/R 66" or 68" that is hands down the best longbow I have ever shot. My second choice would probably be the Northern Mist Classic but the Mahantango is much quicker. Also, as others have said, percieved handshock can very well be a function of shooting form.
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Offline Mike Taylor2

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Re: D shaped longbow without hand shock?
« Reply #58 on: August 28, 2013, 06:40:00 PM »
Give the String Follow "Carolina Night" a try from 7 Lakes Longbow.  He's a sponser on this site and builds a nice, quiet bow.  Very little If any hand shock.

Offline Sam McMichael

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Re: D shaped longbow without hand shock?
« Reply #59 on: August 28, 2013, 09:41:00 PM »
I am another Hill shooter who believes that the way you hold the bow is a major factor in feeling hand shock. You hold a Hill style longbow with a firm, very solid grip on the heel of your hand, and I hold a slight bend in my bow arm. Whenever I feel shock, I find my grip to me out of kilter more than any other problem.
Sam

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