Heavy points (please explain)

[acollins]

I have been reading a lot of post about arrow selection. Many of them say cut to a certain length and then add anywhere from 125 to over a 300 grains up front.  My question is this. Is the really heavy weight suggested for penetration, or for tuning.

[ChuckC]

Both.  There will be a bunch of replies about this.

ChuckC

[dhermon85]

I went with 175 point and 50 gn insert for tuning purposes but the penetration would just be a bonus.

[Jerry Jeffer]

I am shooting AD Hammer Heads which are a pretty serious arrow. The regular Hammer Heads are spined for a wide range and I am at the lower end of that. So, I use a 100gr brass insert with 250+gr head. This makes the spine more favorable for my bow and makes a nice fist full of punch up front. Total arrow weight is roughly 760gr.

[mmgrode]

Both.  Take a look at Ed Ashbys broadhead studies on this site for the advantageous application of high FOC(heavy tip weight compared to overall arrow weight) to increase penetration.  

Varying point weight can also be used to tune your arrows to your bow. However, this all depends on the particulars of your setup. Adding point weight to an arrow willy-nilly could help or adversely effect your tuning. Just depends...

Cheers, Matt

[katman]

Originally posted by ChuckC:
Both.  There will be a bunch of replies about this.

ChuckC

x2

[Terry Lightle]

x3

[maineac]

Lots of folks have differnt opinions for sure.  I try to work my tuning so my arrow ends up around 10 grains per pound of draw weight, or a little over.  With light carbons I find that heavy tips help bring up the arrow weight.  Dr. Asby's reports found mass to be be a big factor in penetration.  Heavy Front of Center helped a lot on lighter arrows.  I figure it works out great if I can get the arrow weight I want and high FOC.

[njloco]

I just weighed my arrows for the first time, 28" GT 1535, 50 gr. brass insert, 125gr tip, gives me around 14 gr. per inch, 54# bow, that should be enough, I hope.

P.S. Very, very accurate.

[BWD]

Originally posted by njloco:
I just weighed my arrows for the first time, 28" GT 1535, 50 gr. brass insert, 125gr tip, gives me around 14 gr. per inch, 54# bow, that should be enough, I hope.

P.S. Very, very accurate.

Are you sure? If so I musta got a couple of lite batches of GT 15/35s. Mine measure 28 1/8" von to front of 50gr. brass insert. With a 125gr. point, they weigh 427-430gr, which would be approx. 7.9gpp., from a 54# bow...I think.

i was gonna say -THAT DONT COMPUTE!  

[njloco]

Well, this is how I did it, lets take your example, 28.125" divided into 427gr.= 15.18gr per inch., unless my math is wrong and that won't be the first time I have been told that ?

[BWD]

Originally posted by njloco:
Well, this is how I did it, lets take your example, 28.125" divided into 427gr.= 15.18gr per inch., unless my math is wrong and that won't be the first time I have been told that ?

I was wrong.You were stating gpi and I was talking in terms of gpp.

[Prairie Drifter]

gpp(grains per pound) is more important than gpi(grains per inch) in a finished arrow. I like at least 10 grains per pound. 50lb bow, 500grain arrow minimum

[Roughrider]

I like a heavy head for the penetration advantage, and pick a stiff enough shaft to accommodate the heavier point weight.  A heavy head, providing the arrow is stiff enough, helps stabilize the arrow and leads to good arrow flight, and, since momentum is a vector force, meaning it "pushes in the direction it is headed", the lighter shaft tends to follow where the heavy head is going, and the force of the arrow is concentrated in the direct the head is travelling - imagine throwing a hammer.

[Benjy]

Aaron, Carbon arrows are so light that it takes the heavier points to get over 8 GPP (Grains Per Pound). 8 GPP is usually the lowest weight of arrow that most Bow manufactures recommend for warranty purposes.

So if you were shooting 50lbs you would need a 500 grain arrow.

A beman 500 would probably shoot but you would be around 375 grains.(Arrow @ 29"= 200 grains, Feathers, nock and aluminum insert around 50 grains and 125 grain point)  7.5 grains per pound

You could easily go to a beman 400 and add a 50 grain brass insert and a 175 grain point and end up with a 485 grain arrow.(arrow @ 29" =235 grains, Feathers and nock 25 grains)  9.7 grains per pound.

If you really wanted to up it some more you could go with a beman 340, 100 grain brass insert and a 200 grain point, that would put your arrow around 600 grains.  12 grains per pound.

 ***ALL OF THESE NUMBERS ARE GENERAL***

This is my experiance, you would need to test different point weight and arrow length to make sure the arrows would tune to "YOUR" bow

Benjy

[creekwood]

Originally posted by Benjy:
A beman 500 would probably shoot but you would be around 375 grains.(Arrow @ 29"= 200 grains, Feathers, nock and aluminum insert around 50 grains and 125 grain point)  7.5 grains per pound
Benjy

Benjy,  UNLESS that Beman 500 is a MFX Classic which weighs 9.7 gpi. So, a 29 inch arrow X 9.7 gpi =281 grains + 75 grain brass insert (supplied with the MFX) + 150 grain field tip would give a minimum total of 530 grains including nock and fletches which would be about perfect for his 50 pounds of draw weight.  The unfortunate part of the above stated equation is that Beman has discontinued the MFX arrow.  They can still be purchased from dealers with existing stock for a while if you can find them.

[Over&Under]

Originally posted by maineac:
Lots of folks have differnt opinions for sure.  I try to work my tuning so my arrow ends up around 10 grains per pound of draw weight, or a little over.  With light carbons I find that heavy tips help bring up the arrow weight.  Dr. Asby's reports found mass to be be a big factor in penetration.  Heavy Front of Center helped a lot on lighter arrows.  I figure it works out great if I can get the arrow weight I want and high FOC.

Hit the nail on the head right there!

[Benjy]

Jake, I was not trying to pick an arrow for Arron, just show why we load the front to get the weight up so they are safe for our bows.

I was using the numbers for the Beman ICS Bowhunter's. the 500's are 7.3 per inch and the 400 are 8.1 per inch and I just rounded them off.

My Disclaimer again:    

***ALL OF THESE NUMBERS ARE GENERAL***

This is my experiance, you would need to test different point weight and arrow length to make sure the arrows would tune to "YOUR" bow

[Deeter]

Can't we all just get along?  Bahaha You all are very knowledgable aboout this stuff.  I am new to trad archery but I have learned alot from every one on here in the last month or so.  You guys are awesome.  I have a Beman Centershot 500 with a 75 grain brass insert with 125 grain tips.  I seem to be able to hit what I am shootin at.