Hey Experts out there - does a bow quiver suck power?

[suttoman]

I am just setting up this new Pittsley 'Impact' that arrived last week.  I have a thread up here at the moment with pic's if you care to take a peek.

It is very fast (faster than my Predator I used to have), but a tad noisy.  As usual, I detest anything hanging off my string.

I put my Thunderhorn bow quiver on it, and man it made it very quiet.  It is one of those that just slides very the limbs (down around the wedges), and grips on by means of a tight elastic strap.

For all of you experts in the States (who know a whole lot more about this than me) - does the quietness mean that it is sucking valued fps from my arrows?

I can't notice any difference, but wondering if it is making it so quiet it may be.  I have it pushed way down toward the riser as far as it can go.  It certainly does not seem to be near the working part of the limb.

I notice on the dealer's website (it is in Canberra Australia), that he has a proper Pittsley quiver that screws into two threaded stubs on my bow.   Would I be better off with that one?

Thanks in advance

Sutto

[macbow]

If the speed is that important to you then the only way to know would be to test thru a chrono both ways.
I think a quiet bow is worth many fps.

On the other quiver matter of preference.

[LittleBen]

I can't say for sure if your quiver slows your arrow. You'd have to chronograph it as macbow said.

I do know this though. Sound is a product of vibration. Vibration requires energy input. Therefore if your bow makes noise, it is vibrating (or the string), and either way that energy is comeing from teh energy stored during teh draw cycle. The more energy that goes to vibration, the less that goes to the arrow.

Actually, the vibration fo a string or limbs, should be mathematically very similar to the stretch of a dacron string vs. fast flight. The only difference is the stretch of the dacron is damped very quickly (doesn't oscillate like a string vibrating back and forth liek a guitar string).

I don't know if that helped or made things worse.

My advice is don't worry about it, if the bow is quiet, seems sufficiently fast, and shoots well, call it a win.

[LittleBen]

I should add to what I said above, just becauseyou add a quiver and the bow doesn't vibrate and make noise, doesn't mean you're losing less energy, instead the vibration is just being damped so you dont hear it as much; that meaning it is absorbed by a material and turned into a tiny, tiny amount of heat. Leather for example or rubber, would damp vibration substantially.

[Jeff Strubberg]

Quiet means more efficient, not less.  Think about it...energy is required to make a substance vibrate and put off noise.

I doubt your quiver is having any measurable effect on your arrow speed.  I have seen a few that cause enough of a cant change to introduce some form issues and slow things down a hair, but that's not really the quiver as much as it is the shooter.

[2fletch]

Now you have opened a can of worms. There are lots of bow quivers available of different types, sizes, weights, and different fastening systems. Since we make more different variations than anyone else, I have done some testing of some quivers but not all of them. There is no reason that a correctly installed lightweight quiver should change how the bow shoots regarding accuracy or fps. I have seen some heavier bow quivers causing a bow to shoot to the left of where the bow shoots without the quiver. This would require practicing with the quiver on the bow and tuning the bow to allow for the change. The shooter's form and follow through probably has an effect also, as well as the type of bow he's shooting.

As for slowing the bow down, I don't think so. At least not in the testing that I did. The only thing that I can see that would affect the arrow speed would be a limb wrap system that was incorrectly installed on the limbs instead of at the fadeouts.

[kbetts]

I have a 66# Predator that had a twang.  Put something on the string first of all......regardless if you like the looks or not.....it helps a lot.  With the lower brace height, you may need to really increase your arrow weight.  I went up to about 700 grains total before I was satisfied.

You have an absolute flame thrower of a bow.....don't concern yourself too much with "speed".  Needless worry IMO.

[Orion]

Long story short, the answer to your question is no.  A bow quiver, if properly mounted, will not sap performance from your bow.  The added mass it adds to the riser area aids in dampening the limb vibrations at/after the shot.  That's why it's quieter. Has no effect on speed.

[Tim Finley]

I chronographed a longbow over the weekend with and wothout the same quiver you have and it made no difference in speed ...Tim

[suttoman]

Hey Tim - thanks so much for that.  That pretty well much answers my question (well not my bow exactly, but generally).  I don't see any chrono's here in Australia - or at least with the folks I hang with.   Pretty hard for me to find one, so you have been a good help.

Yes that bow is a real flame-thrower, I love it so much.   Problem is, because it is such a new model, I can't find out anything about it.  Nothing on Hunter's Niche, nothing on here - it is like I am the only person with one - yikes!

Sutto

[Bladepeek]

I personally don't like the feel of bow quivers - tried several (all strap-on or slide-on; have not tried bolt-on's) and just like the feel of a bare bow better.

Having said that, if the quiver attaches to the riser before the fades end, I don't see how it could have much effect on limb speed and Tim's testing pretty well bears that out. If it helps dampen riser vibration (which is pretty much after the shot anyway) seems like a win-win deal to me.

[rraming]

I have never seen a Predator without the holes for a side quiver, I use those - I would not slide one over my limbs, I'm sure performance loss would be the result. There is no loss using the side mount holes.

[Terry Green]

NO....not if put on correctly...in the fade outs.  The fade out have NOTHING to do with the working limbs.

I've tested it....no difference at ALL.

Outside the fade out can cause all sorts of problems.....I had one slip up once in TX...luckily I was shooting at a target and caught the change and fixed it.  That's the only time I've had one slip and cause problems.  I guess I didn't have it tight enough.

T

[Kris]

No.  Not as long it is not acting on the working part of the limb.  Same as above, et al.  Static riser is static riser...think of the fade-outs as part of that.  Working limbs propel the arrow forward, not the none moving parts of the bow.

No worries.

Kris

[LCH]

I have chronoed all my Hummingbird longbows with and without the EFA quivers I use and there is no different in speed. LCH

[suttoman]

Thanks Kris, Mr Green (you tested it)- it kind of makes sense that way doesn't it?  I mean if you think about it from a physics point of view, it really should make no difference.

rraming - yes my new model Predator has the threads inserted in my bow.  However, the quivers for that are nearly $100 in Australia.  I live thousands of kilometers in the desert -  from the bow dealer in Canberra.  It is a big deal for me to get one sent here, so just thought I would try my Thunderhorn slide on quiver.  It seems to work a treat, looks great and really quietens my bow down.  

Sutto

[sagebrush]

It won't change the performance but it may change the feel of the bow. It can cause problems with where the arrow hits with and without the quiver. On some bows no difference on others a lot of difference. I like the feel of shooting the bow without a quiver but it is handy to have the arrows right there. Gary

[daniel boon]

Sutto, With or without no difference in performance on my bows. Can't say about yours, but you can send it to me, and I'll gladly put it through the chrono, just to be safe    
 Cheers Dan

[LittleBen]

Phil, I looked up Kalgoorlie and man that is really out there. Suprised though that theres no dealer in Perth.

[Brock]

No, if mounted correctly in the fadeouts or down onto riser it will have no affect on the efficiency of your bow.  The increase in weight has a more stabilizing affect during the shot due to increased felt mass in bow hand....but no difference otherwise.

Even the Selway style that slid over your limbs down to mounting location would not impact...IF, big IF....they were mounted low enough down on the limb to be in the non-working portion of limb.