HH BUG GOT ME - Part Two!

[evgb127]

Still waiting on those updates Donovan! Of all the forward handle bows I’ve owned, the Northstar is my favorite.

Anyway, are any Hill shooters going to Baltimore next week?  I’ll be shooting on Friday if anyone wants to meet up. 

[Rhstickbow]

Hi guys, I’m curious if any of you shoot a HH straight handle grip bow three under? I have shot both split finger and three under and at this time seem to be migrating more to three under. I’m looking for an HHbow shooter that shoots three under that can give me some guidance. Thanks

[Orion]

I switched to 3 under a year or so ago and shoot my ASLs that way as well.  I don't do anything differently.  Kept the same anchor point, middle finger in the corner of the mouth, which changes the sight picture/orientation of the arrow a bit.  I don't do a swing draw.  Might be a bit harder to control the arrow 3-under with that type of draw.

[Rhstickbow]

Hi Orion, I have a Wesley from HH Bow Company, and because I have been shooting my Black Widow three under I asked Craig to tiller for three under. The tiller difference is only 1/32.
 MY Wesley is 68” backset 50lbs. @28. I draw 29”. I use a double tie on string nock set. Where do you typically set your string nock off the shelf? The top nock?  I’m thinking that it will be between 5/8” and 3/4”. For three under. Am I wrong?Also where do you set your brace height? Currently I have brace height at 6 5/8” Is that as critical? I’m shooting wood arrows with 145g tips weighing about 530g total weight. I have been shooting split finger for about a month, but My arrow flight is not consistent. I’m going back to three under.
Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks

[Orion]

Tiller doesn't make a whole lot of difference in my opinion.  Generally a 3-under tiller just weakens the lower limb a little so the tiller is even.  One can achieve the same dynamic tiller with nock point placement.  I set my nock about 9/16-inch above the shelf and nock under.  That's with skinny arrows.  Woodies are thicker so I think 5/8 inches is a good place to start for woodies. I raise mine to that when I switch to woodies.  I set my brace at 6 1/4 on a 68-inch ASL.  They tend to do better with a lower brace height, though a 6 5/8 brace height will probably work OK.  Good luck.  Let us know how it turns out.  Or post if you have more questions. 

[Rhstickbow]

I did what you suggested and noticed an improvement on arrow flight. Arrows are flying straighter, with better cast. That being said, I still have a problem......My arrows are hitting consistently about 10 or so inches to the left of where I’m aiming at 20 yards or so.  I am wondering if I am introducing torque or if the arrow is not right. I shoot cedar 11/32”, back 10” tapered, 60/65 spine, 145 points, 5 1/2” parabolic feathers, total weight 530 grains, 30inch back of point. Any suggestions?

[Rhstickbow]

I wii continue to try to dial in shooting with my Hill bow. Iam curious how often you guys change gloves, and how much you feel a worn glove will impact your shooting? I read recently that Howard Hill felt like a glove with a permanent crease from the string was not desirable, and I believe the glove the HH Archery sells has reinforcement to resist creasing. I saw a You Tube video with Jeff Kavanau (sorry if I misspelled his name ) and his glove looked pretty worn from what I could see. For me breaking in a new glove takes some time.  It seems to me that now that my glove is as creased as it will get, my shooting seems to compensate and be somewhat consistent with that glove. I wonder how concerned I should be above glove maintenance?

[Orion]

If you're a right hand shooter and the arrows are impacting left, it indicates spine that's too stiff.  Though 60-65 with 145 grain heads looks like it should work on paper, the proof is in the shooting.  Might you have some lighter spine shafts or heavier points you could try, like 175 and 200 grains?

Of course, form problems could also lead to a left impact.  Plucking will usually send the arrow careening to the left.  If your glove is creased and not releasing the string cleanly, that could lead to erratic arrow flight. 

Too, if you've never shot a bow cut proud of center before, you may just be holding the bow/arrow off target. Before you release, look down your arrow to see if it's pointing at the bullseye?  If not, you just need to adjust your hold. 

[Rhstickbow]

I am a right handed shooter. Most of the bows I am used to are cut closer to center. This is the first bow with the shelf cut shallow. I do enjoy this Hill bow and want to learn to shoot it as well as I can.
I have a question if the problem of right impact arrows is mostly due to the arrow being too stiff, then as you say, on these 60/65 arrows a heavier point will move the arrow more towards the right. If you increase point weight it should balance the arrow flight better? I will have time on Monday to swap  out some points and give it a try. I tried 160 and it helped. I also have 190g points and will try those as well. I ordered some 55/60 arrows that should be here on Saturday. If the 60/65 arrow with a 165 g point is shooting less left than the 125g, maybe these 55/60 arrows with a 125g point is what this bow may like. The good thing is when you finally find the arrows the bow in your hand likes then the joy of shooting makes all the trial and error worth it. Thanks again for your help.

[Rhstickbow]

Sorry I meant left impact arrows.....

[evgb127]

What Orion said is spot on. Left impact could be the arrow spine but don’t rule out form issues, especially if you’ve only recently switched to Hill bows. 

As for your glove question, a crease in the finger stalls of your glove causes your fingertips to wrap around the string and point back toward your face more. Howard Hill said that if your fingertips lay flat across the string, instead of back towards your face, you will have a smoother release.  Hence the idea behind the stiff finger stalls on a Hill-style glove. 

Howard Hill Archery makes a good “deluxe” glove with reinforced finger stalls. Another great glove, which I believe was developed by the Schulz family, is the American Leathers Crossover and the Kangaroo Krossover.  I like that glove better because the finger stalls don’t move around as much but it still has reinforced tips.
If you take care of your glove, it should last a long while.

[Rhstickbow]

Thanks EVG, and I agree that form is a critical part of the mix. I have an archery bag in my garage and will practice “blank bail” shooting more than shooting at my 3D target. I can tell for sure when my practice had been light or I’ve missed a couple of weeks due to my schedule. I will work on my form more and see if that helps as well. Thanks for your suggestion.
I appreciate you giving me the names of good glove manufacturers, and I will check them out. I typically have been using the Black Widow glove that is reinforced, I think with Cordovan. It is the best I have found so far, but it sounds like the Kangaroo Krossover may be better with the plastic stiffeners.
Is there anything you do to your gloves for maintenance? Do you treat with some type of conditioner?

[evgb127]

I like to put Obenauf’s heavy duty LP leather conditioner on all my leather goods. 

[evgb127]

It’s funny that you mention tempo because I started using a metronome to my practice routine. 4/4 time following the routine shown in Hittin Em Like Howard Hill.  It’s great for blank bale practice.

[Overspined]

Rhstickbow you may want to be sure the arrow nock is under your eye too, and your grip is true. Once alignment is correct, then play with arrow spine and tip weights and see how they change. I will say I’ve had the worst luck with carbons and hill style bows. Wood and aluminum are easy peasy to tune right in. When I get close, I fine tune with practice broadheads.  Just my thing. I’d keep the brace where you have it. Keep it over 6.5”. I like 6.75” ish, there’s no reason to go too low and get erratic flight, in order to try and gain 2 FPS. Have someone watch from behind you and see where and if the arrows are kicking if you’re not able to determine it.

[elkhunter45]

After suffering through both of the HH threads for years I finally built myself an ASL this month. It is quicker than I expected and I really like it. Green back, white belly, action boo cores, and a walnut riser. I haven't scaled it yet, but its mid  to upper 40's by feel. It has green glass tip wedges and is 68".

[Michael Guran]

That’s a great looking bow Elkhunter!

[elkhunter45]

That’s a great looking bow Elkhunter!

Thanks, Michael. I'm pleased with how it turned out. It's the first laminated glass bow that I have built in 20 years. I built several mild R/D style longbows in the 90's, but got busy with other things. It was almost an obsession when I started working on this one. LOL

[mike g]

    Nice Bow 
When I ordered my last Bow from Craig, I wanted the white and Green Glass, But at the time he did not have the Green....
    So I wound up with a very nice Tembo.
 

[elkhunter45]

    Nice Bow 
When I ordered my last Bow from Craig, I wanted the white and Green Glass, But at the time he did not have the Green....
    So I wound up with a very nice Tembo.
 

Yes sir!. This is my interpretation of a green and white Tembo, I used 3 tapered lams as my core. I have a .030 parallel on the belly lam only as a support for my fadeout. I think this color combo of green and white is my all time favorite color combo.