HH BUG GOT ME - Part Two!

[Jacquesbonin]

Well Gang, here is the skinny on the diameter of wood arrows. A 23/64th's shaft that spines 55 and flyes great out of your bow, when you reduce the diameter to 11/32nd's the shaft's spine woud have to be increased by the percentage you reduce then diameter, in this case roughly 6 to 7 pounds to get the same arrow alignment as you were getting with the 23/64th's shaft. Now when reducing the diameter to 5/16th's shaft the poundage would have to increase 10 to 12 pounds. There is an inherent problem with shooting the smaller diameter shafts, they weigh less, you will see increased,handshock or bump! Good luck Gang! Jacques

[katman]

But pavan , got to have my fix man. I need it bad.

[Rossco7002]

Dave Miller's wait time depends on the bow. 8 -12 weeks for an Old Tom (which is very similar to Schulz's glassed bows and a fine shooter) the others are all 1 year.

I've got an Old Tom due sometime over the Christmas / New Year period. It'll be my second one and also my third Miller with the other being an Expedition. I love them!

I also have a brown glass Schulz which is a phenomenal shooter and did have one of his all bamboo Granpa.

Jacques I have some 11/32 tapered cedars that are real heavy for the spine, bare shaft weight 470 grains. I wish I could get more. The Legend get there yet?

[cahaba]

I have a Northern Mist Shelton that is a very good shooter.

[far rider]

Thanks guys,
I see some really good starting points here.
Form first.
Draw second.
Bow tune third.
Arrow tune forth.

I think I'll grab some field points in the same weight as the broadheads and put them on the heavier spined 23/64s and try those after my form settles down. Been raining for three days here, and I'll be out of town for the next three days (darn work)but I'll get on it ASAP. One thing for sure, I'm going to require a LARGE backstop. I will try to talk my son into videoing me as I presently shoot...with some marked arrows. Then I'll I'll post a link and wait for the constructive critiques.

I also spoke with a few other guys about it, and they're saying the same thing, and I may shorten my bow to a 66 or 67" and get away from the 68 and 70" bows I shoot now.

As always, thanks for the info, and standby for more questions.

Tim

[Blaino]

If you don't want to let those 68-70" bows get dusty I know a guy south of you that likes long longbows.  

[Kelly]

Longer bows create smoothness of draw-smoothness of draw creates longer true draw length-longer true draw length creates better form-better form creates better accuracy.

That said, the above is all relative to each individual archer/bow combination.

[Brianlocal3]

Originally posted by Rossco7002:
I had observed the same thing myself Dave! Lol. I think we're lucky to have so many Hill style bowyers to choose from and when one of them hits critical mass it can seem like they're springing up everywhere.

For me, Dave Miller is The Man and I love a nice, gently used Schulz - no doubt. Having said that, JD Berry's bows look like they embody a number of the characteristics that I like to see in a Hill bow: tiny limb tips, narrow / deep limb cross-section, short riser with a deep grip and gentle dish. I can see the appeal.


If anyone has shot both a Berry and a Miller bow I'd be very interested to hear a comparison....

Rossco,
Having owned an old Tom and multiple Berrys I can say this much...when you get to the top of the game, and make no mistake they are both at the top alot of it then becomes personal preference of the shooter. For me personally, as is obvious , ill take a Berry over any other bow. Reason being is the level of refinement I find in James work and the little details. Shooting wise I feel the Berrys are gentler and seem to perform better pound for pound BUT again it boils down to fit for the shooter.

James limbs are comming in right at 1" at the fades ns 3/8-7/16" at the tips, I love the swoops and that beautiful trap on the belly.  There is also not a straight line in James work, everything has a nice classy curve to it.

I liked my old tom alot, nothing I could complain about , it just did not steal my heart and should like my Berrys.

If you where to look hard at your Millers , there would be something that just "JUMPS" out at you that is just breathtaking or the way it sits in your hand. Something about Millers work has entranced you. And it's an amazing feeling when you pick up a bow that speaks to you

[R.V.T.B.]

Far Rider, I shoot almost the same set up as you do.  My Hills are 68" long and are 55-59 pounds at my 29 inch draw.  I shoot 30.5 inch Surewood Douglas Fir shafts spined 65-70 with 160 grain points up front.  My arows come in at 590-630 grains finished, depending on what set I pick up. My Hills are quiet and tame with these arrows and they fly like a laser.  Not a wiggle. Shooting that bow weight and arrow weight, I rarely leave an arrow in a deer.

[Rossco7002]

Thanks for the insight Brian - I didn't realize you'd had an Old Tom in the past. Can I ask, was it made for you or a second hand bow? This is an area that I feel is key when shooting a bow from one of our top Hill style bowyers in that they are able to set that bow up perfectly for THAT shooter. It's certainly something I've enjoyed about Dave's work....

Although there are some distinctly different styling elements between a Berry bow and a Schulz or Miller there are also some very striking similarities in regards to the physical design of the bow. This really intrigues me and makes me think I'd get along well with JD's bows where I ever to try one....

[Brianlocal3]

Rossco,
The old tom was second hand. It was 53@27 and 68". The grip was a great size. And the bow shot great too. I Agee about the custom aspect. I feel it does make a difference too.x

[Ric O'Shay]

I too had a Miller bow. Kept it for about a year and sold it because it sat on the rack and collected dust. Great bow, just shot others more. The Berrys reached in, grabbed my heart strings and tugged on them. So, I bought one and ordered another. Can't wait for the Morning Star to arrive.

[Mudd]

I had Mr Miller build me an "Old Tom".

I liked the bow but it went to a friend who I thought at the time, needed it. (long story)

I used to think that someday I might order another but I never have... too busy shooting my JD Berry bows.

God bless,Mudd

Here is a question. I have a 55 or so lefty Morningstar on order. I have about 100 1918 shafts and arrows. I shoot them out of my favorite righty yew/bamboo 57@26 with either 145 target points or long adapter with 160 field points or broadheads, 27" bop. i get the same results with 51 pound righty Robertson. They both fly good. Out of a lefty Robertson that is 51 at 26" the broadheads are perfect, the target points need a few yards. The same arrow at 28" with a target point flies identical to the 27" the arrow with the long adapter plus 160 broadhead. All of these bows are cut 1/8" out from center. I have done various things like turn the cock feather in, rotated nocks, checked my draw over and over. I do not understand why I have more spine tolerance right handed than left with nearly identical bows. I want to shoot those 1918s out of my new Morningstar.

[Blaino]

pavan- i bet you get a cleaner release right handed.

[two4hooking]

Originally posted by David Mitchell:
Hmmmm, seems that this thread has seen several bowyers become the bowyer du jour for a while.  Now James is sure getting lots of press.  Howard Hill was getting lots of action for a while, then it was Dave Johnson, now nobody mentions Dave then Sunset Hills ran hot for a bit.  Does this thing run in cycles? Anybody want to guess who'll be the next hot hand on here?      :confused:  

There will always be another.....it seems this thread has degenated a bit to "Bow of the week" or "check out my new bow" and very little anymore of substance in the act of shooting or hunting.  Heck hunting season is still in and the only thing everyone is talking about is the bow I have on order....

The one problem that I have with all of this is that it is difficult to come up with a field point with a 19 diameter. The glue on field points are wider than the shaft, my targets hate that and I hate shooting arrows longer than 27" bop. I much prefered my wood thing of shooting target arrows and blunts net length with 5 pounds less spine than my broadhead wood arrows. However, the 1918s have good weight, fly straight through deer and were really cheap. I wish there was a 19 diameter field point that was as heavy as my broadheads.

two hook, Heck it took me four years to make up my mind on a new bow. The first time I ask a hard question about an arrow selection problem and I get jumped on for that. I will just not come here any more if that is the case. Goodbye.

[Brianlocal3]

Pavan,
I don't think it was geared directly at you.  It's the fact that this the thread has went away from Hill style for a bit. It happens every year this time, spring the style talks resume