Hickory Stave Pithy

[hickry]

Well, I'm not sure I have this picture thing figured out... maybe this will work.  I cut a hickory a couple of weeks ago, and had it quarter sawn.  I'm pretty new to all of this and have a question for the self-bowyers out there.  Please take a look at the cross-section of this stave.  I pulled the bark back and intended to use the outside as the back of my bow(s), but it looks like that there's a lot of "pithy"-ness it the outer section.  Also, even the rings toward the center look pretty thin.  Can anyone give me any feedback on whether this may make a bow?  Should I back it?  Any help would GREATLY be appreciated.
Thanks
Alek
 
 

[Osagetree]

Never used hickory,,, now I'm kinda glad. That is "pithy"!

Don't get discouraged though,, someone else will chime in. It might be okay?

[KILLER B]

I have some nice hickory that has no pith in it what so ever. Also the very first self bow I had made was from hickory with no pith. You might just have a bad tree for whatever reasons. I would try it though and back it with bamboo. Worst case scenario is it breaks.

[arrowslinger22]

I've never seen Hickory like that, but I'd find another piece of wood before spending alot of time on that one.  The rings are not all that thin for Hickory, but the early wood looks pretty scary.  Backing wouldn't help much if the stave is inherently flawed.

[hickry]

thanks, guys, for all the input.  i really appreciate a forum where so much knowledge on this stuff exists.  after looking at this stave, and some others, i may shave it down towards the center... the earlywood is not nearly as bad there.  make it wide, and back it... just to see if it'll make a bow.  in the meantime, i'm going to be looking for another tree!
thanks again,
alek

[Sal]

There is nothing wrong with that stave, hickory doesn't look like osage.  You don't need to back it, just make the bow.  I have worked with hickory, it'll be fine.  That's not pith, by the way, the hickory is just ringporous like that.  It looks like pecan, which is more ringporous than true hickories.

[Pat B]

I've never seen hickory with tiny holes in it like that. Before I put too much time in it I would do a test piece to be sure it will hold up. Those rings are thick compared to what I have cut locally. I don't believe ring thickness(or thinness) is a problem with hickory.   Pat

[hickry]

Wow!  Information overload!  Thanks guys!  I've read in TBB about doing a test piece 6-12" long (mini bow).  Have any of you tried this?  Do you make it to scale of a larger bow to test "set", or are you just bending to check brittleness?  I've got a LOT of this wood to test with...

[hickry]

On second thought... I don't think it would be an easy thing to check set on a "scaled down" bow... I guess this is more of a brittleness test?

[hickry]

I e-mailed my forester brother the pic's and asked about the "pecan" and "ring-porous".  I don't know if it'll help anyone out, but i got the following response from him:
"ring-porous" is a term used define the arrangement of the vessels or "pores" in hardwood trees.  In a ring porous species the vessels formed in the early wood and late wood are clearly two different sizes, one forms large vessels and the other small. In a diffuse porous species (most hardwoods are diffuse)  the vessels formed in the early wood and late wood are all essentially the same size.  As the wood changes from sapwood to heartwood a growth of cells called tyloses kind of plugs up the vessels. This occurs differently or not at all depending on the species. I believe hickory commonly has tyloses. I think this is why you will see the newer pores seem to be open while the older ones appear to be plugged.  I am not really sure how this affects the quality of the wood for bow-making but I can do a little research. Also, I can't tell from the picture if yours is ring-porous or diffuse porous but I would guess that it is diffuse porous. I don't think you got a bad tree, just a representative tree for our area. Also, I verified that it is a Mockernut Hickory. I think he is correct in that most of our hickories (Water, bitternut, black, and mockernut) are "pecan hickories"

[KILLER B]

As far as testing it goes there are some very detailed instructions on how to make a rig to test the capabilities of a particular piece of wood in the Bowyers Bible volume 1  

[hickry]

Wow!  Looked back in TBB1... learned a lot!  Looks like Sal's right... hickory is ring porous.  As soon as I get some time, I'll run tests on the staves as mentioned in the book and maybe re-post with pic's of cross sections in several staves, vs break/set information.  I'm really curious if the inside of the log'll be any better than the outside and the differences I see in the staves.  Thanks again, guys, for all of the input!