Old School tuning......

[dragonheart]

It could be me, or it could be the 2114's!

                     

Jack Howard was right, this is easy!

[Ric O'Shay]

My whole point in the first post was for folks not to get drawn up tight about bow/arrow tuning. John Schulz once said that he had never shot a bare shaft through a piece of paper in his life and to his knowledge, neither had Howard Hill.

Archery is a sport. For most of us it is an avocation. It is not something to develop angst over. Keep it simple.

[Tater]

Well said by many,.. I subscribe to the KISS theory.

  I believe we overthink this tuning, FOC, EFOC, Etc. I can still tune wood arrows to my bows much faster than carbons.

[Caddo]

Danny, I'm with ya buddy, great minds think alike! I guess I've been lucky, never came across too many real tuning issues.

Of course once I get my coarbonated shafts aligned with 432grs up front, 3.76" quad fletched aluminum hybrid footed shafts, with accellerators, matched up to my skinny stringed, micro arrow rest adjusted reflex/deflex concave recurved hybrid short longbow, everything just seems to fall into place!    

LD

[2treks]

Although I am not old...
I am with you guys.
Thanks Danny, for a great post.
CTT

[Gordon Jabben]

Excellent.      

[Easykeeper]

Originally posted by moebow:
Good post Danny!!  I'm with you.  IMO the HFOC and EFOC attempts we often see are "shots in the dark" because there is no "base" to start from.  + or - 14% FOC has worked for ever but many trying for the more extreme FOC arrows don't have a starting point to work from.

Also, in my experience, 90% of the "tuning" problems folks have is NOT bow center cut, arrow spine or point weight -- it IS shot execution and form.  We are the MOST variable part of the system.

Arne

Great post Arne, as usual.  I'm all for tuning but like has already been said, clean arrow flight and broadheads hitting with field points is the goal, who cares how you get there.

[maineac]

I think form is huge.  Finding a basic recipe for arrow spine and tip weight for draw length and bow weight, and shooting those until you can group them well would be my best advise for a beginner. Then you can play with length and tip weight to do whatever you want for FOC.  Most bows today are pretty forgiving.  To follow the idea of the thread. Enjoy and and work to become better.  Then worry about the finer technical points if that is what you enjoy.

[jakesdad]

I was guilty of this when I started trad earlier this year......way overthinking.Guy that helped me tune took a bare shaft and cut it a little at a time until it was good at 10 yds.He then cut one of my fletched shafts,installed the broadhead I was going to use and said "shoot em both at that foam deer".Both hit pretty close to each other,he said "done".Way easier than I thought it would be.Probably took 30 minutes total.

[joe skipp]

I'll take a beating here...but I never bare shafted any arrows for any of my bows. Just used common sense and listened to the old timers before me.

String it up, check the brace, maybe play with it, nock point 3/8" to start and if it's a recurve, go heavier in spine and a longbow, depend on the center shot, go lighter or or heavier.

Example, my Kempf longbow is center cut,55#,FF string. I shot some wood spined 55/60#....too stiff. Shot wood spined 50/55#....perfect flight. My 2117's...shoot well from all my bows BUT I test flighted these arrows, fletched with broadheads.

I agree with Ric...guys are making this way too complicated and taking the fun out of shooting Trad bows. Just my two cents from a guy who believes the simpler ways are better.

[ozy clint]

sorry, but i'm not shooting a spiraling arrow at a water buff. Can you group arrows with poor form?

[katman]

Bisch "The guys that had decent basic form tend to be able to tune ok and we find something that will work well for them. The guys that don't have good form get real frustrated"

Agree 100%. Tuning is not rocket science. Having a well tuned arrow is a plus in several ways. I guess I am one of the zealots about tune, does not take me long to dial in a new combo, even high foc, but the gratification of perfect arrow flight is priceless.

Not trying to get anyone angry but a lot of fletch will help hide a marginally tuned arrow, now get that fletching wet and see what happens with a broadhead.

[DennyK]

Danny, I'm with you!

[dnovo]

I'm with you on this too.
I read out of curiosity some of the posts on here about tuning arrows and it makes me wonder "when did it get this hard" . Of course these are generally about carbon arrows and since I never shoot carbons, I don't worry about it much.
New bow, old bow, I just string it up, set nocking point where it has worked for the last 30 years, grab some woodies and go out and shoot. Most of my bows, at least the ones I will keep, will shoot a variety of spines of up to 10-15# variance with the woods. I can simply watch the arrow come out and tell if I need to change a little. Mostly just fling the woodies and enjoy watching them fly.

[slowbowjoe]

I'm a novice here, only shooting 5 or 6 years. The tuning thing comes across as a big issue to me. My gut feeling has been to stay away from the charts, largely... I don't even think about dealing with "Stu's"- I go with a basic guideline for our bows, go out to the bale and shoot. I work with nock point, and brace height, staying close to 125 as possible. I figure if the arrow flies good, it's good.
I know my form isn't perfected enough to rely on the paper tune results, I'd rather know that the flight looks good from release to the mark. it's good to know some of you more seasoned archers feel the same.

[koger]

AGREEED! I usually do exactly like you described, maybe add a bear weather rest to get great flight from a variety of center cut or cut past center risers. Usually takes 15 minutes to get a bow shooting  better than myself. Lots of folks are complicating a rock, in my opinion!

[Brianlocal3]

I agree that people make tuning out to be harder than it is. I was guilty of it when I first came over go traditional, and it was a multitude of factors. ONE, my form was off, TWO, I had no understanding of basic arrow characteristics.

To this day I still cannot make up a set of woodies, but I can get a new bow in the mail and new carbons and within 15-30 min have perfectly tuned arrows.

I now play the KISS bareshaft way and viola.  One thing for certain , you can't take someone else's tune and try to use it for yourself.

[NBK]

The "Old School" way as Rick said in the original post...

That's the lynch pin right there.  Your years of experience have given you A:  the knowledge of what should and shouldn't work for any given set up,
And B:  the confidence born of demonstrative ability to acknowledge that the operator plays a more significant role.

It is not a cavalier approach that you take, but rather a more direct path that evades the detours of doubt and second guesses.  It's something I admire and hope to work towards.

[JC]

Coming from the other side of the "camp", I find tuning arrows a lot of fun and has become an extreme confidence builder over the years. While there are many of you out there don't want it or need it,  some of us actually like it. I like to tinker with my gear and have learned a lot more through experimenting on my own and through the experiments of others than I ever would have following a norm or what I was originally taught.

I too feel for those who have trouble tuning. However, I firmly believe anyone can tune with 1) proper form and 2) a bit of guidance. It's amazing what kind of improvements can be done with a video of the shooter and following the proper procedure for tuning. However, #2 is useless without #1, so I agree with the posters that say this is of primary importance.

I also am positive I am a far better shot with tuned and dialed in equipment than without. It is not "the" factor but for me, it is certainly a beneficial contributor. I and others I know have helped improve the shooting of archers simply by helping them get their equipment tuned. I don't mean getting to paper plate size, I mean tennis balls and smaller. Their form and overall shooting skill was good but they suffered from multiple maladies, including discouraged confidence, that were alleviated from systematic adjustments to equipment until it was on. Their confidence soared and in turn, I think they are better bowhunters for it. I'm sure everyone would agree if it will help you take a more ethical shot on an animal with trad gear it certainly can't hurt.

If you don't want it and are happy with your results, then by all means I wish you the best in your chosen method. But if you aren't satisfied and want every possible ounce you can squeeze out of your gear, then tuning, and "micro" tuning just might help you.

Yes, it can be as simple or as complex as you want, but that doesn't mean either is better than the other. It is simply what you choose it to be.

[mgf]

My experience is that tuning isn't much of an issue for fletched target points but...your broadheads aren't going to fly very well if your arrow/bow combination isn't "tuned".

In the case of the ill-tuned bow/arrow combination that is sporting a broadhead, good form will not help the arrow hit it's mark and get good penetration.