Question for custom bowyers

[Sticks2117]

I ordered custom bow from a notable bowyer a year ago and the first bow I received was to long. I contacted the bowyer he built another and the new one is wrong as well. I spent a good amount of money for this bow and the guy can't get it right? What should I do with this situation. I'm at a loss.

[Hermon]

You mean you ordered a 62" bow for example and he has not provided that?  Seems hard to believe that a "notable" bowyer would do this.  Some more details (no names) please.

[Sticks2117]

I ordered a 50-60# 58" matte finish bow and got a 60" 55# matte finish bow. So I contacted him about the length and he said he would make it right. Today I get a 59" 53# gloss finish bow.

[Hermon]

Hmmm.  I would be frustrated too.  Guess that you should contact him again and give him one more attempt to get it right.  Make certain that both of you are on the same page that if the bow isn't as you ordered, then he keeps the bow and should refund your money.  You gave him plenty of room as far as weight.  If a longbow, he could shorten the last one and still make weight.  He will have to refinish it anyway so the matte shouldn't be a problem.  

I have problems in this area myself, but try to keep a level head in your communication.  I say give him one more chance.

[Bow man]

Not sure why this would ever happen. You should get the bow you want in the first try. I could understand a bow may need a little tweek such as a small adjustment to the grip but if you orer a 58" 55# bow you should have that on the first try

[Wheels2]

It happens.  I ordered a 53# take down.  He made it and was real mad when I complained that it was 58#.  I gave to back to him to correct with new limbs and never saw him, the bow, or the money again.
If he is able to be contacted, I would suggest you call him and talk with him.  Explain your frustration over the delay and errors. Some good bow makers are poor business owners and a lack of organization can lead to such mistakes.

[danbow]

Not making weight would be much more understandable than not getting the right length. Just need to know how to read a tape measure!

[Orion]

Hmmmm. Are you both measuring bow length in the same way? Generally, it's measured nock to nock along the back of the unstrung bow. Some measure on the belly side.  Depends on the riser configuration.

[Over&Under]

Originally posted by Orion:
Hmmmm. Are you both measuring bow length in the same way? Generally, it's measured nock to nock along the back of the unstrung bow. Some measure on the belly side.  Depends on the riser configuration.

I was thinking the same thing...

[7 Lakes]

I have the same question as Orion & O&U Did you measure the bow from tip to tip??? or nock to nock?

Another concern is a year wait.  Unless you knew in advance it was going to be a year.

[Chromebuck]

I have three 62" longbows by different makers and side by side they are all a bit different in length.  Nock to nock measurement is far more complicated than I initially thought of it.

These threads tend to be a slippery slope on this site and I must compliment the generic tactfulness employed.

You have a justifiable grievence IMHO.

~CB

[iohkus]

I have to think you and the bowyer are not on the same page as to how your bow is measured. I just took some measurements on my hybrid longbow. It measures 56" nock to nock (unstrung), 59" along the belly, 59.5" along the back, and is marked 58" AMO (which is what I ordered)

[heartlandbowyer]

When I build a bow I measure nock to nock along the the belly of the bow. If I build 60 inch bow it measures 60 inches nock to nock along the belly. If a 57 inch string will get the bow close to the correct brace and the shooter can twist or untwist the string for fine tuning. AMO = 60"  

Sticks, how are you measuring tip to tip, nock to nock along belly, sounds like you are not on the same page as the bowyer.

Cory

[arrowlauncherdj]

From my understanding you mark a bow according to AMO string length, or at least that's how I was told to do it. For ex: my belly mount limbs on my standard riser make my bows 60.5" nock to nock as measured on the belly. but it takes a 59" string to brace right, and that's supposed to = 62" bow... So it is marked 62" AMO. Strung up it looks like a 60" bow but is marked longer.

The other stuff is a bi bothersome but I'd hash it out over the phone as soon as you can to minimize any bad blood.

Dave

[Sticks2117]

Sorry to hear that wheels!!!!

I have a 60" critter gitter and the 2 bows are the same size next to each other when strung, and take the same size string. If it were a little shorter, even 1.5" than the critter gitter there wouldn't be an issue at all.

I guess I didn't realize that there could be as much as 2" play either way. I would've made my 3 important criteria more clear, Length, Finish, Weight, in that order. AMO 55", Matte finish its a hunting bow I don't want flash, 50#-60# as close to 55# as possible.  

As far as AMO, string length is 57" not 55" so if you measure, tip to tip, groove to groove, front or back thats a 60" bow, IMHO. the string length determines AMO.

So when people order bows from you or you order a bow make sure your criteria is made perfectly clear. I guess I didn't make mine clear enough.

[drewsbow]

I have to ask is the extra inch really a deal breaker for you ? If so then I would contact him again.

[JamesV]

Getting the length right is the easiest part of building a bow for me. I use a tape to measure the lams. Maybe you are not on the same page as the bowyer as to how YOU measure a bow.

[Sixby]

Measure along the back of the limbs and directly through the riser. Most bows will be built so that sting length is three down. 60 in bow will take a 57 in string ect. I build actual bow length by measurement and usually my bows are more like two down. 60 in bow takes a 57 1/2 ro 59 in string for my brace height of 7 1/4 in.
Bowyers build them differently and things change over the years. It used to be common to have recurves  4 in down. 60 in bow took a 56 in string.

Longbow were usually three down. 64 in bow took a 61 in string.

Today more and more bows are prestressed to the point that there is good stability with just a couple of inches under length for the string.

I think you could go on the phone with your bowyer and find out what is going on. If you had to wait a full year to get the bow he is either a really good bowyer or very slow.
 
God bless and good luck , Steve

[Holm-Made]

I have 7 different bow forms for my models.  On a few of them I have found that the bow performs better if I fudge at little longer or shorter.  For example: my 62" Kingfisher is actually 62.5".  It just is a better bow then if I cut it to exactly 62".  My 62" River Runner is actually closer to 61" then it is to 62" NTN.  

If you have hired an experienced bowyer and you like how the bow shoots, then trust his judgement.  And don't be afraid to call him and ask about the whys and hows.  I'm sure he will be happy to answer your questions.

As far as his putting a gloss finish rather then the matte you ordered well he should make that right at his own expense.

My two cents.  Chad

[oldbohntr]

I agree with Chad....if the difference is minor.   As a bow collector and one who makes strings for every bow I take in and lots of others, I find there is no standard for length.  I make a string to fit the bow and figure the bowyer had a reason for it coming out as it did.

What I cannot accept from a custom bowyer is not listening to what you want.  And I don't mean the 28th time you've called him since you ordered the bow.  You should know pretty much what you want when you order and any changes should be simple tweaking(not twerking, which I recently learned is obscene!) As stated, delivering a gloss finish when you ordered matte is unexcusable.  Missing weight is also not excuseable....if you gave him a range and he didn't call to tell you it was coming out high or low.  I have accepted bows that missed weight, when I was asked in advance.  Not that I had to....

When you mentioned GN, you sort of let the cat out of the bag.  You're spoiled.  I've known Mr. Brumm and Mr. Shepard since the 80s, and they have paid attention to detail for as long as I've known them.  For myself, I couldn't stand to be a custom bowyer.  You get to spend too much time listening to too much BS from guys who don't know all that much!  (but....they are the customers!) I'd just build all my bows for stock and let the chips fall where they may....and I'd soon be bankrupt!