Pack list revisions (after the hunt)

[robtattoo]

Well, I'm back from Colorado. Unfortunately, but not unexpectedly, elkless.
I knew that this years trip to the Flat tops, as my first elk hunt, would be more of an experimental/scouting/see-if-I-can-survive-it trip than a serious hunt.

I asked & received some excellent advice regarding my packlist & now I've been & returned, I have a revision list for 2015......

Bow & 4 arrows (+ 2 blunts for grouse) Blunts not needed at all. Turns out Grouse are not legal in the unit we hunted!

Clothes:
Kuiu Attack pants (on) Yes, worn every day
Kuiu 145 Merino l/s top (on) Yes, worn every day
Kuiu 230 Merino l/s top Yes, worn every day
Kuiu spindrift puffy Yes, worn almost every day
Kuiu Guide jacket Yes, worn every day
No-name poly s/s tee No. Only worn on the hike in. Could've worn the 145
2 spare Exofficio drawers Only 1 spare needed. Wear one, wash one
2 spare Merino socks. Yes, changed & washed daily. Not guaranteed to dry overnight
Kuiu lightweight beanie Yes, worn every day & in bed
First lite brimmed beanie Yes, worn every day

Camp stuff:
Golite SL5, no nest Yes, couldn'tve been better
Kelty 20° down bag No. Too small & restrictive. Will replace
Kelty down pillow Yes.
Thermarest X-lite pad Yes, but exchanged for a larger size
Stove & cookset Will share 1 between 3 people next year. Redundancy
2x gas cylinders Yes, but one carried, per person. Redundancy
2x contractor bags Yes
Mora knife Yes
Micro towel No. Not needed
20' paracord SEE BELOW
Wet wipes HELL yes!
Goal Zero solar charger (the little one) Yes, used 3 times in 5 days

Food:
12 packs instant oatmeal Cut to 6
6 portions trail mix, Snickers, dried fruit & deer jerky (roughly 1/3lb total per day) Cut to ½ weight
6 home dehydrated meals (roughly ¼lb per day & around 1200 kcal) Cut to ½ portion
12 coffee Yes (GOD yes!)
12 tea bags Cut to 6
12 energy powder drink mixes Increase to 24
3l bladder Yes + 20oz bottle
Katadyn hiker pro filter Yes + spare filter. Filter blocked by day 5.
spoon Yes
Food coozy Yes. Saves water by not having to do dishes
Condiments
(Planned for 2500-3000kcal/day)

Daypack:
TZ2220 pack
3l bladder + 32oz nalgene for drink mixes Cut bottle to 20oz Smart Water
Havalon Piranta bolt + 6 blades Yes
Gerber packsaw (one of those tiny things) Yes, used for trimming branches & making a comfy seat. VERY important to have a comfy seat!
8x42 Leupold binos + SL4 harness Yes, used constantly
Spotter & tripod No. Not needed & not taken
Phone + GPS (Garmin backtrack) Yes & yes. Better safe than sorry for 3 extra ounces
Frogg Toggs poncho Yes. VERY handy & versatile. Used 3 times
Compass No. Easy to navigate around the mountains. GPS + spare covers me
Meat bags Yes. Not needed, but didn't kill anything
Trekking pole (bringing 2, leaving one in camp) Yes. Used on climb up to 11,500 & to get a friend down who blew out his knee at 11,400 on the way down.
TP No. Wet wipes work.
Lighter Yes. One carried per person + 1 spare
Princeton Tek headlight + tiny energizer spare. Yes. Used every night

Okay. Y'all told me to take 100' of paracord & I did. Honestly I used 3" of it to fix a busted zipper. Even with an elk down I really, really can't envision the use of more than 30' MAX. Next time, I'll go with my gut & take a LOT less.
One thing I didn't realise & I will know in future is the absolute, complete & utter lack of appetite. Not once during 5 days did I manage to eat more than ½ a day's ration. I honestly couldn't if I'd tried. Literally every single thing I ate, I had to force down.
I need to figure out a MUCH higher calorie/ounce diet for next year. I carried nearly 20 pounds of food up there this year & if I think hard, I reckon I probably buried 15 of that on the last day. I felt tired & worn out to the point that eating a tiny bite of jerky really gave me an energy boost like I've never felt before. I need to get a much more efficient diet for the mountain. This year I tied for healthy food & it's just too much volume for the energy released. Fatty, high carb, high protein foods rule. Even only walking 3-4 miles a day at 11-12,000 feet, believe me. You ain't getting fat! I lost 8 pounds in 6 days & frankly, I wasn't pushing myself.

Something I was aware of, but still underestimated was the effects of the lack of oxygen. If any of you are planning a trip like this for the first time, be prepared. It will kick your ass. Getting in shape is awesome & makes life easier, but as fit as you can get at sea level....that altitude WILL hurt.
Seriously. The 3 of us were pretty well in the best shape of our lives. The last time I was as fit as this, the Army was paying me to be. On the climb up, by the time we'd covered 3 miles, I couldn't make it 50 yards without a 5 minute break to drink & breathe. It got easier after a couple of days, but even by the time we got down, the slightest incline would still kick our teeth in.
After doing a bit of cursory Googleage, I've discovered that it actually takes (on average) 2 MONTHS to 'fully' acclimatize to any altitude over 10,000 feet, from anything under 3,000. You can function after about 2 weeks, but to be able to do up there what you can do down here, with the same physical effect takes 8 to 10 weeks. There is NO shortcut, you just have to accept the suck!  :D

[Rob W.]

Thanks for taking the time to list everything and do a follow-up Rob. Sorry you didn't get to use those game bags.

You might try a Sawyer filter next go around. I got rid of my MSR after my first trip with the Sawyer.

[robtattoo]

Yeah, the filter was a bit of a bone of contention.
We had a 2 gallon gravity bag in camp (HUGELY handy, although a pain to fill & carry) for camp use & we each carried various filter systems for our own, daily use. I had a Katadyn Hiker Pro with the paper cartridge filter. Using 99% 'clear' water it blocked after 22 liters. Josh had the model up from me with a ceramic filter & using the same water source it survived less than 18 before becoming clogged. However his is cleanable, mine ain't.
Shane carried a sawyer inline. Not impressed at all. Luckily he brought two spares & on the last day had to rely on water from the gravity bag to get off the mountain.
I don't know what was going on with any of the filter systems, because ALL of them are supposed to be good for 'hundreds' of gallons, not 'several' liters. To be fair, all were still working, but the effort needed to make them work was ridiculous. I was genuinely worried I'd snap the pump handle on my Hiker Pro.

[Lone Ranger]

great post trip write up~ thanks for taking the time.

L.R.

[awbowman]

Good write up.  You are right about altitude.  It will hurt no matter how in shape you are.

It's worth it though, isn't it!

[robtattoo]

Oh heck yes!  :D
Toughest thing I've ever done, physically.
Most beautiful place I've ever seen in my life. Worth every bruise, cramp, ache & sprain!

Only 49 weeks 'til I do it again!

[Matty]

Hey man glad you made it out safe!
What was the actual hunting like? Our 2 first days were good. Even in the rain. But then the elk and the rain kinda dried up...

[Tater John]

FWIW, I've done three 10 day mountains treks with the Boy Scouts in New Mexico and the food that is provided is extremely high carbohydrates and minimum protein. Rumored reason being the protein would cause sluggishness and they couldn't afford having a bunch of lazy teenage boys dragging ass or refusing to roll out. The days averaged 9-10 miles some less most more. The first thing I was crazy for was a greasy piece of meat!

[ozy clint]

wow, 20 pounds of food for 6 days! I'm down to 500 grams, ( a little over a pound) per day and not going hungry. You said you buried about 15 pounds out of the 20, so that's works out to be about the same as me. I'm sweating just thinking about lugging that. You can do this every year and you will still be refining your kit every year. Bet you can't wait for next year already. Got to love wilderness time!

[widow sax]

I do not understand the filter not lasting I have used the same filter for four years and this will be the 5th year has not clogged yet no problems at all but taking backup pills or drops are for piece of mind. Glade you had fun it is addictive for sure this will be my 6th year in a row and 5th year in a row backpacking in. I take 1 lb of carry weight food per day. Anyone that measure success by elk harvested on a trad bow hunt you may as well stay home the odds are not in your favor but that is not what keeps us coming back.   Widow

[Ragin Bull]

Great write up Rob. Something I really don't look at when I get home each year but should. A little different for me though as I'm not packing in. I have in the past but now with the wife we have a outfitter tent and I do day hikes from there.
I'm glad you had a good time and are looking forward to next year already. Sounds like another diehard elk hunter. Honestly, I wait all year for these two weeks. I just finished packing the truck and we are pulling out before first light tomorrow.
Bring it on!

[ChuckC]

Glad you had a good trip, and realistic goals.  Did you have any really close encounters ?
CHuckC

[robtattoo]

Didn't see a damn thing bigger'n a Marmot!  

Still the best hunting trip I've ever done. I can really see how y'all get addicted to it!

[M60gunner]

Rob, great write up. What I really had to read twice was your comments about the water filters. It makes one want to use the tabs even if it makes the water taste terrible. You mentioned the effort needed to just move around not to mention doing some chores around camp.
I

[robtattoo]

Chores???? I could barely breathe after tying me boots!  :D

[Jerry Jeffer]

Try the life straw for a drinking filter. Good up to 1000 liters and I have not had stoppage problems.

[gringol]

Thanks for the follow up.  The filter situation is a bad deal.  I've been using an msr Sweetwater filter for over 15 years and never had a problem with a filter.  I've used filters for 3 weeks straight and just swapped it after because I thought I should, not cause it was clogging.  I'd take that katydyne back for a refund.

[Jon Stewart]

Thanks for the up-date. Sounds like you had a great experience.  The only thing I would dis agree with on your to take or not to take list is leaving a compass home next time.  I never leave the camp without one regardless of where I am.  I just don't trust myself or battery life in those GPS/electronic devices.  compasses weight, "nothing" and can be attached to your pack strap so they are not in your way.

Getting too old to do those mountain trips so I read others experiences and travel with them.

[Whip]

Great summary.
I'd agree on the compass though.  An extra couple of ounces of insurance.  I have rarely used one, but always have it.  Electronics will almost always work but I have had them fail me in the past.  And although finding your way around the mountains is generally very easy, I once spent 5 straight days where the clouds had us completely socked in.  Couldn't trust walking 100 yards from camp without a device to help find your way home.

I also still think 100' of cord is weight well worth carrying.  Again, most often not needed, but invaluable when you do.  When I had my bull on the ground last year I couldn't move him to get it quartered.  After I got back I learned how to use rope to make a winch with dead limbs that would have allowed me to get him turned over.  But it does take a lot of rope.  

Also, when you get an animal quartered and need to hang those in trees it takes a lot of rope to get them all out of the reach of bears.  I carry four 25' pieces.  You might get by with 15 or 20' pieces, but it's going to take 4 good pieces to get all of your meat off the ground.

Altitude and lack of oxygen are eye opening experiences as you found out.  Putting an elk on the ground and having to deal with it are another eye opener that is tough to prepare for.  

Speaking of meat care, you mentioned that you had game bags.  Did you have anything along to deal with flies/bees?  They can be a serious problem.  On my first elk we boned and bagged the meat.  Took one load out and came back within 4 hours to find the rest of the cheese cloth bags were COVERED with fly eggs.  

I now carry powdered citric acid and a small spray bottle.  Mix water with the citric acid to spray on the meat will help keep the flies off.  Some people carry pepper or other products, but you need to have something to deal with them.  I also have upgraded my game bags to TAG bags to help keep the bugs off.  

Glad you made it back in one piece and had a great trip.  If you think you are addicted now just wait until you have a bull rip off a bugle from 15 yards!!  You're going to need a jar of Marmite, because you will be toast!

[Supercracker]

I was one of the three on this trip.

I'll have to remember the thing about the citric acid. That's a good tip and lightweight. Thanks

The water thing was very annoying and a bit scary. What if we'd been miles back with no other way to deal with it. I'm definitely bringing some kind of chemical treatment backup from now on.

I cannot be overstated how badly the altitude beat us down. I've been in better shape before than now, but before we left I was going on 4-5mile non stop hikes with a 55lb pack on every other day with no trouble. When Rob says it was 50yds between 10-15 minute breaks he's being very generous. It was probably closer to 30 yards. When putting on your boots you had to take a break between the L&R boot.