Backcountry Tipi buying help

[Steve Chappell]

I am in the process of gearing up to buy a lightweight durable tipi to use for pack ins and other hunting where less weight is important. I have never owned a tipi before so I would appreciate input from you seasoned backcounty tipi users on what you feel is important to have and what is not.  Also, is there anything you would like to have in a tipi that would make it better if you could custom order it?  I am aware of the main two tipi makers Kifaru and Seek Outside.  Any others I should consider?

[Kevin Dill]

Kifaru is the 800# gorilla in the tipi market. You can buy from them and not spend any time wondering about quality, features or other problems. They perfected the lightweight sil-nylon tipi.

I've known a few Seek Outside owners, but I think they sold their units...not sure why.

Titanium Goat is a serious player in the UL tipi market and has great stoves, too. My friend just bought a complete rig from them, but I know he hasn't pitched it yet.

Important things for me: Good zippers. Plenty of stake points. Strong top cone and center pole. Condensation liner mandatory. Inside clothesline. Stove jack for woodstove. Light color for good interior brightness.

Ignore the man-ratings. A 4-man is hardly enough space for 2 guys and gear on an extended hunt. 6-man is basic for 2 guys with stove. 8-man is super comfy for 2 and very good for 3...4 will work but a bit tight with gear. Know your likely terrain and soil types, as it will affect the stakes you use. Learn to pitch your tipi exactly as instructed and keep it tight during the hunt. A loose or flexing/flapping tipi body is a recipe for breakdowns.

[Iowabowhunter]

I've been looking into them myself. Ability to stand is my main concern, looking hard at the Kifaru Sawtooth.

[Biathlonman]

I have a Kifaru Sawtooth and my brother has a six man seek outside.  Both outstanding quality. My buddy also runs one of the Seek Outside backcountry shelters and is happy with it. EdT's backcountry probably has the best stoves. Ed designed and built the box stoves sold under the Kifaru label.  Last I knew Ed's buddy Levi was building them. I've little experience with TiGoat but I know their customer service can't touch the other two.

[stalkin4elk]

Mansfieldoutdoors.com has some good looking ones with good choices of materials and sizes. Worth a look.

[AkDan]

The  main questions are costs..and weight.

Do you want a stove?  

If no stove, I'd opt out of the Kifaru imho.  nothing against those using them, as they are DAM FINE tents.  I want one but packing isn't an option on a 4 man when weight is an issue.

The price of even a cheap Kifaru is another topic of discussion.  Again they are fine tents by all means but imho way over priced!!!!

You are however getting a tent that is backed by a great company amongst other things..did I say they were dam fine tents!  I've also stayed in one multiple times.


All that said, for a guy who has to work on a NORMAL working mans budget and is looking for a quality tipi with a quality budget, find this.  if you cant fork out the 1500 bucks on a kifaru, this would be my replacement for it.

Shangri la 2, or  shangrila 3 tents by golite

I'm not sure If the 2 is even being made anymore, being replaced by the 3.   The 2's weight comes in at 2.5 lbs!  that's smoking compared to 99% of the tents on the market half the size!

[AkDan]

Holy crap I just realize that go lit has filed for bankruptcy!    Looks like we missed the sale of a century.

[Steve O]

Steve,

You are going to be in the middle of nowhere.

Seek Outsides are 50/50 feedback wise

Ti Goat is 75/25

Kifaru is 995/1000

The price difference is not worth it to me when I am in the middle of nowhere. I've seen problems first hand with with both other brands with friends. I trust my Kifaru completely.

[Orion]

I have a six-man Kifaru with a stove and agree with everything Kevin says, including the need for a liner, which costs extra.  I don't have a liner.  Works ok without one in the dry Western states in early fall, but when I use it for spring, summer, fall camping in humid Wisconsin, it does get wet/clammy inside.  A good, complete ground cloth reduces the condensation, of course.

One other thing to consider in selecting the size t-pee is its footprint.  They're rather large, and it can sometimes be a problem finding enough level space to erect one in the mountainous West.

[Crittergetter]

There's an 8 man Kifaru in the classifieds!

[The Night Stalker]

Kifaru are nice until it rains and it gets wet. Then your talking about some serious weight to change camps. I went with a Hilliberg Akto and a tarp.

[Biathlonman]

No, not really.  I would also add the stove is the key.  If you don't desire a stove I think the tipi shelters give up a lot to many others.

[Steve O]

Originally posted by The Night Stalker:
Kifaru are nice until it rains and it gets wet. Then your talking about some serious weight to change camps. I went with a Hilliberg Akto and a tarp.

Hah, I'm going to disagree on that 100%. Shake it out and stuff it. Wet weight would be way, WAY down the list on why I would not want to put it up and take it down every day.

[Steve Chappell]

Thanks to all who have given me input so far!!!!

Let me expand a little more on what I want.  I have pretty much decided on an 8 man so I can stand up in it (I am 6'1"), there is room for up to 4 people (kinda like a base camp) and lots of room for 2.  Imprint is something I have thought about but feel I should be able to make it work for what I intend to use it. I am committed to buying and paying whatever needed for what I feel is the best tipi.  I am just looking for input on tipis.  I own an Akto for bivy hunting.

I know Kifaru has almost a cult like following with a well earned solid reputation and strong resale.  I bought one of their backpacks after extensive research and really like it a lot.  I too feel they are overpriced but I am willing to pay it if I feel they offer the best.  There is one thing that has kind of turned me off on their tipi and that is what Patrick wrote about the Kifaru Tipi on their website and what I read as him taking digs at Seek Outside… which makes me feel SO is taking a bit out of their sales to generate that kind of website response.

I was very close to pulling the trigger on a Seek Outside 8 man ($325 less then Kifaru base modle) and would have had I had the money last year, but I didn’t.  I have looked at reviews and have not found any negative on SO only positive ones. And while they do not have the years under their belt or following of Kifaru, they do have a following. I think SO has also made a lot of improvements over the years that put them on par with Kifaru…Just my humble opinion.

Now that I have the money, I have decided to step back and really research this throughly and get as much input as I can before I pull the trigger…and look at more than Kifaru and SO.  I do not want to look back with a regret.

Has anyone got any experience with Wyoming Lost and Found  www.wyominglostandfound.net  ? I came across them recently and they have really caught my eye and interest as a high quality option.  They offer a fabric option called Dyneema (I am told stronger than any of the other two makers and still very light weight) and they do some things different in the construction process that I think is worthy of cehcking out….like seams that have no thread exposed to the weather and therefore do not need to be seam sealed.

So far it is clear Kifaru is the perferred tipi maker but I'd still like more input.

[Kevin Hansen]

PM sent, Steve.

[Kevin Hansen]

Originally posted by Kevin Hansen:
PM sent, Steve.

[njloco]

I own a Sawtooth, if your only 6'1", you should be able to jump up and down in a Sawtooth as I believe it can be set to 7'2".

I've struck camp under rainy conditions with my Sawtooth, shake it off, stuff it in stuff sack and go, never noticed if it was any heavier.

One suggestion, if your packing in for one person, I wouldn't get anything larger than a super tarp with the amex. I wouldn't own any of them without a titanium stove. If your clothes get wet or you want to dry your boots off or anything else, or cook, or just warm up, the stove will do it.

My Sawtooth with the Poles & pegs, and the stove, plus my UL3700 ci back pack and with the add on pockets that bring it up to about 5500 ci all weigh less than 10lbs. I think the Sawtooth is too big for one person if your packing in.

By the way my Saw was still standing after a tornado passed by, so I know they can take it.

Good luck

[The Night Stalker]

That move was with a 4 man with steady rain with a liner. I got soaked. I guess I did not shake it enough. From 5 miles to 8 miles in. I definitely noticed a difference in weight. The stove is key with the kifaru. If you do run into weather, you can dry your clothes out. If I was going to buy another, I like the sawtooth set up.

[AkDan]

The stove is the driving force behind me wanting one was well.  And the fact that real winter tenting it Alaskan style is a possibility in one.  I have a trapping buddy whose out in -40 temps living in one for weeks on end.  

The main issue is weight.  The tent, liner, steaks and stove are not what I'd call a remotely backpack style hunting set up!  That doesn't detract from it being a dam fine outfit! Though I do believe are awfully expensive, like you I'll pull the trigger on quality gear.  Before Kifaru packs there was barneys.  I've pulled the trigger on two of them now and am looking for a 3rd as the first one is well about dead!   You pay for what you get and those that know me know I put that first one through heck and back a few times. If you're looking to put gear through the ringer I'm your man! If there is ANY chink in something I will find it usually in a hurry! Where other gear has failed me, ie broken frames, or severely jacked up pins to tearing stitching etc, the barneys pack keeps on trucking.

If weight isn't an issue I wouldn't look past the kifaru....but you started with weight and as a sheep guy I know all about weight.  I don't have the money to dump into multiple cub flights because I want 'cush' gear.

I don't believe hilleberg tents are any lighter than anything else.  They do have a gigantic vestibule.   They in theory seem like a great ten and proved as good as any on a goat hunt a few years ago...but I don't think I'd warrant the price, and for a tall guy even in the giant hooch you wont fit in it!  I'm vertically challenged to a degree, my partner wasn't and he didn't fit in his model at all!  I'll have to ask what one it is if he doesn't post (he's also a tm guy).

[Kevin Dill]

Kifaru certainly isn't the only act in town, but I have no doubt that they are one of the top ones. I guess for Steve C it's definitely going to be a tipi, and it comes down to which make & model. I personally don't think there's a better tipi being made than Kifaru; just different ones. Some may suit you better, but you've got to do the research. Study the specs and learn what you can. Some of us are people who just can't walk a trodden path and have to find our own way. I am definitely that way, and was nearly 8 years ago when I decided on a tipi. They weren't very popular back then, and just a few guys had them. Angelo Christiano, John Havard, Nick Dedekar and a few other hardcore gear guys (who bust tail in the mountains) helped me get my head straight. I spent the big bucks back then and never regretted a dime of it.

Since then, a lot of tipis have been built. None of them are perfect, but some have more bugs and issues than others. Kifaru was the company to modernize the concept and bring it to the forefront. I can easily understand Patrick Smith if he had any heartburn toward the competition which quickly recognized an opportunity to compete on price and perhaps cut some quality corners. I see that in my business too, and it rankles me that competitors can be like leeches in the water. P Smith is rightly proud of his products and willing to defend their quality and price...just another solid American doing business.

Let's place 5 tipis out there and label them all by name. Let's assume you're leaving on a hunt tomorrow and you know the weather will be wild with snow, wind and rain. You've got to pick one tipi right now, and know it is worthy. I'm willing to bet that a clear majority would go with the proven name, and one that has had an excellent reputation for a decade or more.