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Author Topic: Shooting coaches and clinics?  (Read 587 times)

Offline longbow fanatic 1

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Shooting coaches and clinics?
« on: February 14, 2015, 07:08:00 AM »
I'm interested to hear who you like as a shooting coach or shooting clinic you have attended. My goal for 2015 is to make some real improvements in my shooting and I'd like to attend some training/seminars to do so. Please include what makes a particular coach's style more beneficial to you than other. Also, does the coach try to change your entire shot sequence or just make small changes to your natural shooting style?

Thanks for your opinions,

Dennis

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Re: Shooting coaches and clinics?
« Reply #1 on: February 14, 2015, 08:24:00 AM »
TTT
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Offline Caughtandhobble

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Re: Shooting coaches and clinics?
« Reply #2 on: February 14, 2015, 09:12:00 AM »
I have only been to one clinic, it was a Rod Jenkins clinic. He does not so much change your shot sequence, I would say that he insures that you have a shot sequence. Rod has a gift for teaching and keeping the class going in a positive manner.

I would recommend the class to anyone that wants to take their shooting to a new level. The class that I went to, there was a wide variety of students from new to fairly advanced, target shooters to world class hunters. We had nothing but positive feedback from all that attended.

I would love to go to Rick Welch's class also, the folks that I know that have been to his class all shoot lights out. The people that I have talked to say Rick teaches his style, the more you shoot like him when you show up the faster the learning curve will be.

Good luck in 2015!!!

Offline Scott E

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Re: Shooting coaches and clinics?
« Reply #3 on: February 14, 2015, 10:10:00 AM »
Rod Jenkins clinic is a must.
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Offline Jack Hoyt 75

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Re: Shooting coaches and clinics?
« Reply #4 on: February 14, 2015, 10:30:00 AM »
Sign up for Rod's clinic at 3 Rivers in northern IN.  I highly recommend it.  You learn a lot in two days and leave with a roadmap of how to become a much better shot.
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Online McDave

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Re: Shooting coaches and clinics?
« Reply #5 on: February 14, 2015, 10:59:00 AM »
I've been to both Rod Jenkins's and Rick Welch's classes, and they are different enough that it would be nice if you knew which style you liked best before you went.  The catch is, I don't know how you're going to do that, because even if you read about their styles on TradGang and watch their videos, it's not the same as being there. Either one is going to explain things to you personally about your own shooting that they obviously can't do while you're watching their videos.  After attending their classes, things clicked in my mind months or years later that I didn't realize the significance of at the time.  

Both are friendly and helpful; neither is going to insist on doing anything any particular way during the class.  They will explain to you a couple of times how they think you ought to be doing something and then it's up to you.  They both know that there's more than one way to skin a cat in traditional archery.  This open approach makes the classes fun and relaxing, but it also makes it easier for you to miss subtle concepts if they aren't being pounded into you.

The big difference between the two is that Rod teaches the dynamic release and Rick teaches the static release.  The only absolute I will tell you is not to try to mix the two.  There are definite advantages and disadvantages to either one, but the only thing you accomplish if you try to mix them is to do away with the advantages and emphasize the disadvantages.  It took me years to really understand the differences between the two.  I can't say that I really had a good grasp on that right after attending their classes.  Maybe I'm just a slow learner, I don't know.

Neither teaches the pure instinctive approach.  Rick comes closest, and calls his style instinctive, but does believe in using the sight picture as a reference, which some would call a deviation from the pure instinctive method.  I think Rick's method is very close to Howard Hill's split vision, but he may disagree with me on that.  Rod teaches gap, but doesn't push it on students.  Both primarily teach form, with the aiming method being more of an afterthought, albeit a necessary one.

Both teach draw and hold, as opposed to snap shooting, although Rod's hold is more of a dynamic tension where movement never really stops, whereas Rick's is a definite stop and 2 second hold.  Rod will teach snap shooters, but I think you would be wasting your time if you went to Rick's class wanting to snap shoot.

Both teach an upright stance, which of course can be varied as conditions demand.  Both teach the same alignment as Terry illustrates in his form clock.  I think both personally use and prefer 3 under, but will teach either 3 under or split.

Rod spends a lot of time on back tension in his class.  Rick doesn't spend much time on that. Back tension is just as important in both methods, but I personally think it is a more difficult concept to master using the dynamic release, which could be why Rod spends more time on it.  If you really understand what Rick is saying when he says to lock your back muscles in place at full draw, then you realize that it is impossible to come to full draw with Rick's method without engaging your back muscles.  It took me a long time to understand the difference between just holding at full draw using my back muscles, i.e. "balanced pulling," and locking my back muscles in place. When I finally did understand that, it was like a light went on and my shooting dramatically improved in one day.  Without understanding that concept, you're missing most of the benefit of the static release.

Rod primarily teaches form at close ranges using the blank bale.  Rick's students shoot at 3D animals at 15-25 yards.  Rod teaches clases of a dozen people, more or less, while Rick's classes are either one-on-one or smaller groups.  Both have advantages, and while Rod's classes are larger, I never felt that I lacked personal attention. I also learned from what he was showing other students in the class. Some things, like avoiding peeking, I think are best taught at some distance from the target, as I don't have a tendency to peek when shooting at a blank bale (what is there to peek at?).

I hope this helps in understanding the difference between the two approaches, although I can't help anyone choose which is better for them personally.
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Offline Kevin Hansen

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Re: Shooting coaches and clinics?
« Reply #6 on: February 14, 2015, 11:28:00 AM »
Good insight, McDave. Thanks.

Offline SquareHead

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Re: Shooting coaches and clinics?
« Reply #7 on: February 14, 2015, 11:51:00 AM »
I am attending Rod's clinic at 3 Rivers next weekend.  I have never been to any other clinic or class...

Offline Stump Buster

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Re: Shooting coaches and clinics?
« Reply #8 on: February 14, 2015, 12:40:00 PM »
McDave,

That was one of the easiest to understand explanations I've ever read of the two classes compared...Thanks for that info!


Dennis,

  I attended Rod's class last year and enjoyed it immensely but I'm always willing to add some new ideas/tools from other coaches into my toolbox. You can utilize some new techniques to create/improve your own "style" but the one thing that seems to echo from every class I've attended or heard about is "Consistency in the Shot Sequence".
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Offline cch

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Re: Shooting coaches and clinics?
« Reply #9 on: February 14, 2015, 07:44:00 PM »
If you ever get the chance go to one of Joel Turner's clinics. It will help you be a better shot when the pressure is on.

Offline britt

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Re: Shooting coaches and clinics?
« Reply #10 on: February 14, 2015, 08:24:00 PM »
I went to Rod's clinic 2yrs. ago in Santa Fe. It was the best money Iv spent on archery. Rod is very helpful. He becomes a life time archery coach for the students who take the clinic. Iv emailed, phone called and sent videos of me shooting since the clinic. Also he travels to the clinics. I hosted one last yr. here in Greeley, CO. It wasn't very difficult to set-up a clinic. It was a lot of fun and it was away for me to give back to traditional archery that's has given me so much.
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Re: Shooting coaches and clinics?
« Reply #11 on: February 14, 2015, 10:05:00 PM »
I've been to Rod's clinic, and it was the best thing I ever did to improve my shooting! I was in a baaaaaaaad funk with my shooting and saw on here where Rod was doing a clinic close enough to me to attend. I signed up and went. I left the clinic knowing in my mind that everything I had been told was right, but not really sure I was ever going to "get it". It took me nearly a year and then all of a sudden, like McDave stated above, a light came on one day while I was shooting, and it all made sense. Back tension is very hard to teach, and harder to understand, but Rod told me that if I stuck with it trying, that one day it would work and I would know it. That is exactly what happened with me.

Rod's clinic was the best $225 I have ever spent on archery, period!

Bisch

Offline longbow fanatic 1

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Re: Shooting coaches and clinics?
« Reply #12 on: February 14, 2015, 11:01:00 PM »
Thanks everyone. Excellent insights and observations. I appreciate it!

Offline Iowabowhunter

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Re: Shooting coaches and clinics?
« Reply #13 on: February 15, 2015, 12:06:00 AM »
I am trying to get enough people signed up for a Rod Jenkins clinic here in Bozeman for whoever is interested
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Offline HighNTree

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Re: Shooting coaches and clinics?
« Reply #14 on: February 16, 2015, 12:07:00 AM »
It is good to see more and more people making the effort to improve their shooting.  My friends thought that I was nuts for spending money on shooting lessons.  I took lessons from Rick Welch back in 2006 and I am so glad that I did.

Offline Green

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Re: Shooting coaches and clinics?
« Reply #15 on: February 16, 2015, 05:40:00 AM »
Very well explained McDave.

I haven't been to Rick's school, but two days at a Rod Jenkins clinic will give you two things....a friend for life and the tools to shoot like you never thought you could, if you're willing to put in the effort.
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Offline Sky-Dogg

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Re: Shooting coaches and clinics?
« Reply #16 on: February 16, 2015, 07:26:00 AM »
I would like to go to a clinic with Rod, Rick, or Byron.  I am hoping that there is one in Florida this year.  If not, I will have to travel.  Based on what you and others are saying, the experience is well worth it.  Brian

Offline longbow fanatic 1

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Re: Shooting coaches and clinics?
« Reply #17 on: February 16, 2015, 08:06:00 AM »
I always enjoy McDave's responses. Always thorough and detailed! Thanks, everyone!

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Re: Shooting coaches and clinics?
« Reply #18 on: February 16, 2015, 10:03:00 AM »
I was thinking the same thing.  Very  clear description of the two shooting disciplines.  Thanks for a thoughtful response.
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Offline LBR

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Re: Shooting coaches and clinics?
« Reply #19 on: February 16, 2015, 11:07:00 AM »
I've only been to Rod's clinic.  He is easy to understand and follow, and very patient.  No smoke and mirrors, just solid and proven instruction.  FWIW, some of the best in the world have taken Rod's clinic.

I know I learned more in a couple of days with him than I'd learned on my own (with the internet and videos) in the previous 10 years.

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