Buying my first asian bow, want to make the right choice

[Angelus]

Hello, I'm very new to this forum but everyone seems to know alot on this forum especially about Asian bows, or as some people call them, "horse bows".

I have my eye on three different brands, mariner, grozer biocomposite, and hywang. ( nit sure how you spell the last one).

I'm really wanting to buy the one good bow, I'm not very rich but I have a passion for archery. I'm really liking the look and price of the mariner bows. Alot of people are really praising hywang bows too, I just don't know where to find them or how much they are. And grozer biocomposites look cool too, id love a real horn bow.

Any recommendations? Price range is around 300-400$.

[iohkus]

For Mariner go to:  http://www.cinnabarbow.com/marinerbows/index.html


For Hwarang go to:

 http://www.koreanarchery.org/classic/model25.html


Will

[Pat B]

Check out huntworthyproductions  James Parker makes Asiatic horn bows of all flavors and also make them with glass or all natural materials.

[halfseminole]

Don't go with Grozer.  

 http://atarn.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=2689

The biocomposites are fiberglass bows with horn-looking materials slapped on.  Csaba Grozer also owns a plastics company  http://naturcomposit.com/  that manufactures the "horn" but underneath it is fiberglass, and the siyahs are screwed on.

Atilla makes a you-finish horsebow that's had quite a few good reviews.  It's also well under your price range.

I shoot almost exclusively Asian myself.  Are you looking to shoot thumb style as well?

[Archer Dave]

I have always thought those were cool looking bows. I know next to nothing about them though.

[BOWMARKS]

SALUKI.    Lukus Knovonty.  

He makes a heck of nice bow I do not know how to get in touch but I am sure someone will  

[Capt]

The Hwarang bow.  The Korean bowyers are outstanding.  Many are 12th generation.

[Angelus]

Originally posted by halfseminole:
Don't go with Grozer.  

  http://atarn.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=2689  

The biocomposites are fiberglass bows with horn-looking materials slapped on.  Csaba Grozer also owns a plastics company   http://naturcomposit.com/   that manufactures the "horn" but underneath it is fiberglass, and the siyahs are screwed on.

Atilla makes a you-finish horsebow that's had quite a few good reviews.  It's also well under your price range.

I shoot almost exclusively Asian myself.  Are you looking to shoot thumb style as well?

Im looking to shoot umb style for sure. Im not sure of my draw length using this technique. As far as bows go, it seems that the hwarang is very reccomended and i'm also looking at this.
 http://www.archers.co.kr/goods/view.php?seq=19

[el chupa nibre]

Originally posted by Pat B:
Check out huntworthyproductions  James Parker makes Asiatic horn bows of all flavors and also make them with glass or all natural materials.

Is James Parker still making these bows? I tried emailing him a few months back and never got any reply. I was really interested in ordering his "Coup de Grace" retro-styled recurve with siyah limbs. That bow looked absolutely killer!

[halfseminole]

What style thumb ring are you looking at?  I shoot exclusively thumb and make all my own rings, though the plastic ones available through Mariner are an excellent place to start.  A Hwarang should come with a sujakgi as well.  If one style doesn't suit you, another probably will.

[Nativestranger]

I have no problems with Grozer biocomposites and will heartily recommend them. Yes they are made with fibreglass reinforcement under horn and sinew plates and modern techniques but they made no pretence about using all natural materials in their literature. I have a biocomposite Assyrian that shoot fast, smooth and accurate with no shock at all.
Some will say that the horn and sinew are added as decoration but I have a glass wood laminated version Assyrian that's no slouch and the biocomposite version shoots faster at a lower draw weight and has less handshock.  
End of the day I don't really care what's the construction techniques used. Grozer's biocomposite looks and performs great that's good enough for me. Not to mention the unstrung shape, string tension and soft draw strongly mimics a real horn bow. I am not ready to pay $2500 and 2 years of waiting time for an all natural horn bow so I am happy with what Grozer offers.

[Pat B]

Paul, James is building a new shop and is talking about going full time making bows. He has been building Asiatic bows pretty steadily for the last few years but because of his other work hasn't been around much lately.    James is planning on being at the Tenn. Classic this year. I'm sure he will have at least a few Asiatic bows with him.

[Angelus]

I have my eye on the SMG laminated horn bows, It seems like they are a good rival for the hwarang and YMG. Anyone have any experiance with these?

[Angelus]

Originally posted by halfseminole:
What style thumb ring are you looking at?  I shoot exclusively thumb and make all my own rings, though the plastic ones available through Mariner are an excellent place to start.  A Hwarang should come with a sujakgi as well.  If one style doesn't suit you, another probably will.

I was thinking of using a vermil ring, or perhaps a manchu ring. Do you have any recommendations?

[KenH]

Like Half-seminole, I shoot and build almost exclusively Asian "horsebows" and their relatives.

Avoid Grozer for reasons stated above.

The best buy for the buck, IMHO, are the Cinnabar bows.   I've known Justin Ma through the Asian Traditional Archery site for many years. An honorable man and a smart businessman.

Saluki and some of the others are priced beyond the reach of mortal men.

[Angelus]

Originally posted by KenH:
Like Half-seminole, I shoot and build almost exclusively Asian "horsebows" and their relatives.

Avoid Grozer for reasons stated above.

The best buy for the buck, IMHO, are the Cinnabar bows.   I've known Justin Ma through the Asian Traditional Archery site for many years. An honorable man and a smart businessman.

Saluki and some of the others are priced beyond the reach of mortal men.

I was really considering cinnabar bows until i found Songmugung (SMG) bows. Apparently you have get a real carbon horn laminate bow for around $300, which is the same price for a bamboo laminate bow from cinnabar. ( although cinnabar bows look amazing ).

SMG wesbites.
 http://www.archers.co.kr/goods/view.php?seq=19
 http://www.smgung.co.kr/2010/english.htm

[JEFF B]

i shoot  a korean horse bow @50 and boy it spits out an arrow real quick they are the best little bow i have shot and value for money $150  NZ you can't go wrong with that.  

[tecum-tha]

1.) A grozer biocomposite contains modern materials. This is stated on their website.
2.) a Grozer Extra III was cut open/x-rayed and there they found the modern screws. On an Extra III there should not be any modern materials.
3.) When is comes to price/performance, then it is almost certainly a Korean bow.
I have two Hwarangs and prefer these, but the  next one would probably be a SMG.
I still want to find some heavier draw weights.
4.) A lot depends on your draw length and the kind of shooting you plan to do.
5.) I would stay away from anything with real horn unless you want to put it into the heat box any 5 days as SMG recommends.
6.) 95% of the shootability of a bow comes from the design of a bow, only the rest from materials.
(modern materials/wood etc.)
7.) The Korean bow forms are essentially perfected. There is so little improvement possible, that it requires more effort than gain.
8.) Saluki builds great bows, but availability and price are hardly worth it compared to the Korean bows. You can buy a Greattree Archery KTB for $270 any day you want in the US, or a SMG or Hwarang for about $300-350 within a few weeks.

[halfseminole]

The hot box isn't that great a deal, I just use the top of the closet for my horn bow.

[Nativestranger]

I have shot and owned all types of asian blows including Hwarang, Grozers, Akosbow and cheap chinese made horsebows. If you insist on a Korean bow, the Kaya KTB performs close to the Hwarang at a lower price. I have one and it's a good little bow. The korean bows are high performance bows but a little hard get good arrow flight with their low 5" brace height. Prepare to learn the thumb draw if shooting with the korean bows. With 3 finger draw there's quite a bit of finger pinch after 27" of draw.
 
The Akosbow laminated Turkish is another model I would recommend. It draws smooth and easy to shoot accurately. Even with 3 finger Mediterranean draw there's no finger pinch. Very affordable too. Many archers at our local club have switched to this bow from the Korean bows.

Grozer biocomposites. Somehow they attract alot of criticism on the web for their use of modern materials (which other bows like Hwarang also used) but otherwise they can be recommended. The Assyrian model performs the best. It has a large brace height easy to get great arrow flight and draws comfortably with 3 fingers to over 30 inch without stack. Another model I tested was the biocomposite Hungarian. This is one of the best looking horsebow on the web with its horn facings on the grip, siyahs and limb bellies. Despite the large siyahs it's surprisingly fast and very stable and easy to shoot.
The biocomposite Scythian is a new bow that I recently received and it has quickly become one of my favorite. Very similar shooting dynamics to the korean bows except larger brace height closer to 6" vs 5" for the korean bows and a little less twitchy due to higher bow mass. Surprising smooth draw for such a compact bow.


Scythian next to Assyrian unbraced
 
     

Assyrian braced